• Welcome to OGBoards 10.0, keep in mind that we will be making LOTS of changes to smooth out the experience here and make it as close as possible functionally to the old software, but feel free to drop suggestions or requests in the Tech Support subforum!

Game of Thrones - House of the Dragon - (and beyond) Discussion (spoilers allowed)

deaconson said:
There is a doc on the interwebs that is a copy of the initial treatment of the series martin sent to the publisher. It mentions coldhands and a hand written side note says "is the benjen" and another note from martin says "no." So book benjen is not coldhands. As we've seen the book departs when it feels it works better.
Click to expand...

Interesting.

But that doesnt necessarily mean anything for the show
 
DeacdeTejas said:
Interesting.

But that doesnt necessarily mean anything for the show
Click to expand...

Which I said. I do think they might bring him back for the show.

I wonder if martin and the producers have a bit of a "if you can change smaller plot point from the book and make something else work for the show I would appreciate it" deal.
 
DeaconSlim2.0 said:
Yea so, I think backwards compared to almost everyone I know, and have opposite taste in greatness/suckiness of shows and movies compared to most on here, so just understand that as I point out how stupid I am here.


But was the whole revelation that Bran visited the past with the Three Eyed Raven, and somehow caused Hodor to have a seizure and become the Hodor we've known all along?

And if he was warging or whatever with the Three Eyed Raven in order to have his vision of the past, how did he warg into Hodor...and was he warging into the past Hodor or the present Hodor?

Meera yelling Hold The Door-->Hodor to present Hodor caused past Hodor to repeat the phrase until the only thing he could say was Hodor.


I just, can't put it all together for some reason. And it bugs me.
Click to expand...

I think the reveal was twofold:

1. Bran learns that he has the ability to affect or interact with the past while using the greensight. It was hinted at in the Tower of Joy flashback when he yells out to Ned and Ned turns as if he heard something. In the final scene Meera's voice is able to penetrate into Bran's vision while at the same time Bran is able to warg into Hodor in present time. Bran basically serves as a bridge of sorts between the present time and his vision which allows Wylis to hear Meera yelling "Hold the Door".

2. We, and Bran, learn the origin of Hodor's name and mental illness. The scene was emotionally wrenching on several levels. Bran realizes that he is responsible for Hodor's condition and gets to see it happen in real time. Hodor sacrifices himself in order to save Bran essentially fulfilling Meera's plea that he heard 30 years in the past. He's basically been waiting for his opportunity to "Hold the Door" his entire life and that he saves Bran while doing so was both beautiful and heart-wrenching at the same time.

That was the most powerful scene since the Red Wedding IMO both from a storytelling and cinematic standpoint.
 
Game of Thrones Season FIVE (and beyond) Discussion (spoilers allowed)

Bing Bong legit had me crying


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
RChildress107 said:
I think the reveal was twofold:

1. Bran learns that he has the ability to affect or interact with the past while using the greensight. It was hinted at in the Tower of Joy flashback when he yells out to Ned and Ned turns as if he heard something. In the final scene Meera's voice is able to penetrate into Bran's vision while at the same time Bran is able to warg into Hodor in present time. Bran basically serves as a bridge of sorts between the present time and his vision which allows Wylis to hear Meera yelling "Hold the Door".

2. We, and Bran, learn the origin of Hodor's name and mental illness. The scene was emotionally wrenching on several levels. Bran realizes that he is responsible for Hodor's condition and gets to see it happen in real time. Hodor sacrifices himself in order to save Bran essentially fulfilling Meera's plea that he heard 30 years in the past. He's basically been waiting for his opportunity to "Hold the Door" his entire life and that he saves Bran while doing so was both beautiful and heart-wrenching at the same time.

That was the most powerful scene since the Red Wedding IMO both from a storytelling and cinematic standpoint.
Click to expand...

Thank you for writing that out. Something wasn't connecting for me and it seriously irritated me.

I had forgotten about Bran yelling out to Young Ned previously, and just couldn't wrap my head around who/when the warging was taking place.

Hodor finally fulfilling his destiny was not the way it had processed in my admittedly strange brain, but that makes total sense and I appreciate the assistance there.



It just bugged me that they stayed in that vision/past so long. It didn't make sense that they were just standing around while all this shit was going on. And did Hodor sacrifice himself, or did Bran basically force him to sacrifice himself by being warged into him?

I definitely need to rewatch and I appreciate the avoidance of all involved here of calling out my complete and total lack of understanding of that scene. I guess that's what you get when they basically just said that Hodor was Hodor because Bran's future was always meant to have him warg into the past so he could warg into a young Hodor so the future Hodor could save Bran from dying while he was warged into the past to create Hodor.
 
Last edited:
Well the producers clearly read my post saying the Dothraki stuff needed to hurry on up, but now it's Arya's turn. Feel like that plot has been stuck in the mud for a while now.
 
DeaconSlim2.0 said:
Thank you for writing that out. Something wasn't connecting for me and it seriously irritated me.

I had forgotten about Bran yelling out to Young Ned previously, and just couldn't wrap my head around who/when the warging was taking place.

