Danny Manning Credibility Watch

[DeacsATS]

Jan 2018: Just wait until we get our freshman on campus. We lack talent and next year's class solves it.

Jan 2019: You can't expect to rely on freshman. Manning needs more time to show what he can do with an experienced team.

I don't think you'll have many (any) folks around here taking that stance. I am a Manning-IN guy that is quickly running out of patience. If things aren't clearly moving in a better direction at this time next year, I'll be 100% ready to move on.

This year has been painful, but I am in the camp that says losing Dinos on July 29th was a really big deal. Couple that with the inexplicable regression of Crawford, and you get a team that plays a lot of close games without being able to get over the hump.

 

[netflixnchildres]

Is Woods on track to graduate this year? I'd hate to see him go somewhere as a post-grad but would understand if he did.

I don't think Woods would leave. When healthy he is doing very well at Wake, and after transferring up from Charlotte I doubt he would want to leave the ACC.

 

[netflixnchildres]

Crazy thought but maybe Manning could gauge if his old teammate Dan Majerle would have any interest in joining as an "associate head coach" next year? Majerle knew how to defend his man in the NBA, could coach up the guards, and has had some success coaching at Grand Canyon University. He could be an overly high paid assistant (guessing around $750K) that comes in and allows Manning to focus on the offense while he focuses on the defense. FYI Grand Canyon currently is #28 in the country in defense.

 

[CharlotteDeac1]

I don't think you'll have many (any) folks around here taking that stance. I am a Manning-IN guy that is quickly running out of patience. If things aren't clearly moving in a better direction at this time next year, I'll be 100% ready to move on.

This year has been painful, but I am in the camp that says losing Dinos on July 29th was a really big deal. Couple that with the inexplicable regression of Crawford, and you get a team that plays a lot of close games without being able to get over the hump.

Yes to all of this

 

[knowell]

Jan 2018: Just wait until we get our freshman on campus. We lack talent and next year's class solves it.

Jan 2019: You can't expect to rely on freshman. Manning needs more time to show what he can do with an experienced team.

Been hearing this since Dino was fired.

I am SURE we will hear this a lot. By no means will this be the only excuse when we, again, fail to reach the tournament.

 

[DeacsATS]

Been hearing this since Dino was fired.

I am SURE we will hear this a lot. By no means will this be the only excuse when we, again, fail to reach the tournament.

There are (maybe) 5-10 folks around here who even bother to defend Manning anymore. I'd put myself in that group, but I'm not particular vocal given there hasn't been a lot to praise during this losing streak. If Manning falls flat on his face next year, I can't imagine you'll see those 5-10 posters offering excuses for shitty results and arguing for more Manning. It'll be ugly around here, but you'll have near-unanimous support for a new coach.

 

[scooter84]

Given our program's history, it seems people are fairly confident we'll see some attrition after this season due to transfers (I tend to agree). Isn't that just a built-in excuse for Manning supporters for yet another poor performance in 2019, a la JC and Dinos' early departures?

Depends on who leaves.

 

[RJKarl]

I don't think you'll have many (any) folks around here taking that stance. I am a Manning-IN guy that is quickly running out of patience. If things aren't clearly moving in a better direction at this time next year, I'll be 100% ready to move on.

This year has been painful, but I am in the camp that says losing Dinos on July 29th was a really big deal. Couple that with the inexplicable regression of Crawford, and you get a team that plays a lot of close games without being able to get over the hump.

No Dance in 18-19, no Manning in 19-20. Pretty simple...

 

[CharlotteDeac1]

Just curious, how many of you expect one of Hoard, Chaundee, or Sarr to play their way into the draft after next year? None are on any Mock draft, and if we returned that group + Mucius and Chill that's a very good starting lineup to follow what I believe to be a good year and NCAA tourney appearance/win

 

[PhDeac]

I don't, but that's what at least one would have to do for us to be a well-seeded tournament team next year.

 

[sportsnut]

I have no minimum for Manning, none. Even if he goes ofer the next 3 years I am fine with keeping him UNTIL Ron Wellman is gone and no longer involved in the hiring process. That has become the overarching criteria for Wake Basketball to me, not who the coach is (although I think Manning is sub par). Firing him and allowing Ron to hire another one would just extend the suckitude much longer

 

[Demonwolverine]

Just curious, how many of you expect one of Hoard, Chaundee, or Sarr to play their way into the draft after next year? None are on any Mock draft, and if we returned that group + Mucius and Chill that's a very good starting lineup to follow what I believe to be a good year and NCAA tourney appearance/win

I think Sarr is the most likely. There are lots of athletic slashers, but seven footers with finesse? Not so much. He would clearly be a multi-year project for any NBA team, so they probably wouldn't take the risk after next year, but it's not unheard of that an NBA team would prefer to guide a big man's development.

