• Welcome to OGBoards 10.0, keep in mind that we will be making LOTS of changes to smooth out the experience here and make it as close as possible functionally to the old software, but feel free to drop suggestions or requests in the Tech Support subforum!

Rejecting words and actions which perpetrate, support or encourage white supremacists

PhDeac said:
Did this slip past the Tunnels radar?

[h=1]Bombing Plot in Oklahoma City Is Thwarted With Arrest, F.B.I. Says[/h]
A 23-year-old Oklahoma man has been arrested after he tried to blow up a bank in downtown Oklahoma City using a vehicle bomb similar to the one that destroyed the federal building there in 1995, federal officials said Monday.
The man, Jerry Drake Varnell, had been plotting the attack for months, the authorities said, but was thwarted by a long-running undercover investigation led by an F.B.I. joint terrorism task force.
Mr. Varnell was arrested early Saturday after he parked a van loaded with what he believed to be a working explosive device in an alley next to the bank, and then dialed a number on a cellphone that he thought would set it off, federal officials said. The device was inert and could not explode, the officials said.
According to court documents, Mr. Varnell had espoused an anti-government ideology and had expressed an interest in carrying out an attack that would echo the bombing of the Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City in April 1995, which killed 168 people.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/14/us/oklahoma-van-bomb-domestic-terrorism.html

So what do we know about this dude?




http://heavy.com/news/2017/08/jerry...domestic-terrorism-terrorist-photos-facebook/

He was part of an open group for an Oklahoma militia on Facebook. His likes page is filled with likes of musicians and movies; he’d also liked an anti-corporate page called The Other 98 Percent. Another of his likes is for a page called “P*ssed Off White Americans.” The about me section of that page reads, “We are the sons and daughters of European Heritage, and we are tired of being treated as second class citizens. LOUD, PROUD, and very PISSED OFF!” He also liked the sites “Right Wing News” and “Stop Pulling the Race Card” as well as sites on the Illuminati and militias.

...

Varnell was concerned that another group like ISIS might take responsibility for the attack, the complaint alleges. He allegedly wanted to write a Facebook message about “freedom” that would claim responsibility. The message was to say, according to the complaint:
What happened in Oklahoma City was not an attack on America, it was retaliation. Retaliation against the freedoms that have been taken away from the American people. It was a wake up call to both the government and the people. An act done to show the government what the people thinks of its actions. It is also a call to arms, to show people that there are still fighters among the American people. The time for revolution is now.



​
Click to expand...

Score one for the horseshoe theory.
 
"Imagine if these people ever faced actual oppression.

Nobody is trying to legislate away their right to marry. Nobody is trying to make them buy insurance to pay for 'male health care.'

The law never:

Enslaved their great-grandparents
Robbed their grandparents
Imprisoned their parents
Shot them when unarmed

There is no massive effort at the state and local level to disenfranchise them of the vote.

There is no history of centuries of bad science devoted to 'proving' their intellectual inferiority.

There is no travel ban on them because of their religion. There is no danger for them when they carry dangerous weaponry publicly.

Their churches were never burned. Their lawns never decorated with burning crosses. Their ancestors never hung from trees.

Their mothers aren't being torn away by ICE troopers and sent away forever. They won't be forced to leave the only country they ever knew.

The president has not set up a hotline to report crime committed at their hands.

They are chanting 'we will not be replaced.'

Replaced as ... what?

I'll tell you.

Replaced as the only voice in public discussions. Replaced as the only bodies in the public arena. Replaced as the only life that matters.

THIS is 'white people' oppression: We used to be the only voice. Now we hold the only microphone.

THIS is 'oppression' of white Christians in this country. Christmas used to be the only holiday acknowledged, now it's not.

I would so love to see these people get all the oppression they insist they receive, just for a year. Just to see.

Give them a world where you ACTUALLY can't say Christmas. A world where the name "Geoff" on a resume puts it in the trash.

Give them a world where they suddenly get a 20% pay cut, and then 70 women every day tell them to smile more.

