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Non-Political Coronavirus Thread

If you took today’s population and put them in 1941, I don’t think the USA could win a world war. Too many selfish, soft , complainers who would never be able to sacrifice for the common good. I mean , could you imagine any of these fucking cowards who complain about their masks in a boat approaching the shores of Normandy?
 
SC DEAC said:
If you took today’s population and put them in 1941, I don’t think the USA could win a world war. Too many selfish, soft , complainers who would never be able to sacrifice for the common good. I mean , could you imagine any of these fucking cowards who complain about their masks in a boat approaching the shores of Normandy?
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People didn't really have a choice with the draft. If we forced people to be vaccinated most people would probably do it.

The ones that don't wouldn't go to Canada though
 
TenaciousKory said:
and I say this as someone who (unfortunately) checks Gab, GETTR and /r/Conspiracy p regularly so I've seen the args in multitude

their inability to process what's happening feels like a part of the epidemic (or at least a more nefarious symptom of modern living the epidemic is throwing into sharp relief), not as something we need to ignore (let 'em die!) to get past the pandemic
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Curious what your thoughts are on natural selection as it applies to humans as a concept. Especially when those humans make a conscious choice to avoid the "evolutionary" adaptation to negate that (potential) natural selection, and at the risk of the overall species.

Trying to think of a bird example for birdman but the whole consciousness thing is making it hard.
 
tigerswood said:
Curious what your thoughts are on natural selection as it applies to humans as a concept. Especially when those humans make a conscious choice to avoid the "evolutionary" adaptation to negate that (potential) natural selection, and at the risk of the overall species.

Trying to think of a bird example for birdman but the whole consciousness thing is making it hard.
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maybe i'm not understanding your line of inquiry and i'm admittedly not a biologist, but my initial reaction is that natural selection is pretty strictly just a natural evolutionary pattern - not a tool for humans to wield (tech/rhetoric) or to understand the actions of humans in their lifetime (diagnostic).

my understanding of natural selection is that it takes place over such a long period of time that we struggle to wrap our heads around it since we only live for such a short period of time; people refusing the vaccine isn't really an example of it - except rhetorically when people want to try to understand why other humans are doing what they're doing

does that make sense?
 
tigerswood said:
Curious what your thoughts are on natural selection as it applies to humans as a concept. Especially when those humans make a conscious choice to avoid the "evolutionary" adaptation to negate that (potential) natural selection, and at the risk of the overall species.

Trying to think of a bird example for birdman but the whole consciousness thing is making it hard.
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If you think of intelligence as the trait being selected here, or at least one of the traits under selection, this analogy sort of works. Human intelligence (which "Consciousness" is a by product of) is definitely a trait that is and has been under selection for many many generations in humans, it is probably one of the few traits that still is still under environmental selective pressure (most other traits would be under sexual selection, a different type of evolution). The issue with an evolutionary perspective here, is that the trait selection has to happen before the individuals breed and pass their genes/traits on to the next generation, and Covid has the biggest effect on post-reproductive humans, i.e., the 60+ has mostly already had kids, and some of their kids have had kids. So there is not likely to be any significant change in the over all prevalence of intelligence traits over the course of generations and thus little or no evolution... because the dummies have already passed their genes on.

It should be noted that evolution operates at the individual level not the species. There is no, sort of, "risk to the species" in the equation for evolution, but we do measure it as changes in trait prevalence across the species.
 
personally i think the "i-don't-want-to-get-vaccinated" disorder is less about "dumb people" dying off and more about the logical outcome of feeding your population a strong individualistic ethos for decades mixed with hyperaccelerating flows of communication and entertainment which might have produced people who actively reject any sort of broad communal politics (beyond the group they ID with or support or "stan").

IOT, people become so confident in the sense of I that the sense of we atrophies - replaced by pretty meaningless participation in shades of patriotism or hatred/loathing for anyone who can be targeted as an Other or the chase of pure self-serving instinct - as that we dies we just get (1) the us v. them outcome that breeds a race to the bottom and (2) a population that looks only for personal incentive before altruistic behavior [see: million dollar vaccination lotteries]

i dunno just spitballing
 
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Makes sense - I figured it was a reach. Basically, was trying to put the "let the unvaxxed die" argument into something more scientific/evolutionary. I think that stance is absurdly harsh, but understand the premise.
 
