• Welcome to OGBoards 10.0, keep in mind that we will be making LOTS of changes to smooth out the experience here and make it as close as possible functionally to the old software, but feel free to drop suggestions or requests in the Tech Support subforum!

Danny Manning Credibility Watch

This is what I mean when I say we don’t speak the same language. I’m very much interested in debating - it’s why we come on these boards - and I’m very open to your viewpoint. You think Manning deserves more time and he might do wondrous things. I respect that. Maybe I’m wrong and he will. Whereas you’ve simply stated those opinions are different from yours regarding Manning aren’t even valid. Not even debatable. So no, I don’t think you know what debate is. Been a strange phenomenon, having someone repeatedly - I mean, repeatedly - remind me I couldn’t have my opinion about Manning, in the face of clear concerns. It’s an opinion, a speculation. Yep, I’ll keep having it. It’s valid. Many of us share it. You can keep disagreeing with it. Totally cool. But the “you can’t even hold this opinion” is what has perpetually amused me. Yes, I can. I will. Everything will be alright.

Go Deacs! Big win tonight! UNCG! Four guard lineups FTW!
 
Per KP after tonight’s game, Wake has the 35th best offense to go along with the 201st rated D.
 
DeacDaddy said:
This is what I mean when I say we don’t speak the same language. I’m very much interested in debating - it’s why we come on these boards - and I’m very open to your viewpoint. You think Manning deserves more time and he might do wondrous things. I respect that. Maybe I’m wrong and he will. Whereas you’ve simply stated those opinions are different from yours regarding Manning aren’t even valid. Not even debatable. So no, I don’t think you know what debate is. Been a strange phenomenon, having someone repeatedly - I mean, repeatedly - remind me I couldn’t have my opinion about Manning, in the face of clear concerns. It’s an opinion, a speculation. Yep, I’ll keep having it. It’s valid. Many of us share it. You can keep disagreeing with it. Totally cool. But the “you can’t even hold this opinion” is what has perpetually amused me. Yes, I can. I will. Everything will be alright.

Go Deacs! Big win tonight! UNCG! Four guard lineups FTW!
Click to expand...

Sound is the word you are looking for, and of course I don’t think your argument is sound or I’d agree with it. You can hold whatever opinion you want but that opinion is either correct or not, well founded or not. Time will tell whether your position is correct, I’m confident it is not well founded.

And fwiw if you are going to put words in someone’s mouth to build yourself a straw man, do a better job knocking it down.
 
DeacDaddy said:
This is what I mean when I say we don’t speak the same language. I’m very much interested in debating - it’s why we come on these boards - and I’m very open to your viewpoint. You think Manning deserves more time and he might do wondrous things. I respect that. Maybe I’m wrong and he will. Whereas you’ve simply stated those opinions are different from yours regarding Manning aren’t even valid. Not even debatable. So no, I don’t think you know what debate is. Been a strange phenomenon, having someone repeatedly - I mean, repeatedly - remind me I couldn’t have my opinion about Manning, in the face of clear concerns. It’s an opinion, a speculation. Yep, I’ll keep having it. It’s valid. Many of us share it. You can keep disagreeing with it. Totally cool. But the “you can’t even hold this opinion” is what has perpetually amused me. Yes, I can. I will. Everything will be alright.

Go Deacs! Big win tonight! UNCG! Four guard lineups FTW!
Click to expand...

Where has anyone told you this? What thread are you reading?
 
Not even kidding, when I read DeacDaddy posts it's Bob Ross's voice I hear. We all have happy little opinions and they're all equally beautiful.
 
RChildress107 said:
Sound is the word you are looking for, and of course I don’t think your argument is sound or I’d agree with it. You can hold whatever opinion you want but that opinion is either correct or not, well founded or not. Time will tell whether your position is correct, I’m confident it is not well founded.
Click to expand...
There, that’s debate. That is like a breath of fresh air. Well done.

On to March 2019.
 
Last year became a lot of fun watching us get better and JC making everyone around him better. Still our inability to finish games like Duke likely cost us a real tournament invitation. Season ended with folks excited and then JC leaves which DM should have known in Jan. Dino leaves which shocked us all. So here we are in year 4 with pro and anti DM opinions being expressed which is what a message board is for.

There are two areas to look at...one very close to factual and the other based on Wake BB over last 7 years, DM in year 4 and our first 6 games.

First area that most should agree as fact:

Unlike Bizz our students and fans really like DM and want him to stay here and win championships
DM is an active part of the school and supports all our teams
DM is not going to be fired during the season or after the season
DM will absolutely get one more year no matter what happens this year
DM in year 4 does not have Wake at a place where we are competing for any type of championship

Things that are currently being debated and inspiring spirited debate:

DM has us on the right track and in year 5 we start competing for championships - my opinion is that won’t happen...conf is too strong and we’re too far behind
Some say that even though the year has started 2-4 against not one team of any note Danny will coach them up and postseason is still a possibility - my opinion is our postseason chances never existed this year and the first 6 games have validated the point
We discuss if Danny can or can’t coach - for me that’s a waste of breath because I just want Wake Forest to go to the postseason more years than not like we once did, be ranked every now and then and make the semifinals of the ACC tournament...even win one in the next 5 years. Please don’t argue about DM’s coaching over these last 6 scrimmages... let’s argue about how great a coach he is when we come back to beat UNC after being down 10 late or how he coached poorly when we were up 6 on VA and lost. 2-6 right now goes beyond bad coaching given who we’ve played. 2-6 sucks the life out of the program and makes for a lot of empty seats.

