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Thread: Conference Expansion: USC and UCLA to the Big Ten?

  1. #1781
    Quote Originally Posted by 2&2 Slider To Leyritz View Post
    I'd much rather play App State every year than Oregon State or Kansas State.
    yea but all the App guys I know will consider that as a huge win for them. they have been saying for years Wake does not belong in a better/bigger conference than them. Major chip on their shoulders and this would be massive vindication.

  2. #1782
    Quote Originally Posted by guitardeac View Post
    yea but all the App guys I know will consider that as a huge win for them. they have been saying for years Wake does not belong in a better/bigger conference than them. Major chip on their shoulders and this would be massive vindication.
    stay strong

    Quote Originally Posted by guitardeac View Post
    I don't see why it matters what "conference" you're in anymore. I mean it used to matter because you had rivalries and regional relationships. These aren't conferences. They're just divisions of the NCAA. The only reason you care about what "conference" you're in is the size of you share of the money. beyond that who cares who is in your conference anymore? Just play whatever teams are on your schedule and move on with life.

    Multiple atomic bombs have been dropped on college sports. It's gone. Far fewer young people will even care about college sports in a few years. My son is the biggest sports fan I know and he goes to an SEC school with a top 25 program and he went to 1 game the last 2 years. No interest at all in college sports anymore.

  3. #1783
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    Let's just bring in UNC-C and Notre Dame and call it a day.

  4. #1784
    Quote Originally Posted by 2&2 Slider To Leyritz View Post
    I'd much rather play App State every year than Oregon State or Kansas State.
    Wake being dropped from a top notch conference will be the death knell of Wake Sports. Why would any highly ranked players want to go to a tougher no NIL tier 2 school of an APP or Coastal they won't and we'll fall further behind.

  5. #1785
    Quote Originally Posted by deacondamo View Post
    https://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...work/87384500/

    Seems like the league is kind of boned on this low rights package. Adding a school and renegotiating seems like the only way to increase the pie.
    20 year agreement. Must have seemed like a good deal at the time...

  6. #1786
    Quote Originally Posted by 2&2 Slider To Leyritz View Post
    I'd much rather play App State every year than Oregon State or Kansas State.
    Amen. Great atmosphere.

  7. #1787
    I'm betting Clemson and Miami will be out of the ACC in 3 years.

  8. #1788
    The more I think about it, the more I think the ACC needs to make a pitch to WVU. Last year, they averaged nearly 1 million viewers per football game. They are bringing nearly identical number of eyeballs to the tv screen as the mighty coveted tar heels. In the ACC, I would expect that number to increase with natural/regional rivalries with Pitt, Louisville and VT. They are rarely great, but they usually put a pretty good product on the field. Good product can lead to increased viewership.

  9. #1789
    Quote Originally Posted by jamesda3 View Post
    Wake being dropped from a top notch conference will be the death knell of Wake Sports. Why would any highly ranked players want to go to a tougher no NIL tier 2 school of an APP or Coastal they won't and we'll fall further behind.
    Yeah, this is where I am on the subject. Wake needs the ACC right now much more than it needs Wake. Playing the likes of Elon and Memphis State on a regular basis will not put many butts in seats.

  10. #1790
    If the ACC stays together, anybody here think a national champion can't come out of it. We all look at recruiting. So what is the Big/SEC gonna do with that. I say the ACC can win at least 3 in ten years. The only thing that can stop this is they increase scholarship limits like they were in 1969. When they can take 150 it's all over. In the meantime an ACC program can take their 85 and win a championship. Who here doubts that?

  11. #1791
    Quote Originally Posted by skinnydeac View Post
    The more I think about it, the more I think the ACC needs to make a pitch to WVU. Last year, they averaged nearly 1 million viewers per football game. They are bringing nearly identical number of eyeballs to the tv screen as the mighty coveted tar heels. In the ACC, I would expect that number to increase with natural/regional rivalries with Pitt, Louisville and VT. They are rarely great, but they usually put a pretty good product on the field. Good product can lead to increased viewership.
    On top of that, are we 100% sure that the SEC wants these ACC teams that are rumored to leave? Does ESPN want them? ESPN already has Clemson and FSU. The difference is they have them at a huge discount right now. How do they benefit by paying them 2 to 3 times more money? I wouldn't be so sure that the SEC and BIG are that interested in adding many more pieces. They are both pretty untouchable at the moment. The race now might be for 3rd and 4th place in the pecking order and you better not be 5th.

  12. #1792
    Quote Originally Posted by BiffTannen View Post
    Let's just bring in UNC-C and Notre Dame and call it a day.
    Was thinking Alabama and JMU

  13. #1793
    Add Alaska and Hawaii and re-brand as the B1GGEST. Hell, why not look at Canadian and Mexican schools?

  14. #1794
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    Quote Originally Posted by skinnydeac View Post
    The more I think about it, the more I think the ACC needs to make a pitch to WVU. Last year, they averaged nearly 1 million viewers per football game. They are bringing nearly identical number of eyeballs to the tv screen as the mighty coveted tar heels. In the ACC, I would expect that number to increase with natural/regional rivalries with Pitt, Louisville and VT. They are rarely great, but they usually put a pretty good product on the field. Good product can lead to increased viewership.
    You know why they averaged 1 million viewers per game ? Because they played in the Big XII against teams like OU an UT. I'm pretty sure UVA, VT and Pitt have been dead set against adding WVU.