Give them a world where their polo shirt makes people nervous, so they're kicked off the flight from Pittsburgh to Indianapolis.

Give them a world where they inherited nothing but a very real understanding of what oppression really is.

Give them a world where if they pulled up on a campus with torches lit and started throwing hands, the cops would punch their eyes out."
Click to expand...

https://twitter.com/juliusgoat/status/896326301832925184
 
 
Charlottesville: Race and Terror – VICE News Tonight on HBO

[video=youtube;P54sP0Nlngg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=share&v=P54sP0Nlngg[/video]

I'm not going to give myself nightmare fuel. I'm sure this is interesting. I'll watch it tomorrow.
 
Damn, that was intense. I'm pretty fucking angry and hurt after watching that.
 
PhDeac said:
Charlottesville: Race and Terror – VICE News Tonight on HBO

[video=youtube;P54sP0Nlngg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=share&v=P54sP0Nlngg[/video]


All in all, this event was no less than 7x less benign than this thread would have made you believe the past 2 days. Dweeb on dweeb violence.
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
Trump's Fuzzy History Of Denouncing White Nationalism

Quote
----------
Emboldening extremist groups

There could be a litany of reasons why any given person who supports white nationalist ideology embraced Trump. It wasn't just retweets and slow responses to people like Duke; Trump promoted policies that they could get behind, including restrictive immigration policy, as well as the travel ban imposed on certain Muslim-majority countries. His "America First" slogan was in fact associated with the Reform Party that Trump denounced as "fringe" and has deeper isolationist and anti-Semitic roots, as NPR's Ron Elving has reported.

While Trump at times chose to distance himself from extremists, many of them nevertheless saw themselves as his natural constituencies. When NPR's Steve Inskeep in 2016 asked Duke, then a Senate candidate in Louisiana, whether Trump voters were his voters, Duke was emphatic.

"Well, of course they are!" Duke said. "Because I represent the ideas of preserving this country and the heritage of this country, and I think Trump represents that as well."

During the campaign, prominent leaders among these extremist groups likewise declared their allegiance to Trump and explained why they felt emboldened.

"I don't think Trump is a white nationalist," Richard Spencer told the New Yorker's Evan Osnos, but he added why he thought Trump might appeal to some of those people: Trump espoused the idea, Spencer said, that "white people have—that their grandchildren might be a hated minority in their own country. I think that scares us. They probably aren't able to articulate it. I think it's there. I think that, to a great degree, explains the Trump phenomenon. I think he is the one person who can tap into it."
----------
 
Why The Government Can't Bring Terrorism Charges In Charlottesville

Quote
----------
...Inside the U.S., the political debate appears to be shifting, with growing numbers calling for far-right extremism to be identified as terrorism. But that's almost entirely a political discussion, not a legal one.

On the legal front, there's still a good deal of resistance to creating a criminal charge of domestic terrorism.

"It's an incredibly broad label," said Hina Shamsi, director of the national security project at the American Civil Liberties Union. "There's a real danger of the government criminalizing ideology, theology and beliefs rather than focusing on specific criminal acts."

She said creating a domestic terrorism charge could quickly raise all sorts of political questions about free speech and religion. The ACLU opposes any such law, believing it could be politicized and used, for example, against anti-war groups or environmental activists.

Back in 1995, when Timothy McVeigh killed 168 people with a truck bomb at a federal building in Oklahoma City, it was widely described as the worst act of domestic terrorism to that point.

Yet he was charged with, convicted of and executed for killing federal agents and other crimes — but not terrorism.

The government has historically used the term "terrorism" as a general description for a range of violent acts, including those by right-wing extremists, as well as environmental, anti-abortion and far-left groups. But the specific criminal charge is never domestic terrorism.

Another case came to light Monday, when the Justice Department announced it had arrested a man for allegedly attempting to set off a truck bomb in front of a bank in Oklahoma City on Saturday.