RC defends DM well and maybe next year the magic returns, we’re ranked and make the dance with ease...it’s possible.

For this year I believe we’re done and will have nights where the top half of the conference will bring the pain...the ACC is that good this year.

For anyone who believes we can turn this around...get to 9-9...be on the bubble, beat Duke or UNC you’re essentially asking that we follow up the 54 we shot on the front side with a smooth 3 under 33 on the back side.

Bottom line we all have opinions on this board...next year my hopes are high for DM and team...this year I’ll watch from a distance and just not be vested...much less stressful that way.
 
Shake said:
be ranked every now and then and make the semifinals of the ACC tournament.
Click to expand...

Not sure if these are connected but we've made the semi's 13 times in 43 years.

In the last 43 yearss

Tacy 5 semi's
Stack 1 semi
Odom 4 semi's
Prosser 3 semi's
Gaudi 0
Bzzz 0
Manning 0

And 3 of those were with Duncan on the team. We've never been a good ACCT team.
 
Ranked and making semis were both meant to imply every now and then.

I’d also take making the postseason like GDO did
 
Shake said:
Last year became a lot of fun watching us get better and JC making everyone around him better. Still our inability to finish games like Duke likely cost us a real tournament invitation. Season ended with folks excited and then JC leaves which DM should have known in Jan. Dino leaves which shocked us all. So here we are in year 4 with pro and anti DM opinions being expressed which is what a message board is for.

There are two areas to look at...one very close to factual and the other based on Wake BB over last 7 years, DM in year 4 and our first 6 games.

First area that most should agree as fact:

Unlike Bizz our students and fans really like DM and want him to stay here and win championships
DM is an active part of the school and supports all our teams
DM is not going to be fired during the season or after the season
DM will absolutely get one more year no matter what happens this year
DM in year 4 does not have Wake at a place where we are competing for any type of championship

Things that are currently being debated and inspiring spirited debate:

DM has us on the right track and in year 5 we start competing for championships - my opinion is that won’t happen...conf is too strong and we’re too far behind
Some say that even though the year has started 2-4 against not one team of any note Danny will coach them up and postseason is still a possibility - my opinion is our postseason chances never existed this year and the first 6 games have validated the point
We discuss if Danny can or can’t coach - for me that’s a waste of breath because I just want Wake Forest to go to the postseason more years than not like we once did, be ranked every now and then and make the semifinals of the ACC tournament...even win one in the next 5 years. Please don’t argue about DM’s coaching over these last 6 scrimmages... let’s argue about how great a coach he is when we come back to beat UNC after being down 10 late or how he coached poorly when we were up 6 on VA and lost. 2-6 right now goes beyond bad coaching given who we’ve played. 2-6 sucks the life out of the program and makes for a lot of empty seats.

RC defends DM well and maybe next year the magic returns, we’re ranked and make the dance with ease...it’s possible.

For this year I believe we’re done and will have nights where the top half of the conference will bring the pain...the ACC is that good this year.

For anyone who believes we can turn this around...get to 9-9...be on the bubble, beat Duke or UNC you’re essentially asking that we follow up the 54 we shot on the front side with a smooth 3 under 33 on the back side.

Bottom line we all have opinions on this board...next year my hopes are high for DM and team...this year I’ll watch from a distance and just not be vested...much less stressful that way.
Click to expand...

This is a pretty good post. It still gives way to much credence to six games and puts too much importance on incremental progress during the rebuild, but overall there is a lot I agree with.

FWIW, I don’t think anyone still thinks we can make the NCAA tournament this year. I do think Manning will turn things around and get us to 16-17 wins. The only thing I really care about this year is whether he has the team in a place in February such that all it needs to compete for championships in 2019 is an influx of talent at key positions. He actually had us there last February before losing Collins and Dinos.

That’s the nature of a rebuild. It’s nice, and important, to taste success as you build the baseline level of talent back up, but too much success can cause you to lose some of that talent without a replacement in place. Rebuilding teams, by their nature, aren’t capable of replacing top level talent.
 
RChildress107 said:
I’m honestly confused as to what you think has been happening on this thread the past few pages.
Click to expand...

Okay. I’m referring to our discussions going back to last season. I realize this thread would have popped up again this year regardless, because that’s the nature of the boards. I would have been glad to see it no longer needed. But it’s a debate that is unfortunately worth having. And nobody expected the debate to crop up again as a result of the particular losses we suffered. Inexcusable. I’m really hoping there is some resolve among players and staff not to let November, even if it’s put us back, entirely determine our fate this year. Illinois will be a good test.
 
Deac83 said:
Not sure if these are connected but we've made the semi's 13 times in 43 years.

In the last 43 yearss

Tacy 5 semi's
Stack 1 semi
Odom 4 semi's
Prosser 3 semi's
Gaudi 0
Bzzz 0
Manning 0

And 3 of those were with Duncan on the team. We've never been a good ACCT team.
Click to expand...

Actually all 4 of GDOs were with Tim.

Tacy reached the semis 5 out of 13. Skip was 3 for 6.

Until Skip's death, we we 13/35 in the semis, which isn't bad. I'd guess over that over that time period that would likely place us 3rd in the ACC in doing so.
 
Anyone who thinks Manning is bad, check out what the Minnesota team has been doing while playing 5 on 3 for 14 minutes of the basketball game tonight. Holy shit Pitino
 
daaberry said:
Tonight is the dreaded father/son battle.
Click to expand...

Versus recruiting against him all the time and playing him at least twice a year. Yep, playing once in a while is just the same as always being in the direct shadow.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top