  15. #1795
    Quote Originally Posted by macktheknife View Post
    If the ACC stays together, anybody here think a national champion can't come out of it. We all look at recruiting. So what is the Big/SEC gonna do with that. I say the ACC can win at least 3 in ten years. The only thing that can stop this is they increase scholarship limits like they were in 1969. When they can take 150 it's all over. In the meantime an ACC program can take their 85 and win a championship. Who here doubts that?
    I would bet a lot of money this does not happen. It's going to take several years for any non-Clemson team to get to the Bama/UGA/tOSU level, and Clemson appears to be slipping somewhat.

  16. #1796
    Quote Originally Posted by BiffTannen View Post
    You know why they averaged 1 million viewers per game ? Because they played in the Big XII against teams like OU an UT. I'm pretty sure UVA, VT and Pitt have been dead set against adding WVU.
    Well shit, I guess just fold up shop and get Gardner Webb and Elon on the phone and see if they have any openings for 2026. There are no perfect options. Texas, OSU and Alabama are already taken. WVU is probably the best option. UVA, VT and especially Pitt, might just have to get the hell over it.

  17. #1797
    Quote Originally Posted by skinnydeac View Post
    Well shit, I guess just fold up shop and get Gardner Webb and Elon on the phone and see if they have any openings for 2026. There are no perfect options. Texas, OSU and Alabama are already taken. WVU is probably the best option. UVA, VT and especially Pitt, might just have to get the hell over it.
    Adding a team that doesn't make the ACC stronger doesn't help. WV is just another middling FBS program in an irrelevant state. The SEC and Big 10 didn't expand beyond 14 for the heck of it. Those conferences expanded because they could add to their conference portfolio the media rights for Texas/OU and UCLA/USC. Not a coincidence that California with 39.6 million people and Texas with 30 million people are the two largest states in the US. WV has 1.7 million people and is the 39th largest state in the US. The SEC locking down the media rights to the State of Texas with Texas, A&M and OU (who has a big following in Texas) is huge. The Big 10 locking down the two biggest and most prominent programs in California is huge. Locking down the State of West Virginia is meaningless in the scheme of things.

    When a conference adds to its membership, it only makes sense if the result is to make the conference stronger. People want the ACC to "do something", but if it doesn't make the conference stronger as a whole, it simply weakens the conference.
    Last edited by Pilchard; 07-06-2022 at 01:24 PM.

  18. #1798
    Quote Originally Posted by Pilchard View Post
    Adding a team that doesn't make the ACC stronger doesn't help. WV is just another middling FBS program in an irrelevant state. The SEC and Big 10 didn't expand beyond 14 for the heck of it. Those conferences expanded because they could add to their conference portfolio the media rights for Texas/OU and UCLA/USC. Not a coincidence that California with 39.6 million people and Texas with 30 million people are the two largest states in the US. WV has 1.7 million people and is the 39th largest state in the US. The SEC locking down the media rights to the State of Texas with Texas, A&M and OU (who has a big following in Texas) is huge. The Big 10 locking down the two biggest and most prominent programs in California is huge for the Big 10. Locking down the State of West Virginia is meaningless in the scheme of things.

    When a conference adds to its membership, it only makes sense if the result is to make the conference stronger. People want the ACC to "do something", but if it doesn't make the conference stronger as a whole, it simply weakens the conference.
    So don't add a team that gets more viewers than 75% of the rest of the conference. Got it. They would be a top 5 or so "brand" in the ACC. The ACC needs more teams that are going to have lots of people watching. It doesn't necessarily matter that they are located in WV. It matters that more than 15x the number of people watch their football games compared to the number of people that watch Duke.

  19. #1799
    In every negotiation, there is the desired outcome and then the fallback.

    The desired outcome is to be on par with the SEC and Big 10. That goal seems out of reach for, among other reasons, the one Pilch mentions above.

    The fallback is to survive, and to avoid yearly games with Elon and Memphis. That might be the best use of the ACC's efforts. In that case, adding WV probably helps. Though if the Big 12 scoops up a few Pac 12 teams, why would WV leave? Additionally, any school who whose desired outcome is to leave the ACC isn't going to be very amenable to anything that further binds them to a surviving ACC (this is how we'll know who actually wants out).

    I'm not generally an alarmist, but the medium and longterm prospects for the ACC don't look great. In that case, it's time to focus on the fallback.

  20. #1800
    Quote Originally Posted by skinnydeac View Post
    So don't add a team that gets more viewers than 75% of the rest of the conference. Got it. They would be a top 5 or so "brand" in the ACC. The ACC needs more teams that are going to have lots of people watching. It doesn't necessarily matter that they are located in WV. It matters that more than 15x the number of people watch their football games compared to the number of people that watch Duke.
    The standard is not whether the football program can attract more eyeballs than Duke football. If that was the ACC would invite App State. The standard is whether by adding that school will that allow the ACC to negotiate a media rights deal that increases the payout for EVERY ACC school. Right now, the ACC media rights payout per school is about $35 million per year; its expected to grow to about $55 million over the next 6 to 8 years.

    WV doesn't move the needle when negotiating media rights to to make the economics work so that the per school payout would increase, and the ACC is not adding WV to kick out Duke (or WF). They aren't that many options for the ACC to add to its membership, the ACC has vetted each one, if there was a home run school out there that the ACC could add, it would do so. WV has been begging to get in the ACC for more than 20 years, but simply stated, WV does not help in the grand scheme of things. WV might be the option if/when the ACC started losing members, but not until then if ever.

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