It is a “but Venezuela” take though. You are using the historical lack of successful socialist policies without dealing with the history of how those movements have been suppressed by violence.
The New Socialists
- Thread starter MHBDemon
- Start date
- Latest activity Latest activity:
It is a “but Venezuela” take though. You are using the historical lack of successful socialist policies without dealing with the history of how those movements have been suppressed by violence.
Like?
China and Russia have been huge polluters.
ImTheCaptain
I disagree with you
lol man you guys are ridiculous
WFcatamount22
Well-known member
They caused the extinction of the magafaunel so your point is debunked. Continue.
WFcatamount22
Well-known member
That's not real socialism take in 3... 2... 1....
RChildress107
Well-known member
At least I’ve proposed a short term strategy (or any strategy for that matter). The only short-medium term strategy for implementing DSA ideas that doesn’t involve Democrats regaining power is waiting for Republicans to destroy our democracy and hoping DSA comes out on top in the aftermath.
I share your belief (maybe naively) that in a vacuum most poor white rural voters would vote based on their economic interests rather than racial animus, but they don’t live in a vacuum. Maybe there are DSA candidates who can break through the bubble poor white rural Americans live in, but history tells us Bernie is not that guy.
There are plenty of candidates in the space between Bernie and Clare McCaskill, however, who will move the country meaningfully to the left and, more importantly, help restore a system where politicians and policies with majority support can get passed.
RChildress107
Well-known member
Well you told me NZ was and you were wrong, so you tell me. Are/were they and for which periods of time?
WFcatamount22
Well-known member
By someone pushing school choice, privatization bullshit.
PhDeac
PM a mod to cement your internet status forever
- Joined
- Mar 16, 2011
- Messages
- 155,401
- Reaction score
- 22,422
[h=1]Word to the Unwise: Black Voters Will Reject Any 2020 Democratic Candidate Who Trashes Obama to Appease the Far Left[/h]
Look, Obama, like every president who came before him, was imperfect. I personally wanted him to go bigger during the height of the financial crisis and spend billions, not just shoring up Wall Street—a necessary evil, given the state of the economy in 2009—but directly bailing out individual homeowners. And I wanted some high-profile perp walks of corporate executives, which we never got. Those were Obama policy failures, and they weren’t the only ones. He made mistakes on immigration and in foreign policy. His biggest regret is how he handled Libya. I questioned his drone war, knowing it was negatively affecting and killing too many innocent people, although I never saw someone describe an equally-effective alternative in the war on terror. I am partial to the idea of universal health care, given what I know about a system that still leaves too many people behind. And I didn’t appreciate some of the language in his speeches about absentee fathers.
We all know Obama isn’t Jesus. And we never wanted nor expected him to be.
But too many far-left liberals, many (but not all) of them white, seem so focused on his imperfections that they have all but ignored his enormous accomplishments, which include his helping stave off a second Great Depression; a health reform law that has literally been saving tens of thousands of lives every year, while improving millions of others, since it was adopted in 2010; saving a couple of million jobs by saving the domestic auto industry; establishing a consumer protection bureau that has saved everyday Americans billions of dollars; commuting more prison sentences than all previous presidents combined while beginning criminal justice reform efforts that are beginning to bear more fruit; and overseeing an economy that went on the longest monthly job creation streak in history and produced the largest annual increase in income in the nation’s history, with most of that increase going to the poor and middle class. Those are among the reasons he was one of the most progressive presidents this country has ever known. And he did more to fight inequality than most of his predecessors.
Look, Obama, like every president who came before him, was imperfect. I personally wanted him to go bigger during the height of the financial crisis and spend billions, not just shoring up Wall Street—a necessary evil, given the state of the economy in 2009—but directly bailing out individual homeowners. And I wanted some high-profile perp walks of corporate executives, which we never got. Those were Obama policy failures, and they weren’t the only ones. He made mistakes on immigration and in foreign policy. His biggest regret is how he handled Libya. I questioned his drone war, knowing it was negatively affecting and killing too many innocent people, although I never saw someone describe an equally-effective alternative in the war on terror. I am partial to the idea of universal health care, given what I know about a system that still leaves too many people behind. And I didn’t appreciate some of the language in his speeches about absentee fathers.
We all know Obama isn’t Jesus. And we never wanted nor expected him to be.
But too many far-left liberals, many (but not all) of them white, seem so focused on his imperfections that they have all but ignored his enormous accomplishments, which include his helping stave off a second Great Depression; a health reform law that has literally been saving tens of thousands of lives every year, while improving millions of others, since it was adopted in 2010; saving a couple of million jobs by saving the domestic auto industry; establishing a consumer protection bureau that has saved everyday Americans billions of dollars; commuting more prison sentences than all previous presidents combined while beginning criminal justice reform efforts that are beginning to bear more fruit; and overseeing an economy that went on the longest monthly job creation streak in history and produced the largest annual increase in income in the nation’s history, with most of that increase going to the poor and middle class. Those are among the reasons he was one of the most progressive presidents this country has ever known. And he did more to fight inequality than most of his predecessors.
DeaconSig
Well-known member
Obama isn’t a true Scotsman.
Is the Root article not also pushing a monolithic black vote narrative? It seemingly pushes aside the fact that there are plenty of black leftists with criticisms of Obama. And I would say that most of my political education in recent years I owe to black voices like Angela Davis or Keeanga-Yamahtta Taylor or Mariame Kaba.
I generally don’t like any takes that serve to shield people from criticism, and i think we should sometimes be mindful of the limits of one person amidst American empire. But Obama was undoubtedly a centrist and leftists should definitely continue to make the case against Obama’s legacy.
ImTheCaptain
I disagree with you
Obama worse than Trump?
Neither is ignoring his failures and reckoning with the limits of neoliberalism.
PhDeac
PM a mod to cement your internet status forever
- Joined
- Mar 16, 2011
- Messages
- 155,401
- Reaction score
- 22,422
There’s a different between calling Obama a failure and saying he could have done more.
And neither recognizes why he didn’t. Progressives were dormant for 8 years. There was no real pressure from the left, even Bernie.