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BBall Recruiting Thread 2k19 - Charles Coleman de-commits to Wake. :(

I agree that our talent level was better than our record last season... That’s my biggest criticism of Manning.

Also, we were a much better team the year after Devin Thomas and CMM graduated, mostly due to Collins and Crawford (and Woods/Arians). I don’t think most expected that. But then we shit the bed last year and now sentiment is fucking miserable.

I still think we can be good next year. Brown makes a big jump. Sarr makes a significant jump. Crawford comes back. Hoard contributes. Defense becomes less of a weakness. And we have players who can get decent shots in the endgame (Brown & maybe Johnson/Hoard/Mucius).

Optimistic? Yes. But not ridiculous expectations.
 
Pretty sure we will be better next year. It is really hard to post consecutive 20 loss seasons. Even more so with a 5-star player.

If anyone can do it though, it would be Manning. Yay.
 
knowell said:
Pretty sure we will be better next year. It is really hard to post consecutive 20 loss seasons. Even more so with a 5-star player.

If anyone can do it though, it would be Manning. Yay.
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We are going to be just as good (terrible) as we were last season.
 
knowell said:
Pretty sure we will be better next year. It is really hard to post consecutive 20 loss seasons. Even more so with a 5-star player.

If anyone can do it though, it would be Manning. Yay.
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Best case is a similar season to two years ago, where we played well enough to win basically every game but pissed so many away with brutal end of game collapses, each dumber than the last. Then having to worry about a bubble invite instead of locking up a bid a month earlier.
 
Yep. And based on the logic of many of our fans, that would buy Manning two more years.
 
PhDeac said:
Yep. And based on the logic of many of our fans, that would buy Manning two more years.
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PH, focus on your own thinking. Getting old putting lame words in others mouths/pen. I have a slew of reasons for keeping Manning, none of which you articulate for me.

Fans are entitled to be extremely short-sighted, absolutely your right. Season sucked, things have not gone great since the season ended. Arrrgh. Fire him, dumpster fire, start over.

But actual decisions in the real world shouldn't be made reactively like that. Our first reactive dismissal - Dino, resulted in Bzd. As a result, we did not hire our 1st or 2nd choice 4 years ago either. The waterfall effect. IMO, you do what you want, we fall further down the waterfall. Climbing the waterfall is tough but certain pieces need to be in place beforehand. Those aren't there.

Perfectly fine for you disagree w me - just don't write me into your simplistic narrative. Difficult to have a discussion with you when you seem so disrespectful of an opposing opine.
 
Why do you see firing someone after four years as “reactive?”
 
PhDeac said:
Why do you see firing someone after four years as “reactive?”
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Looking at the body of his work, firing Danny this spring would be reactive.
Three years of progress from the Bzaster to the NCAA tournament.
Two really good key players leave for multi-million dollar contracts, one totally unexpectedly and extremely late in the recruiting cycle. The other, not obvious until the season was underway, which is late in the recruiting cycle.
Team falls back and has a bad season.
Best recruiting class (at least per recruiting gurus) about to arrive on campus.
Fire coach??????
That would make it look like Wake has a short leash. Make NCAA tourney. Lose good players to pros. Have bad season. Get fired. Almost the definition of reactive. Do something based on the most recent input.
 
Deaconblue said:
Looking at the body of his work, firing Danny this spring would be reactive.
Three years of progress from the Bzaster to the NCAA tournament.
Two really good key players leave for multi-million dollar contracts, one totally unexpectedly and extremely late in the recruiting cycle. The other, not obvious until the season was underway, which is late in the recruiting cycle.
Team falls back and has a bad season.
Best recruiting class (at least per recruiting gurus) about to arrive on campus.
Fire coach??????
That would make it look like Wake has a short leash. Make NCAA tourney. Lose good players to pros. Have bad season. Get fired. Almost the definition of reactive. Do something based on the most recent input.
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Some of you guys have completely skewed your view of what a decent coach looks like. Manning has had 3 godawful years and 1 average year. Players can't wait to leave and 2019 recruiting seems dead.
Throw in the complete lack of game tactical abilities and the inability to get players to buy in. The only reason this tenure does not look like a complete pile of horse manure is that BZ truly may have been the worst hire ever by an ACC program.

Lat year was the absolute perfect time to have parted ways with Manning. Only one year away from a decent season and some promising recruits should have attracted a good coach.

One more shit season and we will have to hope UNCG's coach does not have better offers.
 
Year 2 and the 2016 class was not "progress" over Year 1 and the 2015 class. And just sneaking into the tournament this year shouldn't be considered any sort of accomplishment. Man, expectations have been lowered around here.
 
DeacsATS said:
I agree that our talent level was better than our record last season... That’s my biggest criticism of Manning.

Also, we were a much better team the year after Devin Thomas and CMM graduated, mostly due to Collins and Crawford (and Woods/Arians). I don’t think most expected that. But then we shit the bed last year and now sentiment is fucking miserable.

I still think we can be good next year. Brown makes a big jump. Sarr makes a significant jump. Crawford comes back. Hoard contributes. Defense becomes less of a weakness. And we have players who can get decent shots in the endgame (Brown & maybe Johnson/Hoard/Mucius).

Optimistic? Yes. But not ridiculous expectations.
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This is pretty much where I am.
 
Progress isn't always linear. It can be two steps forward, one step back. It is unusual in Wake history to have back to back top recruiting classes.
 
In my mind, this team will still go as far as Crawford takes them. Unfortunately, where he took us last year was to a 11 win season. I know it's a lot of pressure on him, and he hasn't handled it well in the past, but it's what comes with being as talented as he is. When you think of the bright spots from last season, he was taking good shots, making defenses collapse on him and kicking it to open shooters/throwing oops to Moore. If Manning can get his head right, we will be back in the tourney this year.
 
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Any year that Wake doesn’t finish dead last in men’s basketball in the ACC should be celebrated as exceeding expectations. Manning definitely isn’t going to be fired after this next season no matter what happens.
 
Demonwolverine said:
In my mind, this team will still go as far as Crawford takes them. Unfortunately, where he took us last year was to a 11 win season. I know it's a lot of pressure on him, and he hasn't handled it well in the past, but it's what comes with being as talented as he is. When you think of the bright spots from last season, he was taking good shots, and making defenses collapse on him and kicking it to open shooters/throwing oops to Moore. If Manning can get his head right, we will be back in the tourney this year.
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Crawford (or whomever is Wake's primary ballhandler in the 2019 season) needs to be of the mind set that his job is to make the other players around him better, not just "get his." Senior year Craw would need to revert to much of what Soph Craw provided the team. Preferably with some added maturity that being a senior with two additional years of experience should bring.
 
PhDeac said:
Why do you see firing someone after four years as “reactive?”
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I do. Firing Manning only works if you can hire a better coach. That's my jumping off point. I don't think we can in the short-term for a number of reasons, but one includes having a 70-year old AD.

FWIW, I don't even think Manning considers himself on shaky ground. A coach on shaky ground, who loses 8+ games in the last 4 minutes across a season, lets Woodberry go and hires a strategist/ game coach to sit beside him.
 
Why isn’t Manning on shaky ground?
 
jaybone said:
FWIW, I don't even think Manning considers himself on shaky ground. A coach on shaky ground, who loses 8+ games in the last 4 minutes across a season, lets Woodberry go and hires a strategist/ game coach to sit beside him.
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Or he's a stubborn bastard with zero self-awareness
 
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