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Time to grow up

morrison2951 said:
Requires flops and good floor slapping technique....
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Yeah, that's how the guy won 5 NCAA Championships, 13 ACC Championships and 1,059 games...by teaching his players how to slap the floor.

Says a guy from a school that has been to exactly 1 Final Four in the entire 79-year history of the NCAA Tournament. We should show him how it's supposed to be done.
 
daaberry said:
This is absolute truth, but Wake's issue thus far is they haven't come across a superior opponent that has had a bad game (maybe Miami). To have last night happen isn't shocking, but that needs to be balanced out w/ a game like FSU or Notre Dame where they don't find their rhythm & Wake wins.
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But F$U and ND are terrible match-ups for us. We have no one to cover their best players. And their best players have a lot of experience. And they each had multiple guys at our weakest positions.

It would be one thing if each team had one guy we couldn't cover. Then, that person could have a bad game and we could win, but ND and F$U each have multiple guys in that situation.

Our guys have played their hearts out and for the most part played very smart bball. But we just don't have the horses quite yet. It's also too bad that we won't have JC back next year, when we could be a legitimate threat for the Sweet 16.
 
BudatWake said:
I wish this was just one bad game. But we have had several bad games. We have led in a number of our losses and just flat out collapsed. It is a lack of will. We need guys to decide to play tough defense. Yes there are match up problems, but playing good defense is often a matter of committing to it every time down the floor. We defended no one the first half. The team needs to toughen up as does the coaching staff.
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The characteristic problem this year has been having a lead and failing to keep it late in games. That's a floor leadership problem. The team is pretty much led by Collins and Crawford, and to some extent Childress...two sophs and a freshman....and they haven't taken over enough at the end to close out games.

We haven't seen a game like last night all season.
 
Yeah but the Suns aren't a good matchup for the Spurs. NC St shouldn't beat Duke at Cameron. Virginia shouldn't lose to Pitt. BC shouldn't beat Cuse by 30. NC shouldn't get beat down by G Tech. Wake dominates GT but has no chance vs FSU although GT was able to hold them to 15 pts at halftime in a blowout.

Reality is that Wake has not been able to steal a win or 2 that they technically shouldn't have won & that appears to potentially be the difference of a tournament bid or not one. If they just held on to the Clemson & Duke leads then the discussion would be about seeding & not whether or not they get a bid.
 
bobknightfan said:
Sound defense requires intensity, desire & sound fundamentals.....and all of those things begin with a head coach who instills the value of those things in his players as a priority.

I can immediately think of two coaches who excelled at that....and that is one big reason why they have won 8 NCAA Championships, 24 Conference Championships and 1,961 games.
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I've watched this team get more fundamentally sound all season, and individually improve quite a bit. So making blanket statements implying Manning doesn't value intensity, desire and sound fundamentals is pretty lame. It doesn't really match what we're seeing.

Your namesake didn't believe it was a will to win that made a team successful, it was the will to prepare to win. One has to wonder, without top recruits and massively curtailed practice time limiting preparation, how successful those two coaches would be in this day and age........turning around a team like Wake. I doubt it would be much faster.

I assume you don't drive at all over the speed limit and break those rules society lets you get away with these days...amirite? No "8 and your great, 9 your mine" for bobby.
 
pourdeac said:
I've watched this team get more fundamentally sound all season, and individually improve quite a bit. So making blanket statements implying Manning doesn't value intensity, desire and sound fundamentals is pretty lame. It doesn't really match what we're seeing.

Your namesake didn't believe it was a will to win that made a team successful, it was the will to prepare to win. One has to wonder, without top recruits and massively curtailed practice time limiting preparation, how successful those two coaches would be in this day and age........turning around a team like Wake. I doubt it would be much faster.

I assume you don't drive at all over the speed limit and break those rules society lets you get away with these days...amirite? No "8 and your great, 9 your mine" for bobby.
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The year before Coach Knight arrived at Texas Tech the Red Raiders were 3-13 in the Big 12. Knight only had 4 remaining players off that roster. Not 4 starters....4 total players, of which 2 were starters. Also, he wasn't hired until after the season ended...too late to recruit high school seniors for the upcoming year.

Knight took those two starters, added a couple of walk-ons & a couple of JC transfers and won 23 games and made the NCAA Tournament as a #6 seed in his very first year at Lubbock.
 
Lohengrin said:
tigerswood, do you believe this is "a good team"? Newsflash: You are what your record says you are.

