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Mt. Tabor High Shooting

handguns have no use in society. they should all be destroyed and no longer manufactured.
 
warak said:
you can legally buy a handgun from a unlicensed dealer (private) at 18, if memory serves, with no background check. I believe you can get a long-gun from a licensed dealer at 18 and no age limit from a unlicensed dealer.

it is harder to get booze, absolutely!

are you sure you are not just a troll poster?
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Private sales are regulated in NC, but I'm not sure about PA. For non-private sales, there is a federal handgun purchase ban for individuals who are between 18 and 20 years old. Very recently, in the Fourth Circuit (VA, WV, NC, SC, MD), that ban was overturned. However, my understanding is that it would still be applicable in circuits outside the Fourth, which would include PA. Unless you know of Third Circuit precedent that I don't.

Regardless, a background check has to happen with any handgun purchase, which I'm unaware of for alcohol. Further, in North Carolina, you would have to obtain a pistol purchase permit, which is an onerous process that used to be employed to prevent black people from owning guns ("character check").

I understand that there is an age restriction on the purchase of alcohol (which is another debate entirely). But that seems to track with the federal handgun-purchase-ban.

Given what I've said, I argue that it's disingenuous for you to say that it's easier to buy a handgun.
 
you're only talking about legal gun purchases

to use your example of Chicago, the streets have tons of guns that were not legally procured -- doesn't mean the guns don't exist
 
If you can’t put food on the table without hunting maybe it’s time for you to try a more agrarian society. I hear you that some people need guns to get food, but it probably would be easier for them to find other ways to get food than it will be for these families to get their dead children back.
 
I mean the data (Juice just posted a graph depicting it) shows that more guns in a society = more gun-related deaths in a society. That's not really even arguable.

So the only argument pro-gun people should be making is that the recreational/hunting/protection aspect of guns makes it worth the excess deaths caused by the guns. If you can't successfully make that argument, you should be for the decrease in the supply of guns in the country, through whatever means necessary to decrease the supply/availability.
 
ImTheCaptain said:
i grew up playing in the woods with a .22LR; I've owned handguns, shotguns and rifles though I'm down to just a shotgun and rifle at this point. I occasionally hunt as a social thing. I've been around guns and hunting my entire life. My BIL tags out and eats deer basically all year because he can, not because he needs to.

There are a handful of people who hunt to add some extra food to the table but again, that's a miniscule portion of the population and heavily regulating the use of firearms for such things is possible. MOdern crossbows are as or more effective than a rifle or shotgun at this point for most animals, if it's really about sustenance.

Guns are totally unnecessary in American life except as a pastime/hobby.
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I wonder if the "handful of people" that subsist on wild game are larger than the group of people who are killed by firearms. I don't know, but I bet the subsisters are a larger group of people. They'd just have to be > ~15,000.

57106294019b9.image.jpg


"According to the USDA's latest Household Food Insecurity in the United States report, more than 35 million people in the United States experienced hunger in 2019. Households with children are more likely to experience food insecurity."
 
If you take all the guns away I'm not gonna be able to drive to work without hitting roughly 15 deer.
 
Anyway the important thing is that the Responsible Firearm Owners are here, defending their fellow Firearm Owners Rights And Feelings, rather than deciding to actually do something about it and make contributions to one of these organizations. https://blog.greatnonprofits.org/9-organizations-making-progress-towards-gun-control/

If you can’t police the bad apples, eventually we will put every legal way to get guns out of business and force you to become felons to buy a gun. Make your choice but someday one of your people is going to go too far and shoot 1,000 people or something.
 
man, i hate these conversations. it's crazy how intractable gun advocates are
 
deacon14 said:
I mean the data (Juice just posted a graph depicting it) shows that more guns in a society = more gun-related deaths in a society. That's not really even arguable.

So the only argument pro-gun people should be making is that the recreational/hunting/protection aspect of guns makes it worth the excess deaths caused by the guns. If you can't successfully make that argument, you should be for the decrease in the supply of guns in the country, through whatever means necessary to decrease the supply/availability.
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That's the argument I was trying to make. The cost is worth the suppression of Government overreach and right to protect my family.
 
Donkey Deac Doug said:
I wonder if the "handful of people" that subsist on wild game are larger than the group of people who are killed by firearms. I don't know, but I bet the subsisters are a larger group of people. They'd just have to be > ~15,000.

57106294019b9.image.jpg


"According to the USDA's latest Household Food Insecurity in the United States report, more than 35 million people in the United States experienced hunger in 2019. Households with children are more likely to experience food insecurity."
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Guarantee you we can feed these people a lot easier than we can bring the dead back to life.
 
How many gun advocates are on this thread? Knight?
 
Donkey Deac Doug said:
I wonder if the "handful of people" that subsist on wild game are larger than the group of people who are killed by firearms. I don't know, but I bet the subsisters are a larger group of people. They'd just have to be > ~15,000.

"According to the USDA's latest Household Food Insecurity in the United States report, more than 35 million people in the United States experienced hunger in 2019. Households with children are more likely to experience food insecurity."
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society would benefit infinitely by banning their guns and just giving them money. no question
 
can you expand on the armed-citizenry-prevents-government-overreach arg you keep making
 
to gun people, the solution is always more guns. more guns to poor people so they can hunt. more guns to protect from gov't overreach. more guns to protect their families. nothing else can be done other than get more guns in more hands.
 
ImTheCaptain said:
man, i hate these conversations. it's crazy how intractable gun advocates are
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Trust me, we feel the same.

That's why one of my first posts was reflecting about how sad it is that the divide is this deep.

DeacDiggler said:
Anyway the important thing is that the Responsible Firearm Owners are here, defending their fellow Firearm Owners Rights And Feelings, rather than deciding to actually do something about it and make contributions to one of these organizations. https://blog.greatnonprofits.org/9-organizations-making-progress-towards-gun-control/

If you can’t police the bad apples, eventually we will put every legal way to get guns out of business and force you to become felons to buy a gun. Make your choice but someday one of your people is going to go too far and shoot 1,000 people or something.
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Dude, it's happened over-and-over in history. There will be a war. I hope it isn't in my lifetime. The people with the guns will have an advantage over those that do not. That's something that doesn't get spoken of in these debates enough, imo. If this pandemic has shown us anything, we are not some special advanced world immune to panic and war. Wars happen. If you want to have ANY hope of protecting yourself or your property, a well-armed populace is critical to that.
 
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