• Welcome to OGBoards 10.0, keep in mind that we will be making LOTS of changes to smooth out the experience here and make it as close as possible functionally to the old software, but feel free to drop suggestions or requests in the Tech Support subforum!

Kenneth Walker III Appreciation Thread

TimmyClutch said:
Maybe Clawson favors upper classmen, maybe he wanted to be a starter. KW3 had more yards in his first game at MSU then he ever did at Wake. He truly proved that he was deserving of being the starter. The fact we only won 4 games last year with him is disgusting. He is an NFL caliber RB, when you have that on the roster, you adjust your offense to maximize your strengths. Every week he is going to put up great numbers, and its gonna be like seeing your hot ex walk into a bar flirting with another dude.
Click to expand...

I bet he puts up good numbers but not every game this year.
 
Fans are right a lot. Ask yourself. When you heard Walker was leaving, you said to yourself, " Damn, of course he is. He was getting screwed." Same thing Walker thought. The difference in this and other high profile transfers seems quite clear.
 
Wake offense gets overrated by some in our fanbase. Offense yards per play is mediocre.
 
thatguy2016 said:
First, I really hate giving this stupid thread air. And I agree that Dave Clawson knows more about football than I ever will; therefore I give him latitude to run his program.

That said...WF scores a lot of points because we run a quick tempo and run a lot of plays. This in turn also tires the defense, and contributes to the track meet score-fests that don't always go in WF's favor.

In my opinion, running plays a high tempo also increases the likelihood that WF will face injuries, which have crippled the team in most recent seasons.

There is no perfect system for ranking offensive efficiency; however "points scored" is definitely not at the top of the list. Here's a site that evaluates overall Offensive Efficiency.

According to that site, comparing:

Northwestern
Boston College
Stanford
Wake Forest

from 2017-2020, Stanford has the best overall efficiency, and did so in 3 of the 4 years (BC and AJ Dillon were the most efficient in 2019). WF has not been the most efficient offense of those four schools in any of the four years.

Of course, I'm more concerned with W-L than points scored. The least efficient offense of those four has been Northwestern, but all they've done is go 29-19, reach their conference championship game twice, and finish ranked 3 of the 4 years. Pat Fitzgerald is doing something right.
Click to expand...

To expand on this, FO ranks our offense as follows:

2016- (7-6, bowl vs. Temple) 99th
2017- (8-5, ATM bowl) 21st
2018- (7-6, Memphis) 63rd
2019- 7-6 (MSU), 55th
2020- 3-5 (Wisconsin), 33rd

With the pandemic year, the average ranking is 54.2. Without it, it's 59.5. Without the pandemic year or 2016, it's 46.3.

Here are our recruiting rankings on 247:

2012- 66
2013- 65
2014- 67
2015- 51
2016- 57
2017- 68
2018- 64
2019- 59
2020- 60

Average ranking is 61.9, and rising marginally (59.8 over the last six years). I would further submit that most of our higher-rated talent, in terms of recruiting rankings, comes on the offensive side of the ball to begin with, but there's no way I know of to quantify or compare that to other teams' recruits.

Uncoincidentally, the recruiting rankings are fairly similar, with some level of overperformance. If recruiting rankings don't matter and Clawson consistently finds underrated offensive talent (as some on this thread contend), then I would expect our offense to outperform its recruiting rankings by roughly the amount shown here. If recruiting rankings don't matter, Clawson consistently finds underrated offensive talent and we do a better job of developing that talent, then I would expect our offense to outperform its recruiting rankings by more than the amount shown here. If rankings don't matter, Clawson finds talent, we develop that talent, and our system maximizes that talent, then I would expect our offense to be among the best in the country and to vastly outperform its recruiting rankings.

If we had talent, development, and system all on an elite level, we would have an elite offense. The results do not bear that out. Personally, I think we have slightly-above average talent (with Clawson's eye for talent lifting us slightly above our recruiting rankings), good development (seriously hindered by an inability to keep players like Dortch, Surratt, Newman, and Walker), and a slightly-above-average system. Put those together, and you have an above-average-to-good offense, which is pretty much what we've seen on the field lately.
 