Hoopheads like you really, really need to come down to Earth and realize what kind of a program we [don't] have.
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I never said we are a good team. I think we're an average ACC team that has had extremely competitive, if not often disappointing, games. We are an above average offensive team, and a below average defensive team. It's not rocket surgery. We also have an exciting, young nucleus, and should be poised to be a top 20 team next year, if Collins somehow returns.

You're statement that we've "had a lot of games like last night" this season is just flat out wrong. We've been blown out once before last night (if you consider it a blowout), and that was to the defending NCAA champions and possible #1 overall seed.
 
tigerswood said:
I never said we are a good team. I think we're an average ACC team that has had extremely competitive, if not often disappointing, games. We are an above average offensive team, and a below average defensive team. It's not rocket surgery. We also have an exciting, young nucleus, and should be poised to be a top 20 team next year, if Collins somehow returns.

You're statement that we've "had a lot of games like last night" this season is just flat out wrong. We've been blown out once before last night (if you consider it a blowout), and that was to the defending NCAA champions and possible #1 overall seed.
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No, it's not. It's true, and those not blinded by "whatever" realize it. Your faulty reliance on this score distracts your attention from scoreboard. The implosions this year have been rampant; last night was just a more complete lack of effort all the way through. More of the same, undisciplined, lazy behavior we've shown when the game's on the line. This isn't how winners play, and this team will never be winners. BKF has had this team nailed from the beginning. Thank god I haven't wasted very much time with them. It's going to take a while for the "dreamers" to catch up.
 
morrison2951 said:
Rocket surgery?? :eek:
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Brain scientist

This notion that we have t gotten a break is absurd. Dook was in disarray and we had them right where we wanted them our defense just fell apart and we got them back on track. ND was in trouble they didn't come out and light it up until our defense failed again. We had our chances we just let teams off the. Anvas

We haven't won at dook in 20 years. Last years 8 point loss is the closest we've come since then. If we want a big win we have to go get it not hope a team lays down for us
 
Lohengrin said:
No, it's not. It's true, and those not blinded by "whatever" realize it. Your faulty reliance on this score distracts your attention from scoreboard. The implosions this year have been rampant; last night was just a more complete lack of effort all the way through. More of the same, undisciplined, lazy behavior we've shown when the game's on the line. This isn't how winners play, and this team will never be winners. BKF has had this team nailed from the beginning. Thank god I haven't wasted very much time with them. It's going to take a while for the "dreamers" to catch up.
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Seriously. Your meds may need adjusting.
 
Lohengrin said:
No, it's not. It's true, and those not blinded by "whatever" realize it. Your faulty reliance on this score distracts your attention from scoreboard. The implosions this year have been rampant; last night was just a more complete lack of effort all the way through. More of the same, undisciplined, lazy behavior we've shown when the game's on the line. This isn't how winners play, and this team will never be winners. BKF has had this team nailed from the beginning. Thank god I haven't wasted very much time with them. It's going to take a while for the "dreamers" to catch up.
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yes, thank god you haven't wasted very much time with them.
 
bobknightfan said:
The year before Coach Knight arrived at Texas Tech the Red Raiders were 3-13 in the Big 12. Knight only had 4 remaining players off that roster. Not 4 starters....4 total players, of which 2 were starters. Also, he wasn't hired until after the season ended...too late to recruit high school seniors for the upcoming year.

Knight took those two starters, added a couple of walk-ons & a couple of JC transfers and won 23 games and made the NCAA Tournament as a #6 seed in his very first year at Lubbock.
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LOL....well he did a hell of a job....17 years ago when the practice rules were laxer, in a much weaker conference, inheriting Andy Ellis and Big12 scoring phenom Andre Emmett (4th all time Big 12), and able to fill in with JUCO transfers like Kasib Powell (15/6 production). Very Buzz Williams-like isn't it (without the scoring phenom). They also got crushed in the first round as a #6.

So riffing on your astute observation......without inheriting a superstar who stayed for 4 years, able to get JUCOs, more limited practice, and in a tougher conference....I seriously doubt he would be doing much better at Wake than Manning in year 3....just like Buzz Williams.

And well well well....KenPom #28 in his 3rd year...just 5 spots higher than we are right now. He was in the 28-32 range his first 4 years and then cratered. He never really improved which is kind of odd.
 
Winning on the road is the next big step of a culture of losing. I think we will get there.
 
I guess we should not worry this much about the team's performance. If winning is important to them, they need to find a way to win-- if being close is enough so be it
 
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