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Dick Vitale Hangs Up On Dan LeBatard Show

what'd he say?

I am paraphrasing (RJ will have to supply more accurate verbiage). It was something to the effect that all of the adulation and reverence people were giving Prosser needed to be tempered by the fact that there are no virgins in basketball and that every coach cheats at some point.

Like I said, the timing was pretty fucked up.
 
rj then posted an e-mail conversation with Ryan in which Ryan eventually threw up the white flag. It was awesome.
 
I am paraphrasing (RJ will have to supply more accurate verbiage). It was something to the effect that all of the adulation and reverence people were giving Prosser needed to be tempered by the fact that there are no virgins in basketball and that every coach cheats at some point.

Like I said, the timing was pretty fucked up.

My comment has nothing to do with the comment about Skip (I remember it well, though), but, when folks are discussing some current cheating scandal, whether it be UNC, USC, Ohio St, Miami, or whatever - someone inevitably makes a comment along the lines of "well, everyone does it".

When they do I want to punch them... in the neck... really hard.

No, everyone does NOT do it. It being cheating in order to gain an advantage. Sure, maybe every (or almost every) program has some incidental and accidental brushes with the complicated NCAA regulations. That has nothing to do with this conversation. This conversation is about programs with major, repeated violations - programs which demonstrate a pattern of disregard for (or at least a major lack of focus on) the rules.

Saying "everyone does it" is for the lazy, the morally bankrupt, the guilty.

And, by the way, my strong reaction to this type of defense is not based on some blind, naive faith that my school is innocent of any offenses. I think we are - I hope we are - I believe that our coaches and our administration creates the proper environment to discourage such behavior. But, if a major controversy hit tomorrow at WFU, while I would be surprised, I would not pass out in shock.

I just think that saying "everyone does it" in this context is even more idiotic than telling your parents that "everyone does it" when you get caught smoking pot. Sure, lots of kids are doing it - maybe everyone you know does it - maybe everyone you think is "cool" does it. But, you know what, it is still against the law and everyone most certainly is not doing it.
 
The subsequent problem is that many fans of cheat-to-win programs while not liking the scandal, wouldn't trade the results.
 
I want to cheat and win a NC.

I don't care if they "nullify" it 6 years later.

Do you really think USC people care? HELL 2 da naw.

WE OWE IT TO THEM!
 
I want to cheat and win a NC.

I don't care if they "nullify" it 6 years later.

Do you really think USC people care? HELL 2 da naw.

WE OWE IT TO THEM!

I think this sentiment is more true than most of us would be willing to admit.

Think about it. Let's say Wake wins a NC in 2012. They do this because somehow they got a top 10 recruiting class. Unbeknownst to us each of those players was paid $50K to come to Wake, but we don't find that out until 2018. We get to enjoy a NC in 2012 and seriously none of us know anything shady is going on. It's the biggest boards party every and its awesome.

6 years later we find out about the payments. We are all outraged (and rightfully so). The nation is outraged. How could this happen? The NCAA vacates the 2012 national championship. The banner comes down. Everyone is sad. BUT ALL OF US STILL REMEMBER WINNING A NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP! The memories of celebrating with your friends, winning another ACCC, going out to Pasadena for the game, all of that stuff still happened for us.

I'm sure this makes me sound terrible. I don't actually want it to happen. I'm just saying that if it did happen, and no one found out until much later, it wouldn't significantly alter all the awesome memories we'd have of winning that NC. It'd be a terrible black mark on the school and I really don't want to see that, but the NCAA stripping us of the title wouldn't make me feel any worse about it.

If we were cheating and I was the only one who knew about it I don't think I could really enjoy it. But if no one knew, and I didn't know, I could enjoy it and be outraged later.
 
Except that if you've cheated, you didn't actually win the title. It's like Little League. If they've got players who are actually 18 or older, they didn't legitimately win the title. Trying to justify it otherwise reflects more on the fan than the reality.
 
Except that if you've cheated, you didn't actually win the title. It's like Little League. If they've got players who are actually 18 or older, they didn't legitimately win the title. Trying to justify it otherwise reflects more on the fan than the reality.

You may not have actually won, but you remember all the experiences that went along with winning. That was my point.
 
I think this sentiment is more true than most of us would be willing to admit.

Think about it. Let's say Wake wins a NC in 2012. They do this because somehow they got a top 10 recruiting class. Unbeknownst to us each of those players was paid $50K to come to Wake, but we don't find that out until 2018. We get to enjoy a NC in 2012 and seriously none of us know anything shady is going on. It's the biggest boards party every and its awesome.

6 years later we find out about the payments. We are all outraged (and rightfully so). The nation is outraged. How could this happen? The NCAA vacates the 2012 national championship. The banner comes down. Everyone is sad. BUT ALL OF US STILL REMEMBER WINNING A NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP! The memories of celebrating with your friends, winning another ACCC, going out to Pasadena for the game, all of that stuff still happened for us.

I'm sure this makes me sound terrible. I don't actually want it to happen. I'm just saying that if it did happen, and no one found out until much later, it wouldn't significantly alter all the awesome memories we'd have of winning that NC. It'd be a terrible black mark on the school and I really don't want to see that, but the NCAA stripping us of the title wouldn't make me feel any worse about it.