TenaciousKory said:
maybe i'm not understanding your line of inquiry and i'm admittedly not a biologist, but my initial reaction is that natural selection is pretty strictly just a natural evolutionary pattern - not a tool for humans to wield (tech/rhetoric) or to understand the actions of humans in their lifetime (diagnostic).

my understanding of natural selection is that it takes place over such a long period of time that we struggle to wrap our heads around it since we only live for such a short period of time; people refusing the vaccine isn't really an example of it - except rhetorically when people want to try to understand why other humans are doing what they're doing

does that make sense?
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I strongly agree with this statement.

...and in response to your other post: right. My post was premised on the notion that intelligence was the selectable trait, but that is obviously simplistic. Intelligence is part of the problem, but intelligence, in the case of vaccine hesitancy anyway, of adults in America is a function of baseline brain power + education + culture + other stuff + more stuff. Plus there really isn't just one intelligence gene to be selected on or not... and we all know otherwise apparently really smart people, that get sucked into an internet rabbit hole and come out the other side believe in Pizza Parlor Child sex trafficking. So, I don't think we can just sit back and say "Welp, Covids cleanin' up the gene pool to get rid of all those dummies."
 
TenaciousKory said:
personally i think the "i-don't-want-to-get-vaccinated" disorder is less about "dumb people" dying off and more about the logical outcome of feeding your population a strong individualistic ethos for decades mixed with hyperaccelerating flows of communication and entertainment which might have produced people who actively reject any sort of broad communal politics (beyond the group they ID with or support or "stan").

IOT, people become so confident in the sense of I that the sense of we atrophies - replaced by pretty meaningless participation in shades of patriotism or hatred/loathing for anyone who can be targeted as an Other or the chase of pure self-serving instinct - as that we dies we just get (1) the us v. them outcome that breeds a race to the bottom and (2) a population that looks only for personal incentive before altruistic behavior [see: million dollar vaccination lotteries]

i dunno just spitballing
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Excellent post
 
SC DEAC said:
If you took today’s population and put them in 1941, I don’t think the USA could win a world war. Too many selfish, soft , complainers who would never be able to sacrifice for the common good. I mean , could you imagine any of these fucking cowards who complain about their masks in a boat approaching the shores of Normandy?
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It wouldn't even take that much. Can you hear these people complaining about rations?
 
SC DEAC said:
If you took today’s population and put them in 1941, I don’t think the USA could win a world war. Too many selfish, soft , complainers who would never be able to sacrifice for the common good. I mean , could you imagine any of these fucking cowards who complain about their masks in a boat approaching the shores of Normandy?
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We used to have civic pride. Now its just prideful cynics. The greatest generation had old man strength. Now we've got lazy a holes worried about their freedumbs.
 
SC DEAC said:
If you took today’s population and put them in 1941, I don’t think the USA could win a world war. Too many selfish, soft , complainers who would never be able to sacrifice for the common good. I mean , could you imagine any of these fucking cowards who complain about their masks in a boat approaching the shores of Normandy?
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Especially if you told them that they were storming the beach to eradicate Fascists from France…thus making them anti-fascists…no way they’d do it then.
 
TenaciousKory said:
the better metaphor would probably be "would you treat an adult who got hit by a car even though you knew it was dangerous to play in traffic, you told them, and they didn't listen to you because they thought they wouldn't get hit"
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I mean treat them in the hospital, but I’m not changing my behavior to protect someone who is choosing not to get the vaccine.
 
deaconson said:
We used to have civic pride. Now its just prideful cynics. The greatest generation had old man strength. Now we've got lazy a holes worried about their freedumbs.
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WFcatamount22 said:
I mean treat them in the hospital, but I’m not changing my behavior to protect someone who is choosing not to get the vaccine.
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SC DEAC said:
If you took today’s population and put them in 1941, I don’t think the USA could win a world war. Too many selfish, soft , complainers who would never be able to sacrifice for the common good. I mean , could you imagine any of these fucking cowards who complain about their masks in a boat approaching the shores of Normandy?
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There is a pretty significant overlap on people who served our country in the military and the people who are not wearing masks.
 
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