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Wake Forest Football Recruiting

Rafi said:
I completely agree. We didn't have the talent that we needed on the defensive side. But I don't think that matches with recruiting rankings. In 2015 our top ranked linebacker was Chris Calhoun (not Strnad). In 2017, 3 of our top 6 recruits were linebackers (Burley, Monroe, and Taylor).
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I'm not arguing for or against rankings being an appropriate metric of evaluation for Clawson's recruiting

I'm arguing that Clawson hasn't "earned his stripes" and blind support in this area
 
Rafi, you're talking about Wake while everybody else is talking about the national landscape.

Even at Wake of that top 25, 2 made it to the NFL (Mike Campanero, Bud Noel) and about half are still at Wake.
 
Umm. I assume you all know that Ahmani Marshall's dad was a tailback at UNC. I did not know he was a bodybuilder. Dude is ... big:

 
Rafi said:
I essentially agree with this, and we are basically saying the same thing - anything in the middle is a total crap shoot. If you look at the figure you linked, take out the top 5 programs (and the bottom 4 if you want), and the middle is a blob with essentially no correlation.
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Part of the reason the middle is a blob with no correlation is that the rankings have a very large "middle" by design. They basically only bother ranking the top players.
 
Rafi said:
Just Saban and Dabo, or their entire coaching/administration staffs? Will you also throw in their facilities, stadium, and fanbases? I think if you sent Wake's entire team to Bama or Clemson, they would probably win 1-2 games more per year, so 8-10 win seasons recently. I don't think they would make the playoffs. But keep in mind Wake's average class ranking is about 60. So, of course there is some importance in rankings (as I have acknowledged in this thread), and there is a big difference between the #1-2 and #60 class, but I don't think there is much difference at all between the #30 and #60 class.
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No, you said there was "very, very little correlation" outside of 5-stars, which is patently false. Clemson won the title in 2015 with only 4 five-stars among regular contributors, but 31 four-stars, including DeShaun Watson, Mike Williams, Artavis Scott, Wayne Gallman, Shaq Lawson, Carlos Watkins, Cordrea Tankersley, and Ben Boulware. They weren't winning squat with a sampling of our 2-star recruits in their place.
 
JuiceCrewAllStar said:
in the last three years, total defensive ranks are 79, 102, and 77

I'm not arguing for or against rankings, just that the idea that Clawson has "earned a pass" hasn't borne out on the defensive side of the ball

I'm a huge fan and think he's a perfect fit for the program, but let's pump the brakes on his recruiting being above reproach
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I'll agree that Clawon's offensive recruiting is better than defensive recruiting overall. However, I think the 2017/2018 awful defenses were more scheme related than personnel (while I think our speed at LB could be better). Additionally, the defensive numbers will never be top-25 with the offense that we run... and Clawson has stated this.

Also think this years defense was better than the numbers say. The outlier games (UL and Cuse), were largely due to our special teams. In those two games we gave up 101 total points, I can count atleast 35/42 of those points are due to turnovers/special teams.
USU game was first game of the year to a solid QB and Clemson was Clemson (defense on the field too long to a top 3 team).

Then you have games where the defense gave up 21, 18, 7, 24, 20, 10, 36, 27.

I think the defense is coming around and still believe Hemphill is a going to be a stud.
 
PhDeac said:
Part of the reason the middle is a blob with no correlation is that the rankings have a very large "middle" by design. They basically only bother ranking the top players.
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Agreed.
 
OldGoldBeard said:
No, you said there was "very, very little correlation" outside of 5-stars, which is patently false. Clemson won the title in 2015 with only 4 five-stars among regular contributors, but 31 four-stars, including DeShaun Watson, Mike Williams, Artavis Scott, Wayne Gallman, Shaq Lawson, Carlos Watkins, Cordrea Tankersley, and Ben Boulware. They weren't winning squat with a sampling of our 2-star recruits in their place.
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OK. I agree with the figure tigerswood linked - at the very top, rankings correlate with wins. But the middle is an amorphous blob where rankings correlate very little with anything.
 
PhDeac said:
Even at Wake of that top 25, 2 made it to the NFL (Mike Campanero, Bud Noel) and about half are still at Wake.
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LOL. And of the bottom 25, 4 made it to the NFL (Givens, Arnoux, Bates, and Basham).
 
PhDeac said:
Rafi, you're talking about Wake while everybody else is talking about the national landscape.
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LOL. Of course I'm talking about Wake, this is literally the "Wake Forest Football Recruiting" thread.
 
Jury is out on whether Hemphill will work out as DC. He certainly showed improvement over Sawvel so there is reason for hope/optimism there.

Overall special teams was a disaster this past year and Clawson needs to address it this off season.
 
May be someone else noted but if not....there's an unfortunate sloppy error under George Sell's bio.

Should have been corrected by now but it's still there.
 
Does anyone have a good scouting report on the new QB? How big is he (looked bigger than what his 247 profile suggest in a recent pic with Clawson), what are his strengths/weaknesses?
 
YankeeInAtlanta said:
Year Nat Rank ACC Rank Avg Rating
2020 54 10 0.8403
2019 58 11 0.846
2018 64 13 0.8428
2017 68 14 0.8269
2016 57 10 0.8319
2015 51 11 0.8298
2014 67 14 0.818

Clawson improved Wake's average rating for recruiting rankings to 0.84 from historical levels of approximately 0.82. Wake's average rating under Clawson has plateaued at the 0.84 level. Clawson will need to further improve recruiting in order to take a step forward towards getting a consistent winning record in the ACC and beating teams that have winning records.

Without further improvements in recruiting having double digit wins in a season will be a significant challenge and unlikely to occur.

Clawson and the coaching staff have really done a great job at evaluating talent and improving Wake's recruiting. Great job. I commend them for their efforts and now it's time for them to work harder to further improve recruiting to help Wake take another step forward towards being a successful program.
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Maybe this year's ranking has something to do with less top skill recruits this year due to returning 2 stud QBs, RB, hopefully 2 stud WRs
 
Is there a video of the signing day press conference posted anywhere?
 
JuiceCrewAllStar said:
I'm not arguing for or against rankings being an appropriate metric of evaluation for Clawson's recruiting

I'm arguing that Clawson hasn't "earned his stripes" and blind support in this area
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And he has built our offensive side to where it challenged school and conference marks until injuries hit. Now we supplement that with stronger defensive help where we can find it. Not to put us in their category, but does anyone here think OU or LSU's defense was or is as strong as their offense? But everyone wants to watch them. In Claw We Trust(but hope he builds more)
 
YankeeInAtlanta said:
Jury is out on whether Hemphill will work out as DC. He certainly showed improvement over Sawvel so there is reason for hope/optimism there.

Overall special teams was a disaster this past year and Clawson needs to address it this off season.
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See my above post. Save for outliers that had nothing to do with the defense, we allowed 20.3 points a game. I’ll take that.
 
DeacsOrDie said:
See my above post. Save for outliers that had nothing to do with the defense, we allowed 20.3 points a game. I’ll take that.
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Where do you get that from? We gave up 15 rushing TDs and 20 passing TDs. That’s 20 ppg right there with even counting XP and FG.
 
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