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Pro Life / Pro Choice Debate

WakeForestRanger said:
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Yeah, this is especially relevant to a recent discussion on the tunnels regarding the limited potential of voter initiatives in states with conservative politicians. Grassroots referendums are a worthy cause, but more likely to be prevented by government than they are to usurp it.
 
Not the first time Republicans in Michigan have ignored the will of the people.

Didn’t voters vote for an anti-gerrymandering law a few years ago the Republicans ignored?
 
Voting hard doesn’t work now because they didn’t vote hard enough then.

Not really a great argument against “vote hard.”
 
PhDeac said:
Voting hard doesn’t work now because they didn’t vote hard enough then.

Not really a great argument against “vote hard.”
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There is no such thing as “vote hard”, you either vote or you don’t. The entire vapid notion of individual political result is bullshit. Democratic politics are a collectivist concept - atomizing politics as the result of individual effort is propaganda to disperse responsibility among the powerless and circumvent diagnosis of society at large.
 
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Is “collectivist concept” the same as a “team sport?”
 
PhDeac said:
Is “collectivist concept” the same as a “team sport?”
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Analogizing politics to sports is a reference to the meaningless gamification of a once meaningful contest for control and resources. Over time, the repetition of circumstances disabuses people of their belief in the meaningfulness of political choice, such that politics simply become a cultural identity more than a determiner of conditions, and thus the expression of identity becomes a stronger correlative with voting than conditional need.
 
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myDeaconmyhand said:
Analogizing politics to sports is a reference to the meaningless gamification of a once meaningful contest for control and resources. Over time, the repetition of circumstances disabuses people of their belief in the meaningfulness of political choice, such that politics simply become a cultural identity more than a determiner of conditions, and thus the expression of identity becomes a stronger correlative with voting than conditional need.
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So yes?
 
PhDeac said:
So yes?
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No. You’d be more helpful just plainly disagreeing than playing dumb. Sports are meaningless entertainment, a frivolity to which people place their identity and aspirations in contests they have no control in, where the stakes are only emotional. Collectivist politics personally involve citizens prioritizing the good of society over the liberty of individuals and have actual material stakes.
 
 
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Many of these folks now basically articulate the Roe standard or some variation of it. The dog caught the car.
 
Have discovered in the last few months that the only group that sincerely wanted to ban abortion are conservative Catholics, especially the weirdo converts. Americans who convert to Catholicism are basically our version of Wahhabists, and they should be kept on an FBI list.
 
My guess is that the number of "pro-life" people who have had an abortion or paid for a woman to have one (like our esteemed NC Lt. Governor) is surprisingly high.
 
Highland Deac said:
My guess is that the number of "pro-life" people who have had an abortion or paid for a woman to have one (like our esteemed NC Lt. Governor) is surprisingly high.
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The percent who would not hesitate to fly their daughter to Canada for an abortion if she got pregnant too young is ~100%
 
They’re trying to reclaim the narrative from “Republicans want to end abortion” to “Republicans want to restrict abortion at 20 weeks.”
 
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