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Grobe or Clawson, who ya got?

Doeren at State is making a push to occupy that second slot, and Syracuse worries me for the future, with their prior tradition and what would appear to be a strong recruiting base in the northeast. I think even die hard Pack fans might question Doeren's game management, but he is recruiting at a very high level right now. The division is so tough.
 
coredeac said:
Lol. He's a great coach for Wake but Michigan and Notre Dame are not going to ring his phone. He's doing great things for Wake but let's not get carried away.
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Read what I said. Did I say they were after him yet?? No asshat. I said those would be the jobs he would leave for because of their academic beliefs. He would have to get himself up to 9-10 win seasons before they could come calling, plus have the need.
 
ChrisL68 said:
Grobe had higher Highs, but I think if anybody did an honest assessment of which coach had the tools to be better positioned for future sustain success, it would be Clawson.
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Yes, exactly so far. But Grobe just plain & simple quit and that is what I cannot forgive him for and I do not believe that Clawson and his staff will do that.
 
Deaconblue said:
There are a handful of upper echelon football programs at schools with excellent academics. Clawson might be tempted by one of them, particularly if he feels that he has reached a plateau at Wake.

Having re$ource$ for assistant coaches and analysts will be important going forward.
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This. Reminds me of Satterfield at App. Seems like he did all he could do there and a bigger program came calling with more resources and money. I love Dave and what he's doing at Wake but I am also no fool. He keeps having success at Wake and keeps the Deacs bowling, someone will lure him away. He doesn't need to win the ACC for that to happen either.
 
TexasDeac1 said:
Doeren at State is making a push to occupy that second slot, and Syracuse worries me for the future, with their prior tradition and what would appear to be a strong recruiting base in the northeast. I think even die hard Pack fans might question Doeren's game management, but he is recruiting at a very high level right now. The division is so tough.
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No doubt. The Atlantic side is tough as shit which makes what Wake did this year even more impressive in my opinion.
 
TheReff said:
Read what I said. Did I say they were after him yet?? No asshat. I said those would be the jobs he would leave for because of their academic beliefs. He would have to get himself up to 9-10 win seasons before they could come calling, plus have the need.
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Ain't happening. Just enjoy what he has brought to our program.
 
WFU Lurker said:
The thing folks seems to be missing is that Grobe’s first five seasons weren’t great at all, especially after the first two. Closeness has surpassed that. He may never match year 6 though.
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In year 1, Grobe went 6-5, beating ECU on road, App State at home. Losing by 1 possession to #11 Maryland, NC State, #24 Georgia Tech, and Clemson. Perhaps one of the most forgotten games, the 28-3 second half comeback against an 8-5 UNC team, was a highlight as well

In year 2, he won a bowl game against a good Oregon team.

Year three, we beat a very good Boston College team on the road, and Beat #14 NC State at home stacked with NFL players: Philip Rivers, Sean Locklear, Jerricho Cotchery, AJ Davis, Manny Lawson, Mario Williams among others. I believe we were in the top 25 after that start, before a 1 possession loss to pre season ranked Purdue, the Lobo shotgun call on 4th and 1 We were 5-4, headed in to a stretch playing a 3-8 UNC, .500 Maryland team, and a UCONN team playing their first or second year at division 1. That year didn't end well. Lots of close losses, save Dan Orlovsky smoking us.

Year 4, there were 2 OT losses on the road to Clemson and NC State. We also lost to #5 FSU at home 20-17. 6 of the 7 losses were by 7 points or less, the only blowout loss coming @ #12 Miami.

Year 5, We started Ben Mauk over 5th year senior Cory Randolph. Mauk started 1-3, before we made the switch. Randolph's first three games back, we beat #21 Clemson, Lost at #4 Florida State, but played them tough, and then blew a 9 point lead at BC and Matt Ryan's coming out with 2:00 left in the game. I think we beat Vandy and Maryland with Cory Randolph as starter and make a bowl that year if not for the decision to start Mauk.

It's a results business, and 1 bowl game and 2 winning seasons in 5 years on the surface isn't spectacular. But you could certainly see Grobe's teams giving better recruited, and ranked teams all they could handle down to the wire. A great couple of recruiting classes and the "fresh deacs" made 2006 possible. But I think it was built on some success and experience 2002-2005.
 