With that said, I don't think any of them will be going pro after next season.

 

[scooter84]

I don't, but that's what at least one would have to do for us to be a well-seeded tournament team next year.

I don't think this is necessarily true. They all just have to play well and our other guys progress and play together. Best case scenario is that they play well enough to be mentioned in draft projections and maybe projected borderline 1st round, but not high enough to actually go...

 

[DeacsATS]

I don't, but that's what at least one would have to do for us to be a well-seeded tournament team next year.

I agreed with this at first, but now I'm not so sure.

Assuming no real turnover, next year's team also brings back Moore, Crawford, and Woods. That means the improvement comes from inserting Hoard/Mucius into Thompson/Wilbekin minutes. You'll also have freshman to sophomore year improvement from Sarr/Brown (and more minutes). And maybe Crawford is able to steal back his talent from the Space Jam Nerdlucks that took it from him a month or two ago.

To be very good, yeah, you'd need Hoard to be at or near a "one and done" level... But I think the complete roster is good enough to be upper half in ACC without Hoard/Sarr/Brown being good enough to bolt for the NBA.

And I hate that this is the stuff I have to look forward to when we're not even out of January of this season.

 

[awaken]

Remember that even if someone else does the hiring, the new bball coach would still have to work for/with Wellman. I don't think the coaching fraternity wants to do that.

 

[CantStandYa]

I agreed with this at first, but now I'm not so sure.

Assuming no real turnover, next year's team also brings back Moore, Crawford, and Woods. That means the improvement comes from inserting Hoard/Mucius into Thompson/Wilbekin minutes. You'll also have freshman to sophomore year improvement from Sarr/Brown (and more minutes). And maybe Crawford is able to steal back his talent from the Space Jam Nerdlucks that took it from him a month or two ago.

To be very good, yeah, you'd need Hoard to be at or near a "one and done" level... But I think the complete roster is good enough to be upper half in ACC without Hoard/Sarr/Brown being good enough to bolt for the NBA.

And I hate that this is the stuff I have to look forward to when we're not even out of January of this season.

Football season is seven months away!

 

[Deaconblue]

I agreed with this at first, but now I'm not so sure.

Assuming no real turnover, next year's team also brings back Moore, Crawford, and Woods. That means the improvement comes from inserting Hoard/Mucius into Thompson/Wilbekin minutes. You'll also have freshman to sophomore year improvement from Sarr/Brown (and more minutes). And maybe Crawford is able to steal back his talent from the Space Jam Nerdlucks that took it from him a month or two ago.

To be very good, yeah, you'd need Hoard to be at or near a "one and done" level... But I think the complete roster is good enough to be upper half in ACC without Hoard/Sarr/Brown being good enough to bolt for the NBA.

And I hate that this is the stuff I have to look forward to when we're not even out of January of this season.

The key to the rest of this season is Crawford finding his basketball brain. Apparently he misplaced it at the beginning of winter break, and is still looking for it.

 

[tigerswood]

The Crawford/Space Jam/Monstar analogy is hilarious and applicable. Need Bugs and co to help him out.

 

[tagsfan]

Is Woods on track to graduate this year? I'd hate to see him go somewhere as a post-grad but would understand if he did.

I don't think Woods would leave. When healthy he is doing very well at Wake, and after transferring up from Charlotte I doubt he would want to leave the ACC.

I hope you're right. He sounds very frustrated in his post-game comments and may have assumed we would be competitive.

 

[BlackjackMc]

Remember that even if someone else does the hiring, the new bball coach would still have to work for/with Wellman. I don't think the coaching fraternity wants to do that.

Assume the team loses twenty games this year and fails to make the Dance next year. At that point Manning detractors and supporters seem to agree it is time for a new coach. Assume that Ron Wellman remains the AD and has the full support of Hatch and the BOT. sportsnut, awaken and myself have all cautioned that Wellman is the primary problem. However both detractors and supporters have avoided addressing this problem. Anyone care to discuss this issue in a realistic manner?