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Saudi World Golf Tour 2022/2023 Thread

liveanddiedeac said:
How much has equipment effected the game? Was watching the Golf Channel's replay of the 1991 PGA Championship that Daly won, they showed that he led the tour in driving distance that year with an average of 289.9 yards. In 2016 that would rank 101st in driving distance and John Daly is leading the Champions Tour this year in driving distance at 303.5. So, 25 years older, fat and out of shape (Daly was actually pretty trim in 1991), John Daly averages 13.6 yards longer off tee. Makes you wonder how much more the manufacturers can push the limits of the ball, clubheads and shafts, and if at some point the governing bodies will really have to step in and limit the technology.
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Measured only for drivers or all drives on par 4s/5s regardless of club?
 
The ball is the biggest thing that changes it, then it's the sweet spot of the club.

You can hit it almost as far with a persimon as you can with a brand new M1, but you have so much less room for error.
 
Teamramrod said:
The ball is the biggest thing that changes it, then it's the sweet spot of the club.

You can hit it almost as far with a persimon as you can with a brand new M1, but you have so much less room for error.
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I've still got my first real driver which was a Mizuno persimmon head and I've got an old Macgreger persimmon head too. One of these days I'm going to slap a new grip on one of them and take it to the range for the heck of it.
 
Shorty said:
That was in the days before shot link and I think there were only like two holes where drives were measured.
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Yeah, I think it used to be 2 holes that they felt most of the field would be hitting driver on and in opposite directions to help balance out down wind and against the wind.
 
The technology advances are a combination of ball, shafts, and sweet spot. Plus, a standard driver used to be 43.5 inches long - standard is now 45 inches and some people even go longer. If I remember my physics, even a small increase in lever arm (shaft length) is going to have a major impact on force imparted on the ball. The combination creates a huge cumulative effect. Think about the difference between hitting a balata titleist with a persimmon-headed driver with a steel shaft that is 43.5 inches long - and hitting a modern, hard ball (which still creates plenty of spin) with a metal driver that has a sweet spot the size of Texas and an advanced-materials shaft that is not only longer than the old one but frequency matched to your swing... No wonder I still hit it as far as I did as a teenager (but not as far as I did 10-15 years ago).
 
I had a greenskeeper at a course that has held majors tell me that turf conditions now versus not so long ago have made a difference too. Agronomy and course and fairway conditions have changed a lot over the last 25 years. he said the result is that fairways are tighter and roll out more - apples to apples. I don't know if I buy that or not, but it might make a small difference. Especially in dry conditions, a tight fairway would run out much more than one with taller grass say 25 years ago.
 
Rollout on today's fairways is definitely another factor yielding greater distance. New strains of grass and improved maintenance allow courses to cut fairways tighter than they could 25 years ago. My club keeps the fairways at 3/8". You could not have done that 25 years ago.
 
Shorty said:
Rollout on today's fairways is definitely another factor yielding greater distance. New strains of grass and improved maintenance allow courses to cut fairways tighter than they could 25 years ago. My club keeps the fairways at 3/8". You could not have done that 25 years ago.
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AKA greens of 25 years ago
 
guitardeac said:
I had a greenskeeper at a course that has held majors tell me that turf conditions now versus not so long ago have made a difference too. Agronomy and course and fairway conditions have changed a lot over the last 25 years. he said the result is that fairways are tighter and roll out more - apples to apples. I don't know if I buy that or not, but it might make a small difference. Especially in dry conditions, a tight fairway would run out much more than one with taller grass say 25 years ago.
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Shorty said:
Rollout on today's fairways is definitely another factor yielding greater distance. New strains of grass and improved maintenance allow courses to cut fairways tighter than they could 25 years ago. My club keeps the fairways at 3/8". You could not have done that 25 years ago.
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Good points. The fairways the tour guys play on now are better than a lot of the greens 30, 40, 50 years ago. I think a long, long time ago sand greens weren't uncommon, that would've been interesting to putt on.

It was kind of funny when I was watching the 1991 PGA last night. Nicklaus was in the booth after his round and they were asking him about Daly's swing which was pretty similar to Jack's at the top with the height of their hands and flying right elbow. Of course Daly's wrist angle was a lot different since the club was almost pointing to the ground. Anyway, Jack was saying that he thought it was great and Daly should have fun with it, but with age Daly's swing would get shorter. 25 years older, fat and out of shape, one thing Daly's swing hasn't done has gotten shorter.
 
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liveanddiedeac said:
Yeah, I know. I played Saturday and on a par 5 (short par 5, 435 yards) I hit driver- 54 degree gap wedge for a 5 foot eagle putt (missed the damn thing). 20 years ago it would've been a driver-mid iron for me.
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Are you playing a pitch and putt? Or playing the ladies tees? That's not even a long par 4. Definitely not a par 5.
Sorry. Just random musing
 
BacktoBack said:
Are you playing a pitch and putt? Or playing the ladies tees? That's not even a long par 4. Definitely not a par 5.
Sorry. Just random musing
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No, smart ass. I agree it shouldn't be a par 5, but that is what it says on the card. That course also has a 600 yard par 5 though, hit driver- 8 iron on that one to setup an eagle putt a few weeks ago. My drive may or may not have been greatly aided by the cart path though.:thumbsup:
 
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Wasn't trying to be a dick. Just played a lot of golf and never seen a par 5 that short. It's all good
 
He said it was 435...not 535.
That's crazy short for a five par
And yes, I hit the ball a long way. But the rest of my game sucks 👍
 
BacktoBack said:
He said it was 435...not 535.
That's crazy short for a five par
And yes, I hit the ball a long way. But the rest of my game sucks ��
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You've still got a month and a half to get lessons before the MG.
 
Liquid Karma said:
You've still got a month and a half to get lessons before the MG.
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I did some tinkering..Slowed down my hands from the top. Seems to work well on the range. Going to try and play this weekend and find out. When are you back from HH?
 
Shorty said:
Rollout on today's fairways is definitely another factor yielding greater distance. New strains of grass and improved maintenance allow courses to cut fairways tighter than they could 25 years ago. My club keeps the fairways at 3/8". You could not have done that 25 years ago.
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Look no further than the Scottish Open a couple weeks ago. They had some rain early, didn't mow the fairways much, weather was a little cold for the final round... Not one player in the top 50 averaged 300 yards off the tee. Only 2 guys even came within 10 yards of averaging 300. I saw Noren and McDowell both nail drivers on #1 right down the middle of a flat hole without much wind - one was 258 and other 264.

Olds love to grumble, and technology has certainly improved, but it's just a piece of the equation. Players are better, stronger. Courses are firmer and faster. Club fitting improvements allow players to understand optimal launch statistics and get closer to them than before. And yet amateur handicaps aren't getting any lower, and short-knocker Jordan Spieth won two majors last year before Dustin Johnson won his first in almost 30 attempts.

There's no single thing you can do - not rolling back the ball, not reducing COR, not limiting shaft materials - that would have as drastic an effect as altering course conditions. Just having bunkers that were actually hazards in the Open was refreshing. In the U.S. players aim for bunkers.
 
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