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Totally Unofficial 2023/24 Premier League Thread

It's not just a missed call, though, even something the PGMOL has admitted and accepted now. It rises above that even if some can understandably point towards the outcome being similar to other situations that were fucked up. I don't know if the difference warrants an extreme measure like a replay -- I tend to think not -- but everyone seems to acknowledge that this is different than just a missed call. And Klopp made a point of saying this -- all managers deal with bad decisions, but for him this felt different, was pretty much unprecedented in how it played out, and that he personally thought a replay would be fair, though he preferred a scenario where it could have been fixed immediately. I don't agree with a replay, but I get how in a response to an unprecedented situation, someone might think some unprecedented recourse might be considered.
 
It's only novel in the context of VAR - which I understand - but this exact offside call has been missed a million times. The only difference is it's 2023 instead of 2020 (or whenever). No doubt it sucks for Pool but in the grand scheme of things, it's not an unusual thing to happen to a PL team over the course of a season. And it's clear it's not even a biased error.
 
Right, the outcome is not dissimilar to other outcomes, I totally get that. But I don’t think we can ignore the context of the VAR in this instance, and the bizarre nature that led to that outcome not being corrected, even though it was realized almost immediately.
 
because offside calls weren't known immediately to be wrong before the magical VAR was invented
 
Presumably, it's a one-off event that will effect some change in protocols to prevent its recurrence. I feel for Pool and their fans but only so much.
 
They announced that Darren England won’t ref Liverpool again this season. That kind of implies that bias could have played a role. It’s a mistake PGMOL, just move on and quit stepping on your dick.
 
fuck all that

the goal was chalked off in the 34th minute. who knows how that game plays out if Liverpool correctly get the goal there. That moment, and the rest of the game, don't happen in a vacuum.
 
deacvision7 said:
because offside calls weren't known immediately to be wrong before the magical VAR was invented
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Not that the offside wasn't recognized immediately, that their fuck up for not properly communicating this was recognized immediately and still nothing was done.
 
thats down to the stupid protocols that English refs have put on themselves. I don't believe that in the Laws of the Game they couldn't have pulled it back and awarded the goal.

They 100% should have told the on field referee tho. I'm sure they didn't want to create bias in his mind to "even it out" but he should have been made aware. I wonder if Ange would have let Liverpool walk the ball into their net and then just moved on from there. Stuff like that has certainly happened before wen coaches take it upon themselves to right an obvious official error
 
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deacvision7 said:
thats down to the stupid protocols that English refs have put on themselves. I don't believe that in the Laws of the Game they couldn't have pulled it back and awarded the goal.

They 100% should have told the on field referee tho. I'm sure they didn't want to create bias in his mind to "even it out" but he should have been made aware. I wonder if Ange would have let Liverpool walk the ball into their net and then just moved on from there. Stuff like that has certainly happened before wen coaches take it upon themselves to right an obvious official error
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I hope that Liverpool would have let Alisson walk it in, been awhile since he scored.
 
timdunkandthefunk said:
They announced that Darren England won’t ref Liverpool again this season. That kind of implies that bias could have played a role. It’s a mistake PGMOL, just move on and quit stepping on your dick.
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That's just ridiculous.

He either can do the job or he can't. Last thing EPL needs is a complex matrix of refs and vars that can/cannot do certain teams/matches. I guess I shouldn't be surprised.
 
He likely requested to not do them so that he wouldn't be murdered.
 

Amazing to me that for a nation with the talent of England, there's no left back with Chilwell and Shaw injured, and Phillips, Henderson and Maquire are still getting called in. ​

England squad​

Goalkeepers: Sam Johnstone (Crystal Palace), Jordan Pickford (Everton), Aaron Ramsdale (Arsenal)

Defenders: Levi Colwill (Chelsea), Lewis Dunk (Brighton & Hove Albion), Marc Guehi (Crystal Palace), Harry Maguire (Manchester United), John Stones (Manchester City), Fikayo Tomori (AC Milan), Kieran Trippier (Newcastle United), Kyle Walker (Manchester City)

Midfielders: Trent Alexander-Arnold (Liverpool), Jude Bellingham (Real Madrid), Conor Gallagher (Chelsea), Jordan Henderson (Al-Ettifaq), Kalvin Phillips (Manchester City), Declan Rice (Arsenal)

Forwards: Jarrod Bowen (West Ham United) Phil Foden (Manchester City), Jack Grealish (Manchester City), Harry Kane (Bayern Munich), James Maddison (Tottenham Hotspur), Eddie Nketiah (Arsenal), Marcus Rashford (Manchester United), Bukayo Saka (Arsenal), Ollie Watkins (Aston Villa)
 
my ability to talk about VAR and referee decisions has been burnt out; perhaps I'll get fired up again after the next snafu.

so I'll turn my attention to other exciting and topical news - stadium talk. The outfit that was working on both the Liverpool and Fulham projects went bust, but both projects have resumed. Seems like Liverpool is going to open up additional capacity in several stages, and hopes to finish by December. Fulham won't finish their work until 2024, which is an awfully long time, especially when some kind of work first began in 2019. Obviously both clubs will be affected on upcoming balance sheets due to loss in revenue and increase in expense.
 
BTB said:

Amazing to me that for a nation with the talent of England, there's no left back with Chilwell and Shaw injured, and Phillips, Henderson and Maquire are still getting called in. ​

England squad​

Goalkeepers: Sam Johnstone (Crystal Palace), Jordan Pickford (Everton), Aaron Ramsdale (Arsenal)

Defenders: Levi Colwill (Chelsea), Lewis Dunk (Brighton & Hove Albion), Marc Guehi (Crystal Palace), Harry Maguire (Manchester United), John Stones (Manchester City), Fikayo Tomori (AC Milan), Kieran Trippier (Newcastle United), Kyle Walker (Manchester City)

Midfielders: Trent Alexander-Arnold (Liverpool), Jude Bellingham (Real Madrid), Conor Gallagher (Chelsea), Jordan Henderson (Al-Ettifaq), Kalvin Phillips (Manchester City), Declan Rice (Arsenal)

Forwards: Jarrod Bowen (West Ham United) Phil Foden (Manchester City), Jack Grealish (Manchester City), Harry Kane (Bayern Munich), James Maddison (Tottenham Hotspur), Eddie Nketiah (Arsenal), Marcus Rashford (Manchester United), Bukayo Saka (Arsenal), Ollie Watkins (Aston Villa)
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how is nick pope not their #1 keeper?.. i know he is average with his feet/distribution, but he is top notch and stopping shots and commands the box.
 
Henderson, Phillips, and Maguire continuing to get called up is bizarre at this point. He likes them, I get it, and probably values the experience/personalities, etc., and those are valuable, but probably moreso in an actual tournament, so why you wouldn't want in some of these matches to get a better look at players in form (or actually playing), I just find bizarre.
 
Like, why add Bowen as a ninth attacker rather than just giving Saka a break since he's struggling with something, and looking at another midfielder, or seeing what you may have with a younger left back, or just something even sort of different.
 
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