OldGoldBeard said:
If we had talent, development, and system all on an elite level, we would have an elite offense. The results do not bear that out. Personally, I think we have slightly-above average talent (with Clawson's eye for talent lifting us slightly above our recruiting rankings), good development (seriously hindered by an inability to keep players like Dortch, Surratt, Newman, and Walker), and a slightly-above-average system. Put those together, and you have an above-average-to-good offense, which is pretty much what we've seen on the field lately.
Click to expand...

This is the biggest issue in my eyes. We got 1.5 seasons from Surratt, Dortch, and Newman, as well as 2 seasons (as a backup) for Walker. With the exception of Newman, the other guys were legit All-Acc type players. Its tough for Wake to go and find those guys, develop/maximize their abilities, and then get only portions of 2 years of benefit.
 
DeaconSig said:
This is the biggest issue in my eyes. We got 1.5 seasons from Surratt, Dortch, and Newman, as well as 2 seasons (as a backup) for Walker. With the exception of Newman, the other guys were legit All-Acc type players. Its tough for Wake to go and find those guys, develop/maximize their abilities, and then get only portions of 2 years of benefit.
Click to expand...

I don't think we can look at Dortch and Surratt as negatives though. They left to go to the next level. Now, maybe they received some bad advice or whatever from someone, but if a player has played well enough to think they have a shot at leaving early for the NFL that only means they've done some good things for us. Surratt would've played last year if not for Covid, it sucked, but it was what is was. Losing really good players to other programs is never a good thing though.
 
The weird thing about this transfer is that we usually have some inkling/leaks as to why the player left, but with this, none. Also, how much does it suck to lose the following guys:

- 2019: Dortch (for UDFA/PS)

- 2020: Newman (transfer to UDFA)

- 2020: Surratt (UDFA/PS)

- 2020/2021: KW3 (Transfer)

- 2021: Donavon Greene (injury)

In theory, all of those guys could be on this team. Though I think Dortch would be a 6th year senior if my math/covid rules are right.
 
OldGoldBeard said:
If we had talent, development, and system all on an elite level, we would have an elite offense. The results do not bear that out. Personally, I think we have slightly-above average talent (with Clawson's eye for talent lifting us slightly above our recruiting rankings), good development (seriously hindered by an inability to keep players like Dortch, Surratt, Newman, and Walker), and a slightly-above-average system. Put those together, and you have an above-average-to-good offense, which is pretty much what we've seen on the field lately.
Click to expand...

Doesn't that show how few certifiable legit NFL level players we have on offense, so if there is one on the roster, you should center the offense around that player? The last offensive skill player drafted was Camp in 2014. If Walker continues to play at the level we believe he will, then he will be one. There were times last year where we all wondered why Walker wasn't getting the ball more, and he had to have thought the same thing.

You can be happy with Clawson as a coach and still think of him as fallible. This is one situation he likely handled incorrectly and we lost a true talent because of it.
 
Ball State Deac said:
The weird thing about this transfer is that we usually have some inkling/leaks as to why the player left, but with this, none. Also, how much does it suck to lose the following guys:

- 2019: Dortch (for UDFA/PS)

- 2020: Newman (transfer to UDFA)

- 2020: Surratt (UDFA/PS)

- 2020/2021: KW3 (Transfer)

- 2021: Donavon Greene (injury)

In theory, all of those guys could be on this team. Though I think Dortch would be a 6th year senior if my math/covid rules are right.
Click to expand...

Yes. So would Newman.
 
TimmyClutch said:
Doesn't that show how few certifiable legit NFL level players we have on offense, so if there is one on the roster, you should center the offense around that player? The last offensive skill player drafted was Camp in 2014. If Walker continues to play at the level we believe he will, then he will be one. There were times last year where we all wondered why Walker wasn't getting the ball more, and he had to have thought the same thing.

