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Official Hoops Coaching Search Thread - Welcome Danny Manning!!!

Tobacco Road said:
Yes, there are rumors by people who thinks Shaka isn't coming to why he might not. There are lots of rumors going around. Doesn't make them a whisper campaign.
It seems the settling comment(s) was made prior to any decision from Shaka.
By those standards, almost any comment about a coach can be considered a "campaign".
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If you don't believe rumors and insinuations have a source that benefits from them, you won't consider anything to be a campaign.
 
PhDeac said:
If you don't believe rumors and insinuations have a source that benefits from them, you won't consider anything to be a campaign.
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Yeah, you are being somewhat condescending there. Sure, some do put things out to their benefit. Everyone knows that but it doesn't mean that every rumor is to meet an end like that. In another thread you portrayed the "settling" as a genuine belief of the Wake brass but that we should be wary as they are out of touch. Here you seem to be changing it to not being genuine and rather to justify why Shaka isn't here. "We didn't want him." Which is it? Quite honestly, we don't even know who has been offered and what those responses are. If we get Shaka, do you think you were wrong that the campaign has already started?

ETA: reread and don't think you were being condescending, but rather just taking the other side from my comment to show how one could always ignore a "campaign". sorry.
 
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Not sure if this was posted in all the mudslinging or not:

Andy Katz @ESPNAndyKatz
Source: Boise State's Leon Rice decided to stay, accept pay raise, 5-year rollover instead of continuing talks w/Wazzu after interviewing.
about 1 hour ago
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Apologies if it was but I couldn't read half the crap over the past few hours.
 
I was trying to end the argument because we couldn't agree on terms.

I think there are some people who don't want him.

I think there are others who will convince themselves that they didn't want him over who we end up getting and make whatever argument is necessary to make them feel better about it.

Call it sour grapes or cognitive dissonance or whatever. It's something we've seen before. What's going to be interesting is how hard the brass try to spread the believe that whoever we get was the clear #1 choice.
 
PhDeac said:
I didn't say "Pro Humanitate" was an excuse to justify losing.
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Whatever. You always try to proclaim you said or intended something different when the implications of what you wrote suggest otherwise. You can't even stay focused on who might constitute a good coach at this point - asking me to go back and analyze whether Carl Tacy was like Nick Saban. WTF?

Never mind that you seem to be off on some random tangent about how the school or other forces are setting up our fans to talk down guys who may reject us. That's just flat out stupid. How many different styles of tin foil hats are you designing right now? You're insinuating about campaigns to justify hires that have yet to happen and whirling about how people will turn on Shaka if he doesn't come to Wake. No shit sherlock. We wouldn't need an article by Disco Dan prompting us to rationalize why Shaka wasn't the best fit if he elects to go elsewhere. Human nature will take care of that all by itself. And human nature also says a huge portion of our fan base will rationalize why whomever we do hire is the right fit, regardless of who it is.
 
PhDeac said:
I was trying to end the argument because we couldn't agree on terms.

I think there are some people who don't want him.

I think there are others who will convince themselves that they didn't want him over who we end up getting and make whatever argument is necessary to make them feel better about it.

Call it sour grapes or cognitive dissonance or whatever. It's something we've seen before. What's going to be interesting is how hard the brass try to spread the believe that whoever we get was the clear #1 choice.
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We saw this with Lembo vs. Clawson as well.
 
PhDeac said:
It already started. This week people were posting that they heard Shaka wasn't sure about dealing with recruiting restrictions. The vague "settling" comment in Dan's column is another example.
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Tobacco Road said:
Yes, there are rumors by people who thinks Shaka isn't coming to why he might not. There are lots of rumors going around. Doesn't make them a whisper campaign.
It seems the settling comment(s) was made prior to any decision from Shaka.
By those standards, almost any comment about a coach can be considered a "campaign".
Click to expand...

I think y'all are splitting hairs here.

When Shaka officially doesn't come to Wake, it will be because he's not "one of us," and that rhetoric is going to shine through in every message board post on TOBs, by a lot of folks on here, in Disco Dan's writing, passively aggressively in Ron's presser for our new coach, etc. etc.

Call it a whisper campaign, call it whispers, call it gossip. It's as predictable as the sunrise.

It sucks and, unfortunately, it seems like it's the very embodiment of the Wake Forest way.
 
