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Stay John Collins!

CharlotteDeac1 said:
Probably, but Devin Thomas was really fucking good his senior year.
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Come on Charlotte, we all know Devin sucked his senior year. You should have taken his minutes, hell the stat boys would think Devin's ACC ranks would keep him on the bench:

FG% - 4th
Eff FG% - 9th
Def Reb- 4th
Off Reb - 10th
Total Reb/game- 3rd
Scoring - 10th
Blocks per game - 8th
Def +/- -10th

I can't believe this guy didn't cut by Xmas.
 
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Manning signs a 3* big man ranked outside the top 150 and two years later the guy leads he nation in efficiency, is a top 20 draft pick, and is now one of the 7-8 best rookies in the NBA and Ph is sitting here arguing that JC was underdeveloped at Wake.

I’ve seen and made a lot of hot takes on this board but this one is up there.
 
PhDeac said:
You act like it's some crazy thing to not play two post players together.
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To not? They're both post players - especially that season before Collins developed/got confident enough to shoot his 15-20 foot jumper.

Two post players who require %possession to be their best that puts them at 154th and 75th nationally, yeah.
 
RChildress107 said:
Wait, is Ph arguing that John Collins didn’t develop as much as he could/should have in his two years at Wake? Please tell me I’m misreading this post.
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Yep. Actually "we all". And I'm the one with dumb takes lol
 
You just mentioned an aspect of his game he didn’t get to truly develop at Wake.

Also the idea that a player could have played more minutes and gotten even better is simple.
 
PhDeac said:
You just mentioned an aspect of his game he didn’t get to truly develop at Wake.

Also the idea that a player could have played more minutes and gotten even better is simple.
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Name someone currently playing the game of basketball other than maybe LeBron who has truly developed every aspect of their game.

If you are expecting Manning to take a guy outside the top 150 in his class and turn him into one of the 40 or so best PFs in the world in less than two years you need to adjust your expectations.
 
No. He could have turned him into A PF.
 
PhDeac said:
No. He could have turned him into A PF.
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Why, he needed a C. Dinos had the long game, hence he played PF.

He COULD have, but gotta look at the team needs.
 
PhDeac said:
No. He could have turned him into A PF.
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I think you mean he should have played him at PF. You literally just posted an article from one of the most knowledgeable NBA writers arguing that Collins should be starting at PF/C. In two years Manning turned him into one of the top 50-60 best big men on the planet and you are arguing Manning should have molded him into a PF instead of a C?

Do you realize how absurd that sounds?
 
warak said:
Why, he needed a C. Dinos had the long game, hence he played PF.

He COULD have, but gotta look at the team needs.
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Team needed to win. 2-16. Most coaches with the talent on that team find a way to play Thomas & Collins together. There are lots of ways to run offense. Manning likes 4 out and 1 in.
May work on offense with the right guy.

Has not worked at all on defense any year that Manning was here. Two athletic bigs would have helped.
 
RChildress107 said:
I think you mean he should have played him at PF. You literally just posted an article from one of the most knowledgeable NBA writers arguing that Collins should be starting at PF/C. In two years Manning turned him into one of the top 50-60 best big men on the planet and you are arguing Manning should have molded him into a PF instead of a C?

Do you realize how absurd that sounds?
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Lowe said Collins should be playing with Dedmon just like fans said Collins should have played with Thomas and with Moore. It's amazing how you prolong arguments by getting simple facts wrong and arguing against them.



 
RChildress107 said:
I think you mean he should have played him at PF. You literally just posted an article from one of the most knowledgeable NBA writers arguing that Collins should be starting at PF/C. In two years Manning turned him into one of the top 50-60 best big men on the planet and you are arguing Manning should have molded him into a PF instead of a C?

Do you realize how absurd that sounds?
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It's not crazy to be able to play 2 positions. It's also not crazy to try and get your best and most athletic players on the floor at the same time. Lots of ways to run offense.

Maybe not so much if you are an inexperience coach. Maybe then you just go with what you know.
 
RChildress107 said:
I think you mean he should have played him at PF. You literally just posted an article from one of the most knowledgeable NBA writers arguing that Collins should be starting at PF/C. In two years Manning turned him into one of the top 50-60 best big men on the planet and you are arguing Manning should have molded him into a PF instead of a C?

Do you realize how absurd that sounds?
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That's just an insult to Collins and his work ethic.
 
Not at all. You can work your ass off but without the right guidance you are likely not to reach your potential. It's a combination of work and coaching.
 
Ayo said:
That's just an insult to Collins and his work ethic.
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How?

Is the argument now that Collins would have been a top 20 pick and NBA all-rookie team candidate regardless of his coach?

His 247 composite ranking was 184. He is now a borderline NBA starter. What more was Manning supposed to do?
 
Why is it out of the realm of possibility to think that Manning recognized Collins' overwhelming strength was his post game and helped develop that to be elite, getting him into the NBA? Rather than trying to turn him into PF, they probably both saw that his C post game was the best bet at getting him to the pros and they rolled with it. You can continue to develop other parts of your game when you get to the NBA - the first objective is to get there.
 
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