You can be happy with Clawson as a coach and still think of him as fallible. This is one situation he likely handled incorrectly and we lost a true talent because of it.
Click to expand...

The "Walker not getting the ball more" is a questionable narrative, and certainly has not been explained as the reason for his departure. In 2020, Walker played in 7 games. He didn't play after the COVID outbreak after the UNC game that cancelled the Miami, ND and FSU games. Sounded like KW3 was one of the Deacs that tested positive in November, and he never played again. Walker didn't play in against L'ville or Wisconsin because he wasn't available. That's why CBS ended up with more carries on the season.

Not counting Campbell, which was essentially a scrimmage, in the 6 ACC games in which Walker was available to play, he had 92 carries. CBS had 64 carries. So, Walker had the vast majority of the PT in the competitive games that he was available to play. Further, every program rotates their backs to keep the RBs fresh. Had KW3 gotten more carries the narrative would have been that Walker transferred because he was over-used. KW3 had 13 TDs in 7 games; so, not only did Walker get the majority of carries in the games he played, he got the ball when WF was in scoring position.

Not sure what season people watched last year, but in the competitive WF games when Walker was available, he got the ball a ton (27 carries against NC State, 23 carries against VT, 23 carries against UVA, 13 carries and a reception against UNC). Walker had fewer carries against Clemson and Cuse, because neither game was in doubt in the 2nd half. I wish Walker had stayed, and I'm guessing if not for the COVID pause during which he was sent home, he would have stayed, but looking at how the games played out, they don't fit the narrative that the staff kept KW3 on the sidelines.
 
DeaconSig said:
This is the biggest issue in my eyes. We got 1.5 seasons from Surratt, Dortch, and Newman, as well as 2 seasons (as a backup) for Walker. With the exception of Newman, the other guys were legit All-Acc type players. Its tough for Wake to go and find those guys, develop/maximize their abilities, and then get only portions of 2 years of benefit.
Click to expand...

You forgot the counter examples like Basham, Ejiefor, Serigne, the O-linemen who are now on NFL teams or PS. It's not all doom and gloom with all of our star developmental players leaving early or transferring.
 
DeaconSig said:
This is the biggest issue in my eyes. We got 1.5 seasons from Surratt, Dortch, and Newman, as well as 2 seasons (as a backup) for Walker. With the exception of Newman, the other guys were legit All-Acc type players. Its tough for Wake to go and find those guys, develop/maximize their abilities, and then get only portions of 2 years of benefit.
Click to expand...

Newman was an All-ACC type too.

On the other hand, we have less hyped players like Wolford, Bachman, and now Roberson who are productive 5 year players. Roberson is an All-ACC type.
 
Last edited:
Roberson could have gone anywhere in the country after last season. Wisconsin's defense was #1 in the country for most of last year, and they had no answer for him.
 
Neurodeac said:
You forgot the counter examples like Basham, Ejiefor, Serigne, the O-linemen who are now on NFL teams or PS. It's not all doom and gloom with all of our star developmental players leaving early or transferring.
Click to expand...

No, I didn't. I pointed out that we had really talented guys that left early, and that those guys leaving early made it more difficult to win games. I don't think it is controversial to say that 1-2 more years of Dortch/Sage/Newman/Walker may have lead to Wake winning more games.
 
He only played 1/2 a game vs Youngstown State but on 7 carries still averaged 8 yards a carry.
MSU 42 YSU 14
 
80deacon said:
He only played 1/2 a game vs Youngstown State but on 7 carries still averaged 8 yards a carry.
MSU 42 YSU 14
Click to expand...

And wasn't even close to their leading rusher. Poor guy had to share carries. Hope he doesn't leave
 
Does KWIII really develop better at MSU for an NFL career than at WF?
Does Newman really develop better at Georgia for an NFL career than at WF?

Answer to second question is in but answer to first is very debatable. CBS may have the best answer before it’s over.
 
Next game up - MSU vs Miami. Miami is a 6 point favorite. Will be interesting to see how KW does. Fairly high profile game.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top