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Country Dan on Dave Glenn Now

Wakeforest22890 said:
Dino's worst team finished 47 spots above [Redacted]'s best team in KenPom.

End of discussion.
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Because of the players he was left with from when Skip was HC. Dino did not do the same for Buzz. Dino did not come in after a coach had been fired for sucking like Dino was. Who would you say is Dino's best recruit? Travis? Second best?
 
Dino recruited 7 freshmen to Wake, 2 of them were CJ Harris and Travis McKie who were good ACC players. JT Terrell was probably next and then Carson. I feel comfortable saying all four of those players were ACC quality freshmen for their position.

[Redacted] recruited 11 freshmen to Wake (who have played so far), two are definitely ACC players. Not sure that any are good ACC players.

Dino didn't leave the program in great shape. He is still a vastly better collegiate head coach than [Redacted] and would have won more than 8 games in what was [Redacted]'s first year. He also would have continued to recruit at a higher level than [Redacted] has. At a high enough level? Probably not.

If Dino drove the program into the ground, where did [Redacted] drive the program? Wait, I know the answer: into the depth of hell.
 
88Deac said:
Please tell me what I have wrong about those facts? I looked up the records, the rosters and schedules. What do I have wrong?!? Please elaborate.

I pretty much run lock step with Dan on the Buzz era. First two years he got a pass because Dino left things so bad. But Buzz's biggest problems are that he hasn't recruited nearly well enough in 4 years, he is not a leader or motivator or able to get his teams up to play hard. His teams are soft. Those are VERY bad flaws and he has to be let go. Now.

Dino was horrible and still has no coaching job.
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Dino left us with:
1) a recruiting class including #45, #56, #66, #94 and a top-25 PG
2) a senior captain (and double figure scorer)
3) two of the top freshmen, now sophomores, in the ACC (1 All-Freshman Team and 1 legit draft prospect)
4) two juniors (Tony and Ty - both of whom were highly regarded upside guys at the time).

Ari wasn't an asshole yet. Tony was still in school.

Tony and Ty were both high ceiling guys that most of the fanbase was excited about...

Ron and Buzz vetted and re-recruited the Class of 2010.

That's what Dino left us. The rest is revisionist history.
 
DeaconOEF/OIFvet said:
It's amazing to me how after 4 years of this nightmare, there are still some people that will jump through so many hoops to try to pin this all on Dino.
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88deac is the same poster who was convinced the 08-09 team was going to miss the NCAA tournament with a week or so left in the regular season. I have taken nothing he has said since seriously. Based on his recent posts, that is a good decision on my part.
 
1. Despite their rankings, they just weren't very good other than Travis, and it wasn't just Buzz's coaching, because they haven't been very good elsewhere, other than JTT has had some flashes. But even we beat USC.

2. Agreed.

3. Not sure I follow that.

4. Dino didn't leave us Tony and Ty. They were recruited when Skip was alive, so Dino did not bring them in. No credit for him there. And he certainly didn't develop Ty at all. F- for his coaching of Ty. Tony was just unfortunate, but again, Skip was HC when Tony was recruited.

Ron and Buzz HAD to re-recruit the Class of 2010. Had they not, we wouldn't have been able to field a full team of scholarship players.
 
CJ and Ari were both significant contributors to an NCAA tournament team as freshman.
 
88Deac said:
1. Despite their rankings, they just weren't very good other than Travis, and it wasn't just Buzz's coaching, because they haven't been very good elsewhere, other than JTT has had some flashes. But even we beat USC.

2. Agreed.

3. Not sure I follow that.

4. Dino didn't leave us Tony and Ty. They were recruited when Skip was alive, so Dino did not bring them in. No credit for him there. And he certainly didn't develop Ty at all. F- for his coaching of Ty. Tony was just unfortunate, but again, Skip was HC when Tony was recruited.

Ron and Buzz HAD to re-recruit the Class of 2010. Had they not, we wouldn't have been able to field a full team of scholarship players.
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Completely 100% unreasonable to give anyone a F for Ty Walker except Ty Walker himself. Complete basketcase.

#3 is pretty clear. Both CJ and Ari were considered to be very promising as freshman. CJ was on the All Freshmen team, and Ari was considered a first round draft prospect.
 
WFU Lurker said:
Dino recruited 7 freshmen to Wake, 2 of them were CJ Harris and Travis McKie who were good ACC players. JT Terrell was probably next and then Carson. I feel comfortable saying all four of those players were ACC quality freshmen for their position.

[Redacted] recruited 11 freshmen to Wake (who have played so far), two are definitely ACC players. Not sure that any are good ACC players.

Dino didn't leave the program in great shape. He is still a vastly better collegiate head coach than [Redacted] and would have won more than 8 games in what was [Redacted]'s first year. He also would have continued to recruit at a higher level than [Redacted] has. At a high enough level? Probably not.

