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F is for Fascism (Ferguson MO)

I am probably going to get shat on for this perspective here in the Tunnels...but...he clearly reached his hand back where the police not could not see it, twice, after being specifically told not to do that exact thing. The police were on the scene because it was reported Shaver had a gun. If I were the policeman I'd be scared that he was reaching for a gun. Shaver should have answered affirmative when they asked if he was drunk. I don't know...if I am sitting on the Jury, I don't think I convict based on that video. Obviously there is more data presented at trial for people to consider.
 
I watched that video in full last night and have two questions/observations

1. Why the hell didn't they handcuff him sooner?
2. Their instructions were not clear at all and often times conflicting on what to do if he was sober, much less intoxicated.
 
I think I’d be tempted if I was on the receiving end of such threatening instructions to just lie spread eagle and tell the cops I’m not moving. Period. That they should come and check me over or whatever—but I’m too damn scared to accurately follow their instructions.
 
Deacsfan27 said:
I watched that video in full last night and have two questions/observations

1. Why the hell didn't they handcuff him sooner?
2. Their instructions were not clear at all and often times conflicting on what to do if he was sober, much less intoxicated.
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I agree mostly. What the fuck is the purpose of having him crawl with his ankles crossed? How do you even do that? But even so, what he did with his hands was not the result of confusing instructions.
 
Part of the problem in cases like these is that the cops seem to have already decided that someone is guilty of something or carrying a weapon or drunk or something. I guess it’s safer as a cop to always assume something bad. But such assumptions do seem to significantly raise the risk for unnecessary harm to innocent suspects.
 
Deacsfan27 said:
I watched that video in full last night and have two questions/observations

1. Why the hell didn't they handcuff him sooner?
2. Their instructions were not clear at all and often times conflicting on what to do if he was sober, much less intoxicated.
Click to expand...

The whole "PUT YOUR HANDS UP AND DO NOT PUT THEM DOWN EVEN IF YOU ARE ABOUT TO FALL OVER OR I WILL SHOOT YOU NOW CRAWL TOWARDS ME" was crazy.
 
ConnorEl said:
Part of the problem in cases like these is that the cops seem to have already decided that someone is guilty of something or carrying a weapon or drunk or something. I guess it’s safer as a cop to always assume something bad. But such assumptions do seem to significantly raise the risk for unnecessary harm to innocent suspects.
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Or...that there are so many fucking guns in our society that cops have to enter these situations with a base level of fear.
 
ConnorEl said:
Part of the problem in cases like these is that the cops seem to have already decided that someone is guilty of something or carrying a weapon or drunk or something. I guess it’s safer as a cop to always assume something bad. But such assumptions do seem to significantly raise the risk for unnecessary harm to innocent suspects.
Click to expand...

Guilty till proven innocent.
 
Deacsfan27 said:
I watched that video in full last night and have two questions/observations

1. Why the hell didn't they handcuff him sooner?
2. Their instructions were not clear at all and often times conflicting on what to do if he was sober, much less intoxicated.
Click to expand...

TITCR. Once the female individual was handcuffed, the officer should have informed him [in a calm, cool, collected tone of voice] that they were going to walk down the hallway towards him to handcuff him, and that he needed to remain on the ground with his hands and feet where the were.

Also, that officer was completely out of control. Complete opposite attitude and demeanor from what he should have had.
 
WFUtoUSC said:
TITCR. Once the female individual was handcuffed, the officer should have informed him [in a calm, cool, collected tone of voice] that they were going to walk down the hallway towards him to handcuff him, and that he needed to remain on the ground with his hands and feet where the were.

Also, that officer was completely out of control. Complete opposite attitude and demeanor from what he should have had.
Click to expand...

That was my thought, but I’m not a cop.
 
WFUtoUSC said:
TITCR. Once the female individual was handcuffed, the officer should have informed him [in a calm, cool, collected tone of voice] that they were going to walk down the hallway towards him to handcuff him, and that he needed to remain on the ground with his hands and feet where the were.

Also, that officer was completely out of control. Complete opposite attitude and demeanor from what he should have had.
Click to expand...

I get that the officer could have handled it better. But to describe him as out of control seems like a stretch. Sure he told them to shut up, sounded agitated, and some of the instructions were confusing, but he didn't start screaming until the guy uncrossed his ankles and put his hands behind his back. The girl managed to more or less follow the instructions with out getting shot. The suspect clearly fucked up, twice, and the cop was there because some had reported a gun was present.

I agree that they should have hand cuffed him where he was but I bet they were worried someone else was in the room and they wanted him away from the room in case someone jump out to surprise them.
 
Deacfreak07 said:
Was there a gun? Was there anyone else in the room?
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My research indicates that there was a gun. An air rifle that the dude used to shoot birds that get trapped inside grocery stores and airports (now you see where my bias against him comes from). The police didn't know at the time that it was only an air rifle nor how many people were in the room...only that some one had been pointing a rifle out the window towards the pool area.
 
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