If we were cheating and I was the only one who knew about it I don't think I could really enjoy it. But if no one knew, and I didn't know, I could enjoy it and be outraged later.

This post captures a lot of truth, but it only highlights what a joke the NCAA is at this point. Behind closed doors, the NCAA would absolutely subscribe to this logic. If you don't think so, give me a straight faced argument for them allowing Pryor to play in the Sugar Bowl. With due respect to President Clinton, the NCAA's credibility is biggest fairytale I've ever heard.
 
Except that if you've cheated, you didn't actually win the title. It's like Little League. If they've got players who are actually 18 or older, they didn't legitimately win the title. Trying to justify it otherwise reflects more on the fan than the reality.

I understand what you're saying and you are correct from a moral perspective, but the NCAA doesn't practice the lofty ideals their missions require. They're whores, plain and simple. Newton got to play in the BCS game, Pryor got to play in the Sugar Bowl, and the NCAA had MORE than enough information to declare them permanently ineligible.

Shapiro said he had to concoct what has been described as the biggest scandal in NCAA history just to try to compete with what the SEC was doing. Colt McCoy's girlfriend flat out says Texas players get paid.

What does the NCAA do? I'll wash Mark Emmert's car if ESPN ever lets Texas gets investigated. While Newton and Pryor are winning BCS games, the NCAA suspends ACC players for not reimbursing their former teammates for rides to the airport and failing to reimburse them for letting them sleep on their couch. Of course.
 
ESPN is part of the problem, and they want to sweep crap like the UM mess under the rug. For goodness sakes, it took Yahoo Sports to blow this story out. ESPN gets big payola from college sports and they want to create a myth that its all good.
 
Personally, between (i) we graduate all of our players, create exemplary students and citizens, recruit within the rules and go 2-9 every year and (ii) we have great success and win championships but end up with major recruiting scandals and NCAA penalties... I'd pick (i) every time and twice on Sunday.
 
You may not have actually won, but you remember all the experiences that went along with winning. That was my point.

Something doesn't add up there. Yeah, I get what you're saying but it's still like trying to celebrate Christmas on June 25th.

jhmd: I completely agree. The NCAA is like the kid whose dad owns the company you work for. He's a scrawny little shit and buddies up with certain people while snitching to his pops on others. He can't really do much on his own but like to talk tough.
 
Weiner asked a stupid, douchebag question. Love or hate Dick Vitale, I can't fault him for refusing to give any more of his time to a dumba** sports radio hack.

lol

Vitale.

LeBatard is just an annoying goofball.

you don't get the show

What is embarrassing is how the producer and LeBatard are scared they are going to get in trouble with ESPN for making Vitale mad.

you don't get the show

I'm fascinated by LeBatard. His show is pretty good. I started subscribing to the podcast and listening to it most days. On the surface he seems like he might just be a really loud blowhard but more often than not he's (a little too?) reflective and introspective.

finally a good take

This entire Matty Ice interview is perhaps our best work at the 14:00 mark, the 19:00 mark is incredible

http://www.espn.com/espnradio/play?id=17595978
 
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I think this sentiment is more true than most of us would be willing to admit.

Think about it. Let's say Wake wins a NC in 2012. They do this because somehow they got a top 10 recruiting class. Unbeknownst to us each of those players was paid $50K to come to Wake, but we don't find that out until 2018. We get to enjoy a NC in 2012 and seriously none of us know anything shady is going on. It's the biggest boards party every and its awesome.

6 years later we find out about the payments. We are all outraged (and rightfully so). The nation is outraged. How could this happen? The NCAA vacates the 2012 national championship. The banner comes down. Everyone is sad. BUT ALL OF US STILL REMEMBER WINNING A NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP! The memories of celebrating with your friends, winning another ACCC, going out to Pasadena for the game, all of that stuff still happened for us.

I'm sure this makes me sound terrible. I don't actually want it to happen. I'm just saying that if it did happen, and no one found out until much later, it wouldn't significantly alter all the awesome memories we'd have of winning that NC. It'd be a terrible black mark on the school and I really don't want to see that, but the NCAA stripping us of the title wouldn't make me feel any worse about it.

If we were cheating and I was the only one who knew about it I don't think I could really enjoy it. But if no one knew, and I didn't know, I could enjoy it and be outraged later.

Aside from the moral issues there is a practical problem with this plan. Cheating doesn't guarantee a national championship. Kentucky, whether they cheat or not, has the pick of each recruiting class but does not win the NC every year. Cheating to the degree that would give you a chance for an NC would almost certainly be found out at a small school like Wake and probably before the NC happens. Would you feel the same way if the cheating only gets you to the championship game? The final four? The round of 8? and yet your schools reputation goes down in flames? Does anybody remember that Western Kentucky got to the final four only to have it vacated for recruiting violations surrounding Jim McDaniels? Does anybody consider Western Kentucky a relevant basketball power because of that one tarnished achievement?
 
Solid thread bump.

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I'd hand up on LeBatard, too.

And I get the show. Its stupid and he's annoying.
 
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