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John Collins is #2 in KP's All-ACC Ratings

PhDeac said:
I don't. I also don't expect a kid to hide that he's moving up draft projections.
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Wasn't directed at you, specifically. I just think it is kind of funny that my #1 source for John Collins NBA draft projection updates is John Collins tweets.
 
deacphan said:
always interesting to read the draft projections from the folks you never see on the nba thread...
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Not sure that posting on an NBA thread in this corner of the internet would make someone more qualified to project where JC could go.
 
FckVwls said:
This is such a myth. Many people think getting drafted high 2nd is better than late 1st for the player. Not tied down to the rookie scale, a bit more flexibility with the contract. And playing time is crucial for development and you can often find more on "crappy" teams.
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It's not a myth at at all. Why do crappy teams stay crappy? A major reason is they don't develop their players. Being drafted in the second round/non-guaranteed does not necessarily mean more PT.
 
RJKarl said:
It's not a myth at at all. Why do crappy teams stay crappy? A major reason is they don't develop their players. Being drafted in the second round/non-guaranteed does not necessarily mean more PT.
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All the guys near the top of the 2nd round get good guarantees. If you didn't want to sign a player at the going rate in the high 2nd draft slot you would dump the pick.

The real "bubble" for NCAA guys that leave early is not the end of the first round as you keep saying. It's really pick 38-40 or so, after which the gtd money drops below 2 million and a roster spot isn't a sure thing. Getting picked #34 vs #29 isn't that big of a deal. You'll make marginally less, but no more so than the drop from 24 to 29. Also those high 2 picks move a ton and are not really too biased toward bad teams.
 
Those guaranteed deals at the top of the 2nd are still usually suuuuuuuuuper team friendly. It's usually 4 years at slightly above the min but with only 2 years fully guaranteed and 2 year team options so if the player breaks out you get 2 super duper cheap years with absolutely no risk.
 
Fuck Your Couch said:
Those guaranteed deals at the top of the 2nd are still usually suuuuuuuuuper team friendly. It's usually 4 years at slightly above the min but with only 2 years fully guaranteed and 2 year team options so if the player breaks out you get 2 super duper cheap years with absolutely no risk.
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That's the same as the rookie scale you'd get as the 29th pick or whatever. 2 years gtd, 2 super team friendly years. Also as a 2nd round pick you don't have to sign that deal if you don't want. You can just play for the min like KJ McDaniels and hit the market after 1 season.
 
Harrell got 3.1 mil gtd from Rockets at top of 2015 2nd, Deyonta Davis got 4 mil gtd from Memphis this year at top of 2nd btw
 
FckVwls said:
That's the same as the rookie scale you'd get as the 29th pick or whatever. 2 years gtd, 2 super team friendly years. Also as a 2nd round pick you don't have to sign that deal if you don't want. You can just play for the min like KJ McDaniels and hit the market after 1 season.
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For the first 3 years pretty much, 4th year if picked up is a big jump for 1st round scale.
 
Also, sure KJ bet on himself with 0 guaranteed years and it paid off, but we're talking about risk averse choices.
 
FckVwls said:
All the guys near the top of the 2nd round get good guarantees. If you didn't want to sign a player at the going rate in the high 2nd draft slot you would dump the pick.

The real "bubble" for NCAA guys that leave early is not the end of the first round as you keep saying. It's really pick 38-40 or so, after which the gtd money drops below 2 million and a roster spot isn't a sure thing. Getting picked #34 vs #29 isn't that big of a deal. You'll make marginally less, but no more so than the drop from 24 to 29. Also those high 2 picks move a ton and are not really too biased toward bad teams.
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Second round picks aren't guaranteed any money. The new TV deal and old CBA resulted in a situation that was very favorable to high second round picks. With the new CBA tying the rookie scale to the salary cap , all new contracts taking the tv money into account, and new two-way contracts allowing teams to keep a players rights on the cheap, being an early 2nd round pick is considerably less favorable than it used to be.
 
