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It is flat out a lack of talent

BeachBumDeac said:
With a mediocre coach this team would be a middle of the road ACC team. With a great coach, this team would be pushing at the bottom of the Top 4. The talent is there, it's just being used horribly and is not being motivated.
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We're too small and have little outside shooting. We couldn't make Top 4. Close to .500 maybe.
 
pourdeac said:
Good question. What does "star" mean? JoHo is probably in that boat regardless.
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Ish Smith, Josh Howard, Trelonnie Owens, and Kyle Visser are the only guys in the past 20 years who would come close to this description. And that is probably stretching the definition of "star."
 
DeaconSig said:
Ish Smith, Josh Howard, Trelonnie Owens, and Kyle Visser are the only guys in the past 20 years who would come close to this description. And that is probably stretching the definition of "star."
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Ish..definitely. Tree/Visser..maybe. I was thinking Darius Songaila, Rusty, and Delaney Rudd if you go back further....players that became good enough to play in the NBA but who weren't shoe-ins.
 
wfu22fan said:
Not enough size to rebound
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Charles Barkley and Dennis Rodman say hello.

Rebounding is about positioning and desire. Dre can't rebound for squat despite being a 7 footer because he can't position and lacks desire. Devin is more than big enough to tangle inside and get boards.
 
BeachBumDeac said:
With a mediocre coach this team would be a middle of the road ACC team. With a great coach, this team would be pushing at the bottom of the Top 4. The talent is there, it's just being used horribly and is not being motivated.
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I agree win this. Obviously there are some missing pieces (center), players who are solid on one end but terrible on the other (Cav, Tree, Moto) and guys who just don't belong (Miles) but Devin, Travis and Codi can ball. Most of the time CMM and DT are playing out of their natural positions and still have a lot of potential. That Pitt squad isn't exactly rolling in talent (9th in ACC by average star rankings) but they play tough, disciplined and have an excellent coach. It's up to Bz to motivate, utilize and get the most out of the players we have.
 
ChrisL68 said:
Wasn't the point that by his sophomore year he was showing star potential?
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You think Devin and CMM are 2nd team All-ACC caliber players?

Of course not. Howard was above their levels as a sophomore.
 
Obviously this isn't a team with a ton of talented depth. A solid coach could certainly make this team a top 6-7 ACC team.
 
PhDeac said:
You think Devin and CMM are 2nd team All-ACC caliber players?

Of course not. Howard was above their levels as a sophomore.
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That's the point I was making. Josh Howard is in no way comparable. Maybe I was just misreading the discussion.
 
SkinsNDeacs said:
I don't know how good (bad) Buzz is with the X's and O's. For all I know he might be a damned genius. What I do know is the kids he has recruited to play here are not ACC caliber players. They might be fine young men...they might be full of character but they have no business playing in the best conference in America. If our goal going forward is to field a team of solid citizens independent of basketball talent we need to drop down to DII.
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No, no, no, no, no ... This coach does not discriminate. He has consistently lost with good players before as well as with not as good players.

This is team is nowhere near as poorly talented as it is poorly coached. The team has ACC level talent, although the ACC level talent isn't twelve players deep. There is a talent drop-off after the top seven or eight. Seven or eight, by the way, can be enough, and it should be a lot better than what the coach has done with them.
 
We'll have to revisit this at the end of the year. Here are the three respective stats of Howard, CMM, Devin in their sophomore year (obviously Devin and CMM's stats are not complete since they're only three games into the ACC):

27.2 mpg 13.6 points 49.0% FG% 1.8 APG 5.9 RPG 1.1 BPG 2.0 SPG
25.9 mpg 10.7 points 51.7% FG% 1.5 APG 8.9 RPG 0.7 BPG 0.5 SPG
32.9 mpg 15.9 points 46.7% FG% 3.9 APG 3.3 RPG 0.1 BPG 1.0 SPG

They're all in the same group I think. You guys can figure out who is who. I think it's relatively easy to pick oiut, but if not it goes to show that they're all roughly equivalent.
 
I think Devon Thomas is sa econd-team All ACC caliber player, and might be first team with a better-coached team to support him.
 
So we'll have to give the next coach some leeway because of this talent?
 
This board does not specialize in "being patient" or "giving leeway" or making a "calm, calculated move"
 
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