I think Grobe staying loyal to avg or below avg assistants was his downfall and the reason for some poorly recruited and poor years 2010-2013. Especially after losing some great assistants like Troy Calhoun, Kevin Sherman, Jeff Mullen, Brad Lambert, Dean Hood (ST and DBs coach for #15 Kentucky this year).

I think Clawson being willing to put his feelings aside and make a move to try to change the fortunes of his football team, like fire a DC midseason, is a plus over Grobe. But I don't think Grobe quit. I think recruiting became harder for smaller schools doing it the way he did, and finding special players no one was recruiting like Barclay, Abbate or Curry, with high school recruiting tapes becoming easily accessible.

Clawson has out recruited Grobe from a rankings standpoint thus far. He has a great plan, and sells recruits and their families on the academic opportunity at Wake. Grobe never really competed for those athletes that Clawson gets, and instead found the non-blue chip, but special players, which became harder as technology became better IMHO.
 
That, and winning 5 conference games, making a bowl game, one win against a ranked FSU team in 2011, wasn't "dismal" in my opinion. additionally there was a 7 point loss to Notre Dame, OT loss at Cuse, 3 point loss AT #10 Clemson as well.

IIRC, that Clemson loss, had it been a win, puts us in the ACC championship game.
 
He was 23-38 with zero winning seasons over his last five years. By any definition, that's dismal.
 
2012, Vandy, Notre Dame, Army and Liberty, where we had a 2-2 record vs this year a 3-1 record vs Tulane, Towson, Rice, and ND, were the difference in a bowl game and a 6-6 season, with a 3-5 conference record. If we could sub out Vandy with Tulane in 2012, we make a bowl game, just like this year.
 
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Apples and oranges, but if you give Clawson (and Rug) our talent from '05-'09 in a down ACC, I think he does even better than Grobe. People forget how awful Lobo was.

8-5 and 5-7 in '08-'09 were just criminally bad coaching. If you look at the game-by-game results, we honestly should have gone 11-1 in '08 (the 1 being the bed shitting @Maryland) that year.
 
RJKarl said:
He was 23-38 with zero winning seasons over his last five years. By any definition, that's dismal.
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Dave Clawson is 12-28 in conference with 0 winning seasons in conference in 5 years. Is that dismal?
 
If we hadn't voted against allowing JC transfers, we would have had Artis Gilmore to play with Charlie Davis and Gil McGregor.

If CP3 hadn't pulled a hammie in last year's playoffs, the Rox may be the reigning NBA champs.

If I had the winning lottery numbers, I'd have about $150M after taxes.

None of those happened, just like none of what you said happened. The reality is he had a .377 winning percentage over a five year period and that sucks.
 
tigerswood said:
Apples and oranges, but if you give Clawson (and Rug) our talent from '05-'09 in a down ACC, I think he does even better than Grobe. People forget how awful Lobo was.

8-5 and 5-7 in '08-'09 were just criminally bad coaching. If you look at the game-by-game results, we honestly should have gone 11-1 in '08 (the 1 being the bed shitting @Maryland) that year.
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Riley Skinner threw 5 ints against Navy in one of those games. I'm not sure that's coaching necessarily.
 
RJKarl said:
If we hadn't voted against allowing JC transfers, we would have had Artis Gilmore to play with Charlie Davis and Gil McGregor.

If CP3 hadn't pulled a hammie in last year's playoffs, the Rox may be the reigning NBA champs.

If I had the winning lottery numbers, I'd have about $150M after taxes.

None of those happened, just like none of what you said happened. The reality is he had a .377 winning percentage over a five year period and that sucks.
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Clawson has a .300 winning percentage in 5 years in conference, and that sucks.
 
The difference is one is on an upswing. The other was going the wrong direction.

Add to that, Clawson's first year was almost entirely due to the bare cupboard Grobe left him. Due to the nature of football, much of the second year was also due to the lack of talent Clawson was left.

I don't think Clawson is a god, but he is better than Grobe was during his last years at Wake.
 
I like Jim Grobe but he left nothing in the cupboard when he left.
 
SDeacz said:
Riley Skinner threw 5 ints against Navy in one of those games. I'm not sure that's coaching necessarily.
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Both Navy games were crap weather (especially the 09 game) where we had a massive size advantage on the OL/DL. In the first loss, Riley did throw 4 INTs. Our Lobo-trash offense rushed 31 times for 43 (!!!) yards. Navy had 292 yards rushing.
 
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