WFU makes international news - for pricing out the middle class

[CamelCityDeac]

Administration bloat is one of the larger problems affecting the increase in tuition. Many colleges, Wake Forest included, have really expanded there administration by adding things like the Office of Sustainability and other departments you wouldn't have seen twenty years ago.

Every administrator wants to expand their office and hire more people to work under them, and thus something that used to be handled by one person is now handled by six. This increase in salary is then transferred over as a cost to students. While new facilities and services certainly play a role in the rising cost of tuition, administrative bloat is pretty large factor.

For reference: http://goldwaterinstitute.org/sites/default/files/Administrative Bloat.pdf

Edit: Quote from Article :"For example, at Wake Forest University, administrative spending per student has increased by more than 600 percent in real terms." Page 11. In reference to the years from 1993 to 2007.

 

[PhDeac]

To CamelCity's point, the bloat is because everyone wants more out of the university. Students want more services and resources. Faculty want more support. Alumni and donors want more ass kissing. The community wants more outreach. Fans want better sports teams. And who gets the bill at private universities? The people who can pay for it.

Technology is a huge driver for this. It has expanded infrastructure and made it easier for these parties to express their needs and have their needs met.

 

[marquee moon]

gable's hair > sense

More money than > sense

Wake is not worth 60k

What a fucking joke

 

[Ron Burgundy]

The problem is that many families in the middle class got there by hard work and years of living within a budget. It doesn't make sense to spend $60k on an education where you can get one just as good for a third of the cost. I am in this group- while I make a six figure income, I don't drive a Porche, I don't live in a mega mansion, and I don't have a summer home in the Hamptons. I try spend my money wisely and make good use of the resources that I have.

I wasn't born with money- my Dad barely made $20k a year for most of my childhood. But, he instilled in me a work ethic that has served me well. Wake just isn't a good use of my money right now. When I was a freshman at Wake, the tuition was $10,500. Now it is $60,000. Wake doesn't seem to be much better than it was when I was there- certainly not 571% better. North Carolina has plenty of state schools to choose from that offer a fine education.

My undergrad was at Wake, my MBA was from a state school. In my profession, the MBA is much more valuable. The Wake degree is just a checked box on a form. I could have gotten it anywhere.

 

[marquee moon]

The problem is that many families in the middle class got there by hard work and years of living within a budget. It doesn't make sense to spend $60k on an education where you can get one just as good for a third of the cost. I am in this group- while I make a six figure income, I don't drive a Porche, I don't live in a mega mansion, and I don't have a summer home in the Hamptons. I try spend my money wisely and make good use of the resources that I have.

I wasn't born with money- my Dad barely made $20k a year for most of my childhood. But, he instilled in me a work ethic that has served me well. Wake just isn't a good use of my money right now. When I was a freshman at Wake, the tuition was $10,500. Now it is $60,000. Wake doesn't seem to be much better than it was when I was there- certainly not 571% better. North Carolina has plenty of state schools to choose from that offer a fine education.

My undergrad was at Wake, my MBA was from a state school. In my profession, the MBA is much more valuable. The Wake degree is just a checked box on a form. I could have gotten it anywhere.

Sounds like we were there around the same time.

 

[dartsndeacs]

Wake's only worth it if you're the parent of a daughter, only way to ensure they don't end up going on girls gone wild is making them stay at Johnson.

 

[jhmd2000]

From my experience as a student at two elite private universities and a professor at a lower tier regional public, the main drivers are demand, prestige, and infrastructure.

As a larger percentage of students earn college degrees, it's more important to differentiate between those degrees.

Loans make it easier to afford the price tag and they're plentiful and long term, it is worth the price for the right schools and situation.

There's a sense of "you get what you pay for" that you see for other commodities.

I'll can talk more about infrastructure later tonight.

#nonhumblebrag

 

[jhmd2000]

To CamelCity's point, the bloat is because everyone wants more out of the university. Students want more services and resources. Faculty want more support. Alumni and donors want more ass kissing. The community wants more outreach. Fans want better sports teams. And who gets the bill at private universities? The people who can pay for it.

Technology is a huge driver for this. It has expanded infrastructure and made it easier for these parties to express their needs and have their needs met.

I thought we were talking about Wake Forest.

 

[jhmd2000]

Completely agree. As someone who works in admissions, it is very evident that people have very different ideas about what they should pay. I have to laugh when families with over a million dollars in assets and mid 6 digit salaries feel like they should receive need-based financial aid. At the same time, there are indeed folks for whom a $60k cost is too expensive. Though for many the model seems "broken" (high tuition costs that keep rising) there are plenty of people who don't bat an eye to pay it. Hell, for some parents, college is a price break from what they were paying for boarding school for their kids.