Fuck Your Couch said:
For the first 3 years pretty much, 4th year if picked up is a big jump for 1st round scale.
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Dejonte Murray (#29) got the full 120% is 4 years / 6 million with 2 years / 2.4 gtd
Malcom Brogdan or Tyler Ulis (#34 or #36) is 4 years / 4.5 million with 2 years / 1.9 million gtd

It's pretty linear decline, just like #19 to #24 or #24 to #29 or whatever. The end of the first round isn't some magic bubble where you are in great shape #30 but #31 is bad.
 
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RChildress107 said:
Second round picks aren't guaranteed any money. The new TV deal and old CBA resulted in a situation that was very favorable to high second round picks. With the new CBA tying the rookie scale to the salary cap , all new contracts taking the tv money into account, and new two-way contracts allowing teams to keep a players rights on the cheap, being an early 2nd round pick is considerably less favorable than it used to be.
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You could be right, but I would guess the high 2nds this year will get the bump alongside the rookie scale. That is to say that #31 will get the essentially the same contract as #30.
 
Let's also look at the reality of the top of the second round this year:

31. Atlanta- unless they trade Milsap, this would be a horrible landing place for JC, plus they have Mike Scott as a back-up.
32. Phoenix- They drafted Criss and Bender in the lottery this year. They have long-term contracts
33. Orlando - They Ibaka and Jeff Green. no minutes for JC
34. Orlando - They Ibaka and Jeff Green. no minutes for JC
35. New Orl- The Brow
36. New Orleans- The Brow
37. Miami- there would definitely be minutes but by this late $$$ are going way down and JC should return
 
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John Collins is streaking up the charts. I just posted this on the Harry Giles thread also but JC is looking at trending toward lottery pick now!

John Collins DX Draft Express--Team: Wake Forest, Sophomore
H: 6' 10" W: 225 lbs Bday: 09/23/1997 (19 Years Old)
Current: PF NBA: PF Possible: PF
Pick: 25 in 2017 Mock Draft
Rank 27 in Top 100 Prospects
Rank 11 in NCAA Sophomores
Rank 25 in Top ACC Prospects
RSCI: 134

ACC in the 1st round per newly updated Bleacher Report 1/31/2017

4. Dallas Mavericks: Dennis Smith Jr. (N.C. State, PG, 6'3", Freshman)
5. Philadelphia 76ers: Jonathan Isaac (Florida State, SF/PF, 6'10", Freshman)
10. Sacramento Kings: Jayson Tatum (Duke, SF, 6'8", Freshman)
13. Milwaukee Bucks: Harry Giles (Duke, PF/C, 6'10", Freshman)
17. Chicago Bulls: John Collins (Wake Forest, PF, 6'10", Sophomore)
21. Oklahoma City Thunder: Tyler Lydon (Syracuse, PF, 6'9", Sophomore)
23. Toronto Raptors: Luke Kennard (Duke, SG, 6'6", Sophomore)
25. Brooklyn Nets (via BOS): Justin Jackson (North Carolina, SF, 6'8", Junior)
26. Toronto Raptors (via LAC): Jaron Blossomgame (Clemson, F, 6'7", Senior)
28. Trail Blazers (via CLE): Dwayne Bacon (Florida State, SF, 6'7", Sophomore)
 
RJKarl said:
Let's also look at the reality of the top of the second round this year:

31. Atlanta- unless they trade Milsap, this would be a horrible landing place for JC, plus they have Mike Scott as a back-up.
32. Phoenix- They drafted Criss and Bender in the lottery this year. They have long-term contracts
33. Orlando - They Ibaka and Jeff Green. no minutes for JC
34. Orlando - They Ibaka and Jeff Green. no minutes for JC
35. New Orl- The Brow
36. New Orleans- The Brow
37. Miami- there would definitely be minutes but by this late $$$ are going way down and JC should return
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Orlando probably won't have Ibaka or Green on its roster come the draft.
 
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