Yep, as I said, I think a good argument can be made for bball and men's golf (since our last championship). Outside of that, I don't think so. Also, the -27 number is kind of wonky for P5 teams. For example, I looked at Duke briefly, and just since 2000 they are -54.
Wake Golf 2024 - Women finish 9th and Men 16th
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Yep, as I said, I think a good argument can be made for bball and men's golf (since our last championship). Outside of that, I don't think so. Also, the -27 number is kind of wonky for P5 teams. For example, I looked at Duke briefly, and just since 2000 they are -54.
But what are you comparing that you come to that conclusion. Us against us, or us compared to some larger pool?
And just this spring the women's golf team won the ACC championship and women's tennis played to their seed. And two seasons ago the men's tennis outplayed their seed/ranking to win the ACC championship and go to the NCAA finals. It's easy to pick and choose anecdotes, I'm interested in numbers compared to other D1 programs.
ChrisL68
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By definition the average is .500.
I imagine the multiple championships and final 4s comfort Duke fans!
ChrisL68
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Playing to your seed doesn't offset getting beat as a higher seed you have to play above your seed to offset that. It seems to me you're using anecdotes to try to deny what I think you know is true that if you did those detailed analysis wake would be under 500 comparing the two
Exactly. That shows how wonky that number can be.
No, I just threw out those anecdotes because they matched the exact same season you threw out.
I don't think you are understanding how this works when there are 300 D1 teams and P5 teams are typically the higher ranked seeds. When a team is often a top half seed, they rarely have a chance for an upset in a tournament format. For example, I looked back through the year 2000 and Duke has never beaten a higher ranked team in the NCAA tournament - not once. When you look at it through the perspective of one program, it seems like your program always loses, but in reality, fans of almost every program feel that way. Again, we have more national championships than half the ACC and we only field the minimum number of sports.
No, it shows that duke lost against a 15 seed (-13) but balanced it off with a championship. Duke is also almost always a 1, 2, and 3 seed. The bottom line is we rarely beat better seeds than us and never get hot when it matters. For example our loss to St Joe’s was a perfect opportunity as was Oregon but we never win games like that. And then we lose to WVU, Auburn, Okl State, Cleveland State, Butler, Stanford…
You are citing a program that has been to 7 straight sweet sixteens (which includes a few final fours).
They have lost to a 15, 14, 11, and few 10s and many others as the higher ranked team. They have not beat a higher ranked team. The point is not that Duke basketball chokes in the post season - the point is that when you are a highly ranked team, like Wake men's soccer or tennis, then you are rarely have a chance to beat a higher ranked team, so fans can perceive that as choking. On the flip side, Wake women's bball often wins against higher ranked teams in the ACC tournament because Wake is the lower ranked team much more often.
ChrisL68
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which doesn't change the fact that over history we have grossly underperformed relative to seed in the ACC tournament.
Again, when you are usually one of the top few seeds, that's what happens. I looked at the last 6 years (all the tournament draws are on wikipedia) to get a feel for the actual results for Wake men in the ACC tournament. Wake underperformed to seed twice, overperformed once (ACC champ as 2 seed), and played to seed 3 times (including an ACC champion as 1 seed). We played 14 games in those tournaments and we were the higher seed in 12 of those games - unless you win the championship every year, you are going to lose to lower seeded teams.
ChrisL68
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that doesn't explain how we are 7 games under .500 in the ACC tournament. show me another program that has been elite for as long as our men's soccer program has and isn't even .500 in its conference tournament?
Literally the first team I checked was Clemson. They have 3 national championships and are 24-27-10.
DownEastDeac
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Came here to check on Wake in the ACC tournament vs. UNC and instead found a discussion of our failures in the men's BB tournament. Is that an indicator that we bombed on the links again today for the 33rd consecutive year? Or maybe they haven't teed off yet?
Update appreciated.
Update appreciated.
deacdixieboy
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It’s an update that no matter how good tennis, golf, soccer, and field hockey do, no one really cares at the end of the day. Football, basketball, and, to a much lesser extent, baseball are what matters.
deacdixieboy
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Oh and at the moment we are winning.