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Shooting at an Orlando Gay Night Club

Once we legalize weed, Mexico will be cool again!
 
FckVwls said:
I think there is enough data at this point from around the world to show that strict gun control will, over the long run, reduce the quantity of violent murders and deaths in a country.

I do have an appreciation, however, that some people really like owning guns and are not willing to sacrifice the freedom to save X lives. I think that's a reasonable view point. Where I get lost is when it is spun that more guns (and easier access to guns) actually improves societal safety. I don't see that at all.
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How is this a reasonable viewpoint? My desire to shoot at cans in the back yard is more important than any number of human lives?

The whole reason the right trots out the "more guns = safer" line is because they know that the actual reason, which you correctly flagged, is completely unreasonable. So they had to come up with something else
 
2&2 Slider To Leyritz said:
If he is trying to shoot you then there is a good chance that one or more other people are able to get out. But keep on with your millennial all-about-me self.
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Oh for the love of Christ. Now it's millennial to not want to give up your life on the chance that one other person who is not you might get saved?

If so, would certainly lend credence to the idea that millennials are smarter than olds
 
2&2 Slider To Leyritz said:
Why not? It would be just as easy/difficult as attempting to buy back, ban, or destroy existing guns.
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Holy shit man. Did you seriously just ask why we can't destroy a religion and then compare it directly to destroying a tangible piece of property?

Maybe take a second and think about the last time someone tried to destroy a religion before making such a dumbass statement.
 
elkman92 said:
Zero. I believe that everyone is entitled to due process. You?
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I have no problem adding a ten day review period with an option for another ten days. Three days is too little.

If after the period is over there is no proof, you can not only get a gun but you taken off the no fly list. But if it is justified, no gun.

There would also have to be funding for an office to do these investigations.

Double due process.
 
Deacs89 said:
so this tragedy is about gun control? And about making sure radical muslim terrorist are not able to get a gun.

Is there any merit in looking at why he would want a gun and what is driving him to do it? I mean these attacks will continue with or without guns. Knives, bombs, cars driving into crowed people and even planes. So I guess what I am saying is although gun control is a point that could be looked at how are liberals really making it the central focus? holy shiat.
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I guess that's a valid argument if you are only concerned with mass shootings on this level and not the smaller mass shootings and everyday gun violence.
 
People love guns in this country more than I will ever love anything in my entire life.

Once you commit yourself to the idea that a piece of metal is more valuable than a person's life (or hundreds of thousands of lives), there's not a lot of discussion that can occur.
 
Deacsfan27 said:
People love guns in this country more than I will ever love anything in my entire life.

Once you commit yourself to the idea that a piece of metal is more valuable than a person's life (or hundreds of thousands of lives), there's not a lot of discussion that can occur.
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People don't want to give up Constitutional rights no matter what.

Except freedom of religion of course.
 
Coach O said:
Both things can be true.

We have a gun problem. We have a radical Islam problem.
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Primarily we have a mental health problem.

We have a problem in America where the level of happiness is so low that people do not value their lives, nor do they value others. People scapegoat guns and Islam because it's easier than looking at the real problem---maybe America just isn't all that great to live in. We are sold on the notion that anybody here can have the American dream. That just isn't very true anymore. It's basically a financially oligarchic elitist society where you have to be born into privilege, a certain color, a certain sexual orientation, and many other things in order to have a reasonable chance at being successful.

Until we take a look at the underlying factors that go beyond believing in a man in the sky or a piece of metal, we will have no fruitful movement towards fixing the problems at hand. Those are just manifestations of the problems we don't want to deal with.
 
Deacsfan27 said:
People love guns in this country more than I will ever love anything in my entire life.

Once you commit yourself to the idea that a piece of metal is more valuable than a person's life (or hundreds of thousands of lives), there's not a lot of discussion that can occur.
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\

But more guns will keep everyone safe remember?
 
Deacs89 said:
so this tragedy is about gun control? And about making sure radical muslim terrorist are not able to get a gun.

Is there any merit in looking at why he would want a gun and what is driving him to do it? I mean these attacks will continue with or without guns. Knives, bombs, cars driving into crowed people and even planes. So I guess what I am saying is although gun control is a point that could be looked at how are liberals really making it the central focus? holy shiat.
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Of course there's merit in it. But attacks with knives, bombs, etc. for the most part don't kill nearly as many people. And they're usually a lot harder to execute. That's just an objective fact.

So yes, it's important to address the underlying issue. But I think that's a lot harder to do that than to, as a threshold matter, limit the amount of damage the crazies can easily inflict. But I'm open to ideas. How do you stop the lone wolf mass shooter before he shoots, when he hasn't yet committed any crimes?
 
Deacsfan27 said:
Primarily we have a mental health problem.

We have a problem in America where the level of happiness is so low that people do not value their lives, nor do they value others. People scapegoat guns and Islam because it's easier than looking at the real problem---maybe America just isn't all that great to live in. We are sold on the notion that anybody here can have the American dream. That just isn't very true anymore. It's basically a financially oligarchic elitist society where you have to be born into privilege, a certain color, a certain sexual orientation, and many other things in order to have a reasonable chance at being successful.

Until we take a look at the underlying factors that go beyond believing in a man in the sky or a piece of metal, we will have no fruitful movement towards fixing the problems at hand. Those are just manifestations of the problems we don't want to deal with.
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Three things can all be true.

We have a gun problem. We have a radical Islam problem. We have a mental health problem.
 
it's actually not that difficult for a human being, psychologically speaking, to love something like their gun or rights to guns more than other human beings they will never know. it's arguably more difficult for them to care about them. that's why we've had religion and philosophy jammed into our skulls
 
Deacsfan27 said:
Primarily we have a mental health problem.

We have a problem in America where the level of happiness is so low that people do not value their lives, nor do they value others. People scapegoat guns and Islam because it's easier than looking at the real problem---maybe America just isn't all that great to live in. We are sold on the notion that anybody here can have the American dream. That just isn't very true anymore. It's basically a financially oligarchic elitist society where you have to be born into privilege, a certain color, a certain sexual orientation, and many other things in order to have a reasonable chance at being successful.

Until we take a look at the underlying factors that go beyond believing in a man in the sky or a piece of metal, we will have no fruitful movement towards fixing the problems at hand. Those are just manifestations of the problems we don't want to deal with.
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I'm pretty sure restricting access to guns and preventing radical islam from taking root in America would be pretty fruitful.

I agree with you on the underlying issue though
 
ImTheCaptain said:
what mental illness should've been addressed in Mateen's case?
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Hatred of homosexuals
Steadfast adherence to a extreme religious viewpoint (possibly?)
The cause behind his domestic violence

He had a lot going on mentally that would cause many psychologists and psychiatrists to consider him deranged.
 
ImTheCaptain said:
it's actually not that difficult for a human being, psychologically speaking, to love something like their gun or rights to guns more than other human beings they will never know. it's arguably more difficult for them to care about them. that's why we've had religion and philosophy jammed into our skulls
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So, now philosophy is also the problem? Maybe you should stick to traveling on all fours.
 
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