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Danny Manning Credibility Watch

DCDeac said:
At least 13 points per game? See, this is why quantifying an opinion matters. That is absolutely absurd. We'd easily be top 5 in the country with some better coaching? No wonder there are posts about firing Manning and shitting on his coaching, he's eliminating the 2nd leading scorer on the team through questionable in-game moves!
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TITCR


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canadiandeac said:
there were college coaches who actually thought bzzkill would make a good coach at their level? thats news to me. being able to relate and connect with an 18 yr old is a whole lot different than being able to evaluate and full grown adults already proven talent. if there is anyone that actually thought that was a good hire, other than wellman, they are probably the ones thinking manning cant get the job done.
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"Wake Forest has definitely hit a grand slam with Jeff [name redacted]. I've known Jeff since we worked on the same staff at Davidson College back in the late 1970s, and I've always respected how hard he has worked at every step in his coaching career. People around the ACC will find out very quickly that Jeff is an outstanding basketball coach."
- Rick Barnes

"What a wealth of experience Wake Forest is getting with this hire. Jeff has been a head coach in the NBA, a college assistant and a college head coach -- at very different types of schools. Jeff has been an outstanding coach and person in all of them. Wake Forest is getting a terrific coach in Jeff [name redacted]."
- Mike Krzyzewski

"Jeff [name redacted] is a coach's coach. He is in the select company of people who have been successful at the college and at the NBA level. And, after stints at Colorado, Air Force and Northwestern, he'll understand and embrace the unique athletic and academic culture of Wake Forest University."
- Fran Fraschilla
 
TownieDeac said:
"Jeff [name redacted] is a coach's coach. He is in the select company of people who have been successful at the college and at the NBA level. And, after stints at Colorado, Air Force and Northwestern, he'll understand and embrace the unique athletic and academic culture of Wake Forest University."
- Fran Fraschilla
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So his Tuesday excuse wasn't new?
 
DCDeac said:
At least 13 points per game? See, this is why quantifying an opinion matters. That is absolutely absurd. We'd easily be top 5 in the country with some better coaching? No wonder there are posts about firing Manning and shitting on his coaching, he's eliminating the 2nd leading scorer on the team through questionable in-game moves!
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Fine. Quantifying how many points are lost on poor performance in certain areas is pretty difficult. How many points per game do you think we would improve with a good defense? If it's not at 4-5 points a game then, hell, defense ain't all that important any way. How about the substitution patterns? Not worth a few points? Then why does everyone constantly bitch? In game mistakes, not using timeouts? Not worth a couple of points either? Then who cares? Why all the high pay? Anyone can do it.

How many points is a great coach worth in your book?
 
knowell said:
Fine. Quantifying how many points are lost on poor performance in certain areas is pretty difficult. How many points per game do you think we would improve with a good defense? If it's not at 4-5 points a game then, hell, defense ain't all that important any way. How about the substitution patterns? Not worth a few points? Then why does everyone constantly bitch? In game mistakes, not using timeouts? Not worth a couple of points either? Then who cares? Why all the high pay? Anyone can do it.

How many points is a great coach worth in your book?
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Because they don't know what they're talking about.
 
knowell said:
Fine. Quantifying how many points are lost on poor performance in certain areas is pretty difficult. How many points per game do you think we would improve with a good defense? If it's not at 4-5 points a game then, hell, defense ain't all that important any way. How about the substitution patterns? Not worth a few points? Then why does everyone constantly bitch? In game mistakes, not using timeouts? Not worth a couple of points either? Then who cares? Why all the high pay? Anyone can do it.

How many points is a great coach worth in your book?
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Just for some context (not taking either side at all), the adjusted difference over 100 possessions between Wake and UVA is 14 points per 100 possessions per KP. That's 10 points per game over our 71.9 estimated possessions per game. UVA has the best defense in the country.
 
Deacsfan27 said:
Just for some context (not taking either side at all), the adjusted difference over 100 possessions between Wake and UVA is 14 points per 100 possessions per KP. That's 10 points per game over our 71.9 estimated possessions per game. UVA has the best defense in the country.
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That sounds about right. UVA probably has the best defensive coach in the country. I don't think he has overly exceptional individual defensive talent. Expecting us to improve 5 points per game on defense alone seems pretty reasonable. That would be making the opponent miss one additional 3-point shot and 1 additional 2-point shot per game.

It would be completely unreasonable to expect Manning to be Tony Bennett on defense, Skip Prosser on offense, and Coach K motivation and tactics, but to expect significant improvement in those areas is reasonable and will make this team tangibly better.
 
It took Tony Bennett five years to win his first NCAA game at UVA. He lost every single ACC tournament game they played minus the bullshit play-in game his first year. When he lost in the NIT in year 4, tons of UVA fans wanted him gone. He inherited Mike Scott and Sylven Landesburg, with Joe Harris the following - nowhere near as bare a cupboard as Manning inherited.