If Dino drove the program into the ground, where did [Redacted] drive the program? Wait, I know the answer: into the depth of hell.
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That is at least a fair, thoughtful response. I still think Buzz is a better sideline coach, but Dino is a better recruiter than Buzz, but that isn't saying much on either point. Neither did much positive in their 3 or 4 years considering what they had, and neither left the program better. Dino left it far worse, and Buzz left it about the same. I think Wake may be the last HC jobs for both of them. I still think RW should have hired someone outside when Skip died. It would have been tough, but he needed to make a tough decision for the long term good of the program. In August, he could have taken a little more time. But he hired a guy with a losing record as a head coach who hadn't been a head coach in years, nor will ever be again in D-1. Caldwell, Buzz and Dino were 3 horrific hires.
 
WFU Lurker said:
Completely 100% unreasonable to give anyone a F for Ty Walker except Ty Walker himself. Complete basketcase.

#3 is pretty clear. Both CJ and Ari were considered to be very promising as freshman. CJ was on the All Freshmen team, and Ari was considered a first round draft prospect.
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Apparently Ty loved Skip and would have responded to him. Got a Skip tattoo. Ty perhaps would have followed and needed a strong leader/discipline guy. Skip was it, Buzz and Dino were not. Ease up on #3. Just asking for clarification. "Now sophs" didn't make sense. CJ, can't say enough positive. Ari, see Ty analysis above. Both were VERY highly regarded prospects. Both clearly were insanely immature and needed a strong leader of a coach. Ari apparently still does. Neither Buzz nor Dino could turn them into anything.
 
Dino finished above where his team was predicted every year as coach and left the program "on paper" in great shape when he left. Blaming him for Bzzzz's disaster is laughable.
 
ChrisL68 said:
88deac is the same poster who was convinced the 08-09 team was going to miss the NCAA tournament with a week or so left in the regular season. I have taken nothing he has said since seriously. Based on his recent posts, that is a good decision on my part.
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That same week Lunardi, or whoever it was back then, dropped us to last 4 in, which caused me great concern. We were leaking oil in a bad way. It must have been you who responded that he was an idiot and should not be listened. I should have listened to a board poster, rather than someone who gets paid to do this as his job. My bad.
 
ChrisL68 said:
88deac is the same poster who was convinced the 08-09 team was going to miss the NCAA tournament with a week or so left in the regular season. I have taken nothing he has said since seriously. Based on his recent posts, that is a good decision on my part.
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And it was the 09-10 team that lost 4 of the last 5 and got killed by last place Miami in the ACCT.
 
Not worth putting in another thread, but since there was Dino talk here, I thought I'd share. Apparently Fran McCaffrey's son is having surgery tomorrow morning, and McCaffery reached out to Dino, who then arranged for CP3 to give McCaffrey's son a call this morning. So good on Dino for that.
 
88Deac said:
Apparently Ty loved Skip and would have responded to him. Got a Skip tattoo. Ty perhaps would have followed and needed a strong leader/discipline guy. Skip was it, Buzz and Dino were not. Ease up on #3. Just asking for clarification. "Now sophs" didn't make sense. CJ, can't say enough positive. Ari, see Ty analysis above. Both were VERY highly regarded prospects. Both clearly were insanely immature and needed a strong leader of a coach. Ari apparently still does. Neither Buzz nor Dino could turn them into anything.
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You're missing the point. Buzz inherited CJ and Ari. In Fall 2011, Ari was considered to be a breakout candidate and NBA prospect. They were coming off of excellent freshmen seasons (especially when we compare their freshmen seasons to Devin's and Codi's) and expectations for both were very high.

Unless you know something that the rest of us don't (and I don't think you do), then you have no idea how Ty and Ari responded to Dino. Ari had a good deal of success under Dino and I don't remember hearing anything about him outside of the excitement that he was looking like a very good young player. As for Ty, all I know is that he was advised to redshirt and chose not to. I don't remember hearing about locker room or legal shenanigans during his two seasons with Dino. Please correct me with facts I'm wrong.

You said that Dino left us with nothing. That's completely false. He left Buzz a pretty damn good collection of players in terms of upside with enough returning production that it should not have been hard to win 10 games. Buzz's failure as a coach, IMO, is embodied in the fact that he was never able to get these guys to play up to their rankings, let alone exceed it.
 
redwing42 said:
Not worth putting in another thread, but since there was Dino talk here, I thought I'd share. Apparently Fran McCaffrey's son is having surgery tomorrow morning, and McCaffery reached out to Dino, who then arranged for CP3 to give McCaffrey's son a call this morning. So good on Dino for that.
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Dude - Dino is a good guy. He is well-respected by his peers in coaching and broadcasting (with the exceptions of Ron Wellman and Larry Brown, it would seem), was liked by his players, and has really proven himself as a class act throughout the constant slander, defamation, and character assassination that has come out of the AD, national press, and our fanbase.

Here's an open challenge to the Dino haters: name an instance or individual experience that would suggest that Dino lacked class, integrity, and kindness. I can wait.
 
[Redacted] tried to run his system (whatever that was at the time) with a bunch of guys suited for Dino's system. It's not hard to imaging that those players playing the system they were recruited for wouldn't have had more success than they did running a completely different one. They would not have been great, but probably gotten to around .500, which would have been enough to justify firing Dino at that point.
 
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