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Wake/duke Game Thread

First, Moore should get 10 a game just being on the floor. If our perimeter offense gets better, Moore is going to have a lot of dunks when teams push out on our shooters, especially if we have three legit threats out there. Moore is a bigger target inside the guards are not going to have to thread a needle to get him the ball due to his size. Finally, Moore is a traditional big, we've seen over and over again that those guys take two years to really adjust to the college game, unless they are super elite.
 
Is there a replay anywhere of Crawford's attempted layup with like 30-40 seconds left?
 
RJKarl said:
The ACC's strength is at SG/SF. It's also our weakness. We cannot stop opposition players at those positions and Collins can only help so much without getting into foul trouble.

The fact that we have done this well completely disproves your post.
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We haven't beaten even ONE team whom were weren't favored against. Not one.
 
RChildress107 said:
1. We are actually better than a bubble team but our horrible record in close games, especially against top 50 teams, has left us on the bubble. I know some of you think this is a systemic issue with Manning's coaching that is unlikely to be corrected next year but I find that concern to be vastly overstated. More likely it's a result of inexperience, poor wing defense, and bad luck.

2. Assuming Chaundee is an average defender and performs to his recruiting rank, our defense should improve dramatically without any loss to our perimeter offense (by Chaundee replacing some of Arians' and Wilbekin's minutes.

3. The loss of Collins shouldn't hurt our interior defense too badly. Moore is a capable post defender with some easily correctable habits that keep him from being a dominant post defender. Given the improvement Collins made on that end of the floor, especially with regards to foul trouble, I would hope Manning could make similar progress with Moore in an expanded role. Dinos has improved his defense dramatically and is somewhere near replacement level on that end. SJM and hopefully Sarr can at least provide big bodies down low.

4. The key question will be the offense. Collins is the focal point and the biggest reason we have a top 10 offense. We don't have anyone who can come close to replacing his production in the post. However, we will have a very good, experienced backcourt that can shoot. Depending on how college ready Chaundee is, we will have four perimeter players who can create their own shot (starters + Childress). Also Dinos and Moore each have things they can contibute to an offense which should keep defenses honest while our offense runs through our guards. We won't have Collins as a safety valve but I trust that Manning can put together a top 30 offense out of the pieces we have next year.
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Inexperience, poor wing defense and bad luck. That's bullshit. It's bad late game coaching. 3 years of it so far.
 
CharlotteDeac1 said:
Yeah last year a lot of people were saying we wouldn't be able to replace devin but we did that and
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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JC was better than DT last year but he couldn't score, rebound and block shots sitting beside DM.
 
BlackAndGold2 said:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=3OI5K3byPKY

Just watched the game for the first time, we played one hell of a game. Hope the committee at least took notice of what went down against a duke team that is peaking despite the fact we lost.
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I followed this link to watch the end of the game. On our possession down 1 with under a minute... As soon as the switch happened and Allen (or was it Kennard) was guarding Collins inside we should have done nothing but wait for an opportunity to give him the ball. Mitoglou should have just thrown it up at the basket. Or Crawford should have stayed on the left side and let Collins maneuver.
Having said that, Crawford got a great drive and a much easier layup attempt that I expected to see. I think he would make that 7 or 8 times out of 10. And, as someone else mentioned, Allen blatantly shoved Collins out of the way for the rebound. If we take the lead there, we likely would have lost on a last second shot - but I would have liked to see us have that chance...
 
John Collins is a potential lottery pick at the end of this year. The thought that anyone on this board actually believed that would occur one year ago is amusing. I wouldn't discount the potential of Doral or Sam to improve substantially.
 
BlackjackMc said:
John Collins is a potential lottery pick at the end of this year. The thought that anyone on this board actually believed that would occur one year ago is amusing. I wouldn't discount the potential of Doral or Sam to improve substantially.
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No one thought that he was going to be a lottery pick after his sophomore year. Everyone knew that he was better than Doral though. And, from my perspective, Doral had improved minimally at best while in the program.

Maybe I am overdoing this, but my view is that we are good because we have a very efficient offense, and Collins is absolutely the centerpiece that makes it work. Unless Doral or Sam makes an even bigger step forward than Collins did, we are going to have to get our points in a substantially different way next year. Furthermore, while Chaundee in time will certainly prove to be a major upgrade, he may not provide what Arians does on offense from day one. I think shaping a top 30 offense is a much tougher feat next year than people think. In 5 years as a coach, Danny has had one top 100 offense.

On the defensive side, we should be better at defending the wing but I think it's entirely possible that we take a step back at the 5. Doral is not good at fouling without defense, and, absent good recruiting news, we will not have much depth behind him.

We will see how things sort out, I just don't see a freshman enabling the defense take a big enough step forward to cover the offense slipping.

That's fine though. Does, imo, make it imperative that we make the post season this year. And we certainly should.
 
Lurker, I agree that Collins is the centerpiece that makes the offense efficient. His loss would require a retooling of how the offense operates. What Doral or Sam would provide offensively won't match what JC provides.

I do think Chaundee will be an improvement on Arians both on offense and defense. Most top 40 recruits at the wing accommodate to the speed and size of the college game as their freshman season progresses and make a solid contribution.

Dinos should also improve offensively. He is just beginning to show an ability to finish around the hoop. For most of this season he has had to concentrate on his movement and positioning around the basket and hasn't been able to finish, hence a lot of missed lay ups. I look for that to change.

Defensively, I am more optimistic than you about Moore and Sam at center. Doral performs better when he knows he will be on the floor and the rest of the players are more aggressive on D when he is at the rim. Collins need to stay on the floor has limited his effectiveness on defense. Worse case, there are 10 fouls to give between Doral and Sam so there is no reason to limit their defensive commitment in the middle.

Then again Collins might come back. He will likely declare and will receive feedback from the NBA and DM about an appropriate course of action. The one aspect seldom discussed in his decision is his mother. Her input was a deciding factor in his choice of Wake Forest. I suspect she will be an integral part of any decision made.
 
scooter84 said:
And, as someone else mentioned, Allen blatantly shoved Collins out of the way for the rebound. If we take the lead there, we likely would have lost on a last second shot - but I would have liked to see us have that chance...
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Crawford was asking for a foul on the first layup and, honestly, I thought it was an ok no call. Crawford got a really good look, and an unlucky roll. I was way more pissed about what I thought was an obvious shove to Collins back, and I was right. Only place that doesn't get called is probably on Duke, at Duke. And by their dirtiest player, no less.
 
I too rewatched the last few minutes of the game.

I feel Gray Allen should have received a tech for taunting Van Horn. Real happy Van Horn fucking shouldered the shit out of him for a big rebound with about 2 minutes to go. Good for him. Fuck Allen. With his rep, I have no idea why he wasn't T-ed up for that. It is possible he didn't bark anything, just a stare. but he stopped and leaned down. T that fucker up.

Bad 3 point shot by Chill. He's a frosh, he'll learn, but you got two monsters on the court with you in Craw and Collins. Defer youngblood.

Would have been a slightly different final 2 minutes had Dinos not had a freak goaltending call at the beginning of the 2nd half.

of course, the Gray Allen kick of Collins should have been a 1-1 the other way. Possible 4 point turnaround.

Crawford did miss a bunny layup. No foul, but Collins was shoved by Allen. That's a foul. As someone said above, should have thrown it into Collins on the play.

Woods was not quite aggressive enough with his shot IMO. He took his shot only when the shot clock was down or he was wide open.
 
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