Were we turned down by Lembo? You think the Lembo comments are sour grapes? Seemed to me Clawson came in and owned the show and won support. I don't think there were whisper campaigns to make that happen.
I think OTP came in and worked some people into a frenzy as they didn't have anything better to go on. Once the dust settled and reality set in, I think people felt we made a good hire. That's all.
 
Tobacco Road said:
Were we turned down by Lembo? You think the Lembo comments are sour grapes? Seemed to me Clawson came in and owned the show and won support. I don't think there were whisper campaigns to make that happen.
I think OTP came in and worked some people into a frenzy as they didn't have anything better to go on. Once the dust settled and reality set in, I think people felt we made a good hire. That's all.
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I agree with this. I think it was a pretty shitty comparison, though. I do think the point stands and we'll start seeing it pretty soon. Regardless of what happens, Shaka is a 1a-caliber coaching prospect. We'd be blessed to have him and wherever he ends up will be, too.
 
Tobacco Road said:
Were we turned down by Lembo? You think the Lembo comments are sour grapes? Seemed to me Clawson came in and owned the show and won support. I don't think there were whisper campaigns to make that happen.
I think OTP came in and worked some people into a frenzy as they didn't have anything better to go on. Once the dust settled and reality set in, I think people felt we made a good hire. That's all.
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I mean, we flew the plane to Muncie. Everything was 100% Lembo positive. Then we started hearing the rumors that he's abrasive, wouldn't get along with Wellman, not a good fit for WF, would push too hard for stuff we can't afford, etc. Where did all that come from? Publications? No.

I like Clawson and think he's going to do great; that has nothing to do with this.

In public, Wellman loves to spin stuff, ESPECIALLY negative stuff. You think he doesn't use back channels to spin perception among the big fish and have that trickle down to the fanbase? Be serious.
 
PhDeac said:
It's a cheap crutch to justify losing. If we lose, we're doing it the right way. When others win, they're not. No question if Shaka doesn't come here, there will be a whisper campaign that he just wasn't a "Wake Forest guy" and wanted to rely on players who weren't "Wake Forest guys."
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IrishSlim said:
This feels right to me, but the problem with using the term in question as loosely as its been done recently (by both our athletic department and the academic administration) is that it's a complete cipher. It's anything and nothing, to anyone and no one, all at the same time. We'd be way better off returning to pushing the "Pro Humanitate" vision in our public dispatches, IMO, because that's something that has parameters - and accessible, practical ones at that.
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DeacMan said:
I don't think it is bullshit. There is a "Wake Forest guy" and it simply means he isn't a scumbag. Whether Marshall is a scumbag is another question entirely. But I think that was what was most likely being implied.
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I think I've found your problem, DeacMan. You don't really follow conversations, so you pick up bits and pieces and draw your own conclusions. You have a preconceived notion about me and you will do whatever it takes to fit it. Earlier today you deleted part of my quote in order to ask a dumb question that I already answered in the part you deleted. You must believe I'm against humanity or against Wake Forest or something like that because you've ignored the actual words I've posted to make it seem like I'm against the university motto.

I was continuing the discussion about "Wake Forest guy" not "Pro Humanitate". Any reasonable person without an ax to grind would have picked that up given that I mentioned the term "Wake Forest guy" twice in my post.
 
PhDeac said:
I think I've found your problem, DeacMan. You don't really follow conversations, so you pick up bits and pieces and draw your own conclusions. You have a preconceived notion about me and you will do whatever it takes to fit it. Earlier today you deleted part of my quote in order to ask a dumb question that I already answered in the part you deleted. You must believe I'm against humanity or against Wake Forest or something like that because you've ignored the actual words I've posted to make it seem like I'm against the university motto.

I was continuing the discussion about "Wake Forest guy" not "Pro Humanitate". Any reasonable person without an ax to grind would have picked that up given that I mentioned the term "Wake Forest guy" twice in my post.
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LOL. You quote things out of order and have left out parts of the dialogue I was having with Irish. Clearly I'm the one just picking up bits and pieces.

But, hey, after reading about 80,000 of your vague and inane posts, I'm sure my notions of you remain entirely "preconceived".
 
I was wondering if I needed to specifically reorder the quotes from top to bottom rather than just leaving them as they were after clicking the "+ button. For some reason, I thought you weren't going to whine about it. I know better now.

Just do everybody a favor and read first before popping into a conversation like you know everything. It's all too common on the Tunnels. You make points everybody else has already made an act like a genius. Don't start doing it here, too.
 
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