Using UVA as an argument against Manning's coaching always cracks me up.
 
DCDeac said:
It took Tony Bennett five years to win his first NCAA game at UVA. He lost every single ACC tournament game they played minus the bullshit play-in game his first year. When he lost in the NIT in year 4, tons of UVA fans wanted him gone. He inherited Mike Scott and Sylven Landesburg, with Joe Harris the following - nowhere near as bare a cupboard as Manning inherited.

Using UVA as an argument against Manning's coaching always cracks me up.
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Try not to get too cracked up. The comparison is on the defensive end and as something to work towards, if you can stop laughing long enough.
 
You know, I think Manning is a class act. Not only that, he has the playing experience and was a great big man coach in Kansas. His head coaching experience, well he is still finding his way. Having said that, he does seem to have n eye for talent and has proven to be a solid recruiter. We are headed in the right direction...
 
DCDeac said:
It took Tony Bennett five years to win his first NCAA game at UVA. He lost every single ACC tournament game they played minus the bullshit play-in game his first year. When he lost in the NIT in year 4, tons of UVA fans wanted him gone. He inherited Mike Scott and Sylven Landesburg, with Joe Harris the following - nowhere near as bare a cupboard as Manning inherited.

Using UVA as an argument against Manning's coaching always cracks me up.
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It's good to know that you have a sense of humor. I crack up harder that you somehow in your mind can lower Bennett down to Manning's level. Bennett went 69-33 in his three years at Washington State. After going 31-31 combined in his first two years at perennial powerhouse UVA (roll eyes), he's gone 22-10, 23-12, 30-7, 30-4, 29-8 and off to a pretty good start this year. I like Danny and really hope he takes us back to the top 20 program that we were for two decades, but the evidence is a bit shaky at this point and he's a long way from Bennett's level even at similar points in their tenures.
 
EagleDeac said:
It's good to know that you have a sense of humor. I crack up harder that you somehow in your mind can lower Bennett down to Manning's level. Bennett went 69-33 in his three years at Washington State. After going 31-31 combined in his first two years at perennial powerhouse UVA (roll eyes), he's gone 22-10, 23-12, 30-7, 30-4, 29-8 and off to a pretty good start this year. I like Danny and really hope he takes us back to the top 20 program that we were for two decades, but the evidence is a bit shaky at this point and he's a long way from Bennett's level even at similar points in their tenures.
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Bennett had a 2nd Team All -ACC player and a future pro on that first team. His second tea, had Scott, Joe Harris and other players better than any Danny had.
 
EagleDeac said:
It's good to know that you have a sense of humor. I crack up harder that you somehow in your mind can lower Bennett down to Manning's level. Bennett went 69-33 in his three years at Washington State. After going 31-31 combined in his first two years at perennial powerhouse UVA (roll eyes), he's gone 22-10, 23-12, 30-7, 30-4, 29-8 and off to a pretty good start this year. I like Danny and really hope he takes us back to the top 20 program that we were for two decades, but the evidence is a bit shaky at this point and he's a long way from Bennett's level even at similar points in their tenures.
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This
 
wfu22fan said:
Danny had CMM!!
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If Danny had the players at and committed to UVA, he'd have the same or better record over those two years. After those years is really hard to know as we wouldn't know whom he would have recruited.
 
Idk. CMM sucked and DM was pretty bad too. He kept giving the ball to CMM at the end of games. We won exactly one game after CMM came back from his injury last year. DM has recruited well with the help of Chill and has all of his players now. We are much better than last year talent wise so let's hope our record reflects that.
 
DM has to get some credit for taking a Euro big and making him into an interior player. Many of the experts here at the beginning of the season didn't want Dinos on the floor, now it's pretty clear he should be getting starter minutes.

DM has a lot to work on but I think making Dinos more than big that can shoot threes is fairly remarkable.
 
warak said:
You know, I think Manning is a class act. Not only that, he has the playing experience and was a great big man coach in Kansas. His head coaching experience, well he is still finding his way. Having said that, he does seem to have n eye for talent and has proven to be a solid recruiter. We are headed in the right direction...
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I do agree with this mostly. That said, I am not sure if Manning can get us there. As long as he is improves in certain areas, and there is some evidence that he is, there is hope.
 
Deac83 said:
DM has to get some credit for taking a Euro big and making him into an interior player. Many of the experts here at the beginning of the season didn't want Dinos on the floor, now it's pretty clear he should be getting starter minutes.

DM has a lot to work on but I think making Dinos more than big that can shoot threes is fairly remarkable.
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Good post.

We're watching Manning learn on the job in the toughest conference in the country.

I hope he'll put more of it together. I see progress. These are his players (outside of McClinton).

The three bigger games this month are really going to tell us a lot about this team.

I remain guardedly optimistic.
 
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