The bomb didn't detonate, the department said. But its description of the case is similar to McVeigh's attack, claiming the suspect, Jerry Varnell, 23, was angry with the government.

The FBI's Joint Terrorism Task Force is leading what's being described as a "domestic terrorism investigation." Yet the formal charge against Varnell is "attempting to use explosives to destroy a building in interstate commerce."

Not terrorism.
----------
 
PhDeac said:
Could you explain?
Click to expand...

Which part? I think Grant, in the rest of that section in his memoirs, does a good job outlining the materialist case and that's a primary source from someone who traveled throughout the so-called confederate states. Far better to fire up Google Books than to read my posts (true always and everywhere, tbh).

The US Conference of Catholic Bishops has outlined the other part in their statements on the past weekend.
 
ConnorEl said:
Well, we're all largely blind to our own stupidity, biases, etc. I'm pretty confident most southerners today do not self identify as racist.
Click to expand...

Maybe so but that's not a very overwhelming most. And it's also irrelevant. When people repeatedly make racist statements, support racist causes, display racist symbols, or hold racist views (after being told that those statements, causes, symbols, and views are racist) it doesn't matter whether they self identify as racist.
 
TuffaloDeac10 said:
Which part? I think Grant, in the rest of that section in his memoirs, does a good job outlining the materialist case and that's a primary source from someone who traveled throughout the so-called confederate states. Far better to fire up Google Books than to read my posts (true always and everywhere, tbh).

The US Conference of Catholic Bishops has outlined the other part in their statements on the past weekend.
Click to expand...

What pointed toward emancipation?
 
PhDeac said:
Click to expand...

True but those dates also correspond to when most of the vets started to die off of old age in the 1900's-1920's as well as significant Civil War anniversaries like the 50 and 100 year anniversaries of the war. It would be interesting to see a graphic of World War II memorials for comparison.
 
Newenglanddeac said:
Don't get me wrong...I love a lot of things about the south. The beautiful women in sundresses, the football, the BBQ and the hospitality...but their adulation for antebellum south is something I've never been able to wrap my head around. And it gets even harder for me to understand as I get older.
Click to expand...

This. Ive never understood either, guarding all that old tradition is so silly
 
PhDeac said:
What pointed toward emancipation?
Click to expand...

Stop asking me and start reading Grant. It's not even a long passage.

Reconstruction schools started by the so-called carpetbaggers served poor whites as well as freedmen. 20 years after the troops were gone, the fusionists controlled NC because emancipation was good for the whole working class.
 
TuffaloDeac10 said:
Stop asking me and start reading Grant. It's not even a long passage.

Reconstruction schools started by the so-called carpetbaggers served poor whites as well as freedmen. 20 years after the troops were gone, the fusionists controlled NC because emancipation was good for the whole working class.
Click to expand...

Care to give us a link?

Those excerpts read more like an appeal to poor southern whites than a description. That might be a revisionist reading given that the appeal (or description) had already proved ineffective (or inaccurate) by the time his memoirs were published.

Even if one believes most southern soldiers weren't motivated by racial hatred, such hatred was commonplace and controlling as little as 10 years following the war. The motivation of the soldiers or the common people of the confederacy is also irrelevant. The Confederacy was explicitly white supremacist and fought to establish that supremacy.
 
RChildress107 said:
Care to give us a link?

Those excerpts read more like an appeal to poor southern whites than a description. That might be a revisionist reading given that the appeal (or description) had already proved ineffective (or inaccurate) by the time his memoirs were published.

Even if one believes most southern soldiers weren't motivated by racial hatred, such hatred was commonplace and controlling as little as 10 years following the war. The motivation of the soldiers or the common people of the confederacy is also irrelevant. The Confederacy was explicitly white supremacist and fought to establish that supremacy.
Click to expand...

General Grant went almost everywhere in the so-called Confederate south and he and his men had extensive dealings with all parts of the population. It is absolutely a descriptive passage, from a first-hand witness.

As for the leadership class and the officers and the bulk of the soldiery, I agree with your second paragraph.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top