Hodor finally fulfilling his destiny was not the way it had processed in my admittedly strange brain, but that makes total sense and I appreciate the assistance there.



It just bugged me that they stayed in that vision/past so long. It didn't make sense that they were just standing around while all this shit was going on. And did Hodor sacrifice himself, or did Bran basically force him to sacrifice himself by being warged into him?

I definitely need to rewatch and I appreciate the avoidance of all involved here of calling out my complete and total lack of understanding of that scene. I guess that's what you get when they basically just said that Hodor was Hodor because Bran's future was always meant to have him warg into the past so he could warg into a young Hodor so the future Hodor could save Bran from dying while he was warged into the past to create Hodor.
Click to expand...

That's why they stayed in the past though. Similar to when Bran couldn't warg early on until Jon was in grave danger - Three Eyed Raven dude knew he was out of time and could only teach Bran "to become him" under duress. So they were just hanging out until the attack came, he was killed, and Bran was forced to realize he was connected to the present while in the past. Plus the earlier lines about not being able to change the past suddenly all clicked as Hodor went mad, closing the loop.

Have to admit any time they dig into the mysticism and tree stuff I get apprehensive that GoT is going to go off the deep end of fantasy - but that was an amazing episode and was handled very well. They're killing it this season.
 
There pretty much is no coming back from anything when someone talks shit about your dick being cut off.

"Galavanting? Is that a word you learned after having your dick cut off?"

That insult didn't even make sense but was devastating
 
BarcaDeac said:
Well the producers clearly read my post saying the Dothraki stuff needed to hurry on up, but now it's Arya's turn. Feel like that plot has been stuck in the mud for a while now.
Click to expand...
Pretty sure you're going to get some quick resolution with Arya. Either she is going to truly become an assassin No One by killing the Cersei actress or she'll kill the jealous Sansa actress for Arya's own means. Plus you know her and the Waif are going to have a real brawl sometime soon as it's been building up to that for a while.

While Arya becoming a true, pure Faceless Man would be interesting to see outside the story, removing "Arya" from the show's storylines would not be a great thing. I think Arya is going to use her faceless training to take out some people in Westeros soon.
 
ChaosDeac said:
Pretty sure you're going to get some quick resolution with Arya. Either she is going to truly become an assassin No One by killing the Cersei actress or she'll kill the jealous Sansa actress for Arya's own means. Plus you know her and the Waif are going to have a real brawl sometime soon as it's been building up to that for a while.

While Arya becoming a true, pure Faceless Man would be interesting to see outside the story, removing "Arya" from the show's storylines would not be a great thing. I think Arya is going to use her faceless training to take out some people in Westeros soon.
Click to expand...

Ya Arya surely has to end up back in Westeros
 
So when Hodor comes back as a white walker, will he still be saying Hodor or just sitting around having a normal convo with his white walker buddies?
 
Holy s. It totally escaped me that hodor will become a zombie. Now i'm really sad.
 
deaconson said:
Holy s. It totally escaped me that hodor will become a zombie. Now i'm really sad.
Click to expand...

So, Hodor and Summer will turn into wights. Wonder if it means at some point live (pls pls pls) direwolf Ghost and wight Summer will face off. Will the little tree people turn to wights?
 
RollTheQuad06 said:
So, Hodor and Summer will turn into wights. Wonder if it means at some point live (pls pls pls) direwolf Ghost and wight Summer will face off. Will the little tree people turn to wights?
Click to expand...

Good question. Since they created the white walkers, I'm inclined to think they are immune to their reanimations.
 
RChildress107 said:
I think the reveal was twofold:

1. Bran learns that he has the ability to affect or interact with the past while using the greensight. It was hinted at in the Tower of Joy flashback when he yells out to Ned and Ned turns as if he heard something. In the final scene Meera's voice is able to penetrate into Bran's vision while at the same time Bran is able to warg into Hodor in present time. Bran basically serves as a bridge of sorts between the present time and his vision which allows Wylis to hear Meera yelling "Hold the Door".

2. We, and Bran, learn the origin of Hodor's name and mental illness. The scene was emotionally wrenching on several levels. Bran realizes that he is responsible for Hodor's condition and gets to see it happen in real time. Hodor sacrifices himself in order to save Bran essentially fulfilling Meera's plea that he heard 30 years in the past. He's basically been waiting for his opportunity to "Hold the Door" his entire life and that he saves Bran while doing so was both beautiful and heart-wrenching at the same time.

That was the most powerful scene since the Red Wedding IMO both from a storytelling and cinematic standpoint.
Click to expand...

I thought Present Bran heard Meera shouting "Hold The Door" while dreaming and then Dream (visiting Past) Bran warged into Past Wylis (young Hodor) - which leaked into Present Hodor holding the door. Past Wylis' eyes definitely rolled up in his head, and the warg from Dream Bran is what scrambled young Wylis' brains and turned him in to Hodor. Bran's consciousness was definitely in the dream - and Wylis' must have been turned into Hodor in the past, or he wouldn't have been Hodor all along through the story.

Basically, Bran heard something while dreaming, took control of Dream Hodor, and then made Present Hodor act.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top