And we're bringing these well-adjusted young people to Wake Forest.

 

[GardenStateDeac]

And we're bringing these well-adjusted young people to Wake Forest.

Just because someone has different priorities or a different upbringing doesn't mean that their an asshole. We had our share of assholes at Wake and they spanned the socioeconomic spectrum.

 

[WRS]

The problem is that many families in the middle class got there by hard work and years of living within a budget. It doesn't make sense to spend $60k on an education where you can get one just as good for a third of the cost. I am in this group- while I make a six figure income, I don't drive a Porche, I don't live in a mega mansion, and I don't have a summer home in the Hamptons. I try spend my money wisely and make good use of the resources that I have.

I wasn't born with money- my Dad barely made $20k a year for most of my childhood. But, he instilled in me a work ethic that has served me well. Wake just isn't a good use of my money right now. When I was a freshman at Wake, the tuition was $10,500. Now it is $60,000. Wake doesn't seem to be much better than it was when I was there- certainly not 571% better. North Carolina has plenty of state schools to choose from that offer a fine education.

My undergrad was at Wake, my MBA was from a state school. In my profession, the MBA is much more valuable. The Wake degree is just a checked box on a form. I could have gotten it anywhere.

If by plenty you mean "two" then I somewhat agree with you. State is a pretty mediocre school outside of a couple worthwhile programs. The other state schools are just garbage.

 

[89DeaconMike]

With the shrinking job situation in the US not sure any college makes much of a difference. Look at the unemployment rates for graduates. Most of the jobs we are adding in this country don't require higher education. The situation is only going to get worse. We don't build or make anything. You can't add service jobs forever. The number of people paying for "service" is going to go down.

 

[Say Hey Deac]

If by plenty you mean "two" then I somewhat agree with you. State is a pretty mediocre school outside of a couple worthwhile programs. The other state schools are just garbage.

I'm trying to guess which public school you consider to be the 2nd one, or are you saying NCSU is the 2nd one, but it is mediocre? In any event, I disagree. I've known some pretty sharp people who came from App State and UNC-W, in addition to UNC and NCSU. As it becomes even more difficult to get into UNC, I imagine the quality of student at the other schools will increase as well.

 

[marquee moon]

Susie Orman thinks parents are crazy to sacrifice their retirement and students can't realistically handle 80 - 100 thousand or more in debt at graduation. She says kids should work, go to community college and if they have a goal and are serious about education transfer to 4 year. Otherwise get a 2 year degree in an area that will lead to a job.

 

[Shorty]

I'm trying to guess which public school you consider to be the 2nd one, or are you saying NCSU is the 2nd one, but it is mediocre? In any event, I disagree. I've known some pretty sharp people who came from App State and UNC-W, in addition to UNC and NCSU. As it becomes even more difficult to get into UNC, I imagine the quality of student at the other schools will increase as well.

There had better be smart people coming out of App State and UNC-W. Along with WCU, those schools are turning out many, many of NC's primary and secondary school teachers.

 

[PhDeac]

Increase teacher pay and more schools would be turning our more teachers.

 

[PhDeac]

With the shrinking job situation in the US not sure any college makes much of a difference. Look at the unemployment rates for graduates. Most of the jobs we are adding in this country don't require higher education. The situation is only going to get worse. We don't build or make anything. You can't add service jobs forever. The number of people paying for "service" is going to go down.

Unemployment rates for college graduates are far lower than for high school graduates. That's the main justification to overpay for a bachelors degree.

 

[bullets]

#nonhumblebrag

huh? that didnt sound like bragging at all. he even admitted he teaches at a lower tier school.

 

[buckets]

Susie Orman thinks parents are crazy to sacrifice their retirement and students can't realistically handle 80 - 100 thousand or more in debt at graduation. She says kids should work, go to community college and if they have a goal and are serious about education transfer to 4 year. Otherwise get a 2 year degree in an area that will lead to a job.

In California, it's surprisingly pretty common to start at a community college then finish up at a public school (UCLA, Cal, UCSD, etc). Seems like on the east coast you're assumed to be a donk that couldn't get in anywhere out of hs if you do that.

 

[bullets]

Susie Orman thinks parents are crazy to sacrifice their retirement and students can't realistically handle 80 - 100 thousand or more in debt at graduation. She says kids should work, go to community college and if they have a goal and are serious about education transfer to 4 year. Otherwise get a 2 year degree in an area that will lead to a job.

how many times has suze orman been bankrupt?