From the quad, conspicuous absence

BiffTannen said:

After two years of program building and consecutive 3-9 seasons, Clawson is 30-22 over four years. That's a great run of success at Wake Forest and he doesn't seem likely to run the thing into a ditch the way Grobe did, which basically caused the two 3-9 seasons.

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Cool. He’s still the coach at Wake Forest and not at a real football school.

BacktoBack said:

Do some of you morons even follow wake football? The guy hascs shit record because Grobe hit the links and left him a shit sandwich worth of talent. I don't recall the source but ACC head coach rankings on Twitter the other day he was near the top. This is unprecedented sustained success for Wake forest. That's not smoke and mirrors. The man knows what he's doing.

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Lord almighty, do you not understand the context in which the record was initially noted?

Clawson isn't getting a big time SEC or Big Ten job until he at least has a winning ACC season - fans would revolt.

Now, maybe he might get a middling job (either MSU, for example), and maybe that would be enough to take him from Wake.

rjequalsmj said:

The Manning should resign crew needs a reality check. He’d have to be a moron to walk away from the paycheck. We gave him the contract he’s entitled to the money. If we can’t raise the funds/ sack up and fire him that’s not his fault.

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The right thing to do is understand your under qualified for the job, negotiate a reasonable buyout, and walk away.

Continuing to run the program into the ground as a known failure is a disgrace and a complete disregard of responsibility and character as a man.

WFU Lurker said:

Lord almighty, do you not understand the context in which the record was initially noted?

Clawson isn't getting a big time SEC or Big Ten job until he at least has a winning ACC season - fans would revolt.

Now, maybe he might get a middling job (either MSU, for example), and maybe that would be enough to take him from Wake.

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For the record, both MSUs hired coaches this cycle and Clawson wasn’t really mentioned much for either.

WFcatamount22 said:

The right thing to do is understand your under qualified for the job, negotiate a reasonable buyout, and walk away.

Continuing to run the program into the ground as a known failure is a disgrace and a complete disregard of responsibility and character as a man.

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Exactly. This is about ability and character. Manning is turning himself into a caricature of incompetence laced greed. This will not serve his future career in basketball, if he has one, well. After his clueless failures at Wake and insistence on getting paid unearned and undeserved millions, can you imagine anyone thinking or saying, "Yeah, Danny Manning is a great guy, and he is exactly what our program needs?"

Kansas?
Dude doesn’t care about any of that. He already had a long NBA career and has “coached” several more. He always has a role at a blue blood as a back up. He’s not concerned.

PhDeac said:

For the record, both MSUs hired coaches this cycle and Clawson wasn’t really mentioned much for either.

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Yup...

And both hired coaches with very different backgrounds from Clawson.

rjequalsmj said:

The Manning should resign crew needs a reality check. He’d have to be a moron to walk away from the paycheck. We gave him the contract he’s entitled to the money. If we can’t raise the funds/ sack up and fire him that’s not his fault.

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There is no way that Manning should walk from his contract, but if he values his current players, and has any loyalty to the game of basketball, he should come to the negotiating table and work on a lengthened buyout that would protect the income from his contract, while at the same time honoring the dreams of the current and future players at Wake Forest.

He clearly cannot cut it as a head coach at this level, and any coach with a sense of honor for the game would have already figured a way out of town. I am honestly surprised the assistants have stayed, as any ball player or coach with any pride would not submit themselves to this kind of embarrassment. All of the assistants could probably find another job somewhere else and get their career back on track.

It’s only going to get worse, and every year the assistant stays, is another losing year on their record. Negotiate a Bobby Bonilla type of deal that lengthens the payout for the foreseeable future and go live your life. If Manning is our coach again next year, fan base needs to go scorched earth on the program. Hopefully Sarr will transfer and make the team so awful that the national media will stop making excuses for Manning.

I think we had a chance of getting rid of him before COVID-19 hit the nation, and now I think we are probably out of luck. Pretty unfortunate for those of us who made our college decision in part because we loved the basketball program. So sad.

Good post, Wrangor. I just don’t understand why he doesn’t make a deal and head back to Kansas.

PhDeac said:

Good post, Wrangor. I just don’t understand why he doesn’t make a deal and head back to Kansas.

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There's a lot of background uncertainty around Bill Self in addition to the Coronavirus situation.
Plus, Manning probably really believes he can figure out this coaching thing and enjoys doing it.
We owe him a lot of money.
There's no guarantee he could even get another job, even as an assistant.
Besides,Kansas, best as I can tell, doesn't have any staff openings.
There's plenty of reasons why he wouldn't just make a deal. It's just going to have to be something we can't guess.

shogun6066 said:

There's a lot of background uncertainty around Bill Self in addition to the Coronavirus situation.
Plus, Manning probably really believes he can figure out this coaching thing and enjoys doing it.
We owe him a lot of money.
There's no guarantee he could even get another job, even as an assistant.
Besides,Kansas, best as I can tell, doesn't have any staff openings.
There's plenty of reasons why he wouldn't just make a deal. It's just going to have to be something we can't guess.

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There's no way Manning thinks he can turn this around with what's coming back. He had a small chance last year with the pieces he had and completely blew it. I just honestly don't understand how you wouldn't negotiate some settlement, maybe like Wrangor said, that would draw out the payments for longer when you know all the fans hate you and want you gone. I would imagine anyone with any semblance of honor and millions in the bank would cut a deal and move on.

He may think the honorable thing is to not take the money and try to earn it.

I can imagine many people would continue doing a job they’re not good at doing instead of getting paid good money to quit. But that seems like his mentality.

Save face and move on. This is such a ridiculous situation.

I dunno, I was just sortve throwing out possible answers to Ph's open question on why he doesn't just go back to Kansas.
The truth is, none of us know what the hell Manning thinks of his situation... but he *has* been consistent in saying he loves coaching. Yes, yes, that seems crazy to us given how demonstrably terrible he is at it. Still, as Ph pointed out later; plenty of people stay in jobs/careers/hobbys/etc even though they completely suck at it because they enjoy it. All the while oblivious they're doing more harm than good; after all, denial ain't just a river in Egypt.
So yeah, I wouldn't be shocked if Manning honestly believes he can succeed. That he's just one good break from turning it around. One good overlooked diamond in the rough recruit. One more staff reshuffle from the right combination.
The man's prideful, stubborn, and definitely has a competitive personality. That worked for him as a player. It doesn't as a coach.

We know he doesn’t blame himself. From his perspective, the players just need to do what he tells them to do and make their shots.

PhDeac said:

We know he doesn’t blame himself. From his perspective, the players just need to do what he tells them to do and make their shots.

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And get paint touches. And get to the free throw line.

And stay in front of your man.... DFL hangin' his hat on defense. :dumb: