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2017 NBA Draft thread - JC drafted 19th to Atlanta, OUR... Hawks?

And that could be a bad take if Bagley comes out like a healthy Embiid.
 
Embiid is the only recent big to make an All-star game within his first two seasons.
 
PhDeac said:
Embiid is the only recent big to make an All-star game within his first two seasons.
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Embiid was drafted in 2014. He received his first ASG invite in 2018. Guessing the two seasons he didn't play don't count as his first two seasons.
 
Pilchard said:
Embiid was drafted in 2014. He received his first ASG invite in 2018. Guessing the two seasons he didn't play don't count as his first two seasons.
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He was All-Rookie 1st team last year.
 
PhDeac said:
He was All-Rookie 1st team last year.
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He's also from Cameroon, but neither that fact nor making the all-rookie team three years after he was drafted is the same as making the ASG in his first two seasons.
 
So you’re making a whole argument based on the fact that I selected Embiid as an example of a young big who made an early impact.

You don’t think that’s a silly thing to argue about? What should I have said instead?
 
I don't even dislike Bagley. I think he's a pretty good prospect. But I'm with Vad that I think Luka is a slam dunk #1 over Ayton, JJJ and Bagley etc. I'd take Bagley #4.

ETA: I think there is a drop off after #4.
 
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JuiceCrewAllStar said:
It can be true that both a) the NCAA is a better source of talent and b) that success in a top European league is a better indicator of NBA success
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Obviously. One is amateur and one is pro.
 
came here to read 2&2's expert draft analysis but stayed for ph's expert comparisons.
 
I'm torn on Bagley much the same way I am with Ayton. I really distrust big guys that cannot defend, especially at lower levels where they have massive athletic advantages and should be great on that end even without terrific instincts. I would feel shaky building my team around a post player who does not protect the rim - the thing that makes guys like AD & Embiid stand out is their terrific defense in addition to the scoring they bring. I cannot see either Ayton or Bagley ever being more than "ok" defensively, and that gives me the heebie-jeebies. Still prefer Ayton as a prospect because he can actually shoot the ball and use both hands and I think has a better chance to be good defensively. Bagley seems to me to be the classic case of athleticism over any form of skill, a guy who simply jumps better than everyone else his age and thus dominates for a while until the rest catch up physically. He can't shoot, he can't use his right hand, he's a 0 defensively. He has amazing springs and he is a relentless rebounder, but man - there's a lot about him that scares the shit out of me if I was building an NBA franchise around his skillset.

Top 5 for me is:

#1 - Doncic
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#2 - Jaren Jackson Jr.
#3 - Deandre Ayton
#4 - Mikal Bridges
#5 - Mo Bamba
 
FWIW - I think there is a very good chance Wendell Carter Jr. is a better pro than Bagley. Less flashy and athletic for sure, but he is an excellent passer, hits catch and shoot 3's at a high % and is a substantially better defender. For a modern NBA big, being able to make that 2nd pass and find shooters from pick and roll action or be able to space the floor around PnR is hugely valuable, and again - he can actually defend.

I do not think he will be a star, but I bet he has a very long career in the NBA. He just does the things that good teams want from their bigs.
 
JuiceCrewAllStar said:
Bagley is skilled, don't be dense
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His shooting is erratic at best and he only drives and finishes with one hand (his left). His elite athleticism and motor overcome a lot of that, but let's not pretend otherwise.

He is an Amare Stoudemire type player - and I wonder if there is a ceiling there that limits his draft value.
 
vadimivich said:
His shooting is erratic at best and he only drives and finishes with one hand (his left). His elite athleticism and motor overcome a lot of that, but let's not pretend otherwise.

He is an Amare Stoudemire type player - and I wonder if there is a ceiling there that limits his draft value.
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Hmmm. Amare was a 20/10 player consistently until his microsurgery. Your comparison only confirms a #1 or #2 pick. You keep picking the wrong guys for comparison purposes.
 
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