State of the Buzz - End of Year Three (Regular Season)

[deacvision7]

I don't have the minutes played but.....the returning players in 2006 were Hale (So. 8.5 pts), Drum (Sr, 8.5 pts), and Visser (Sr, 17 pts)...34 points a game spread over 3 players. This year it was CJ and McKie with ~29 points and 2 players who have been running hot and cold in each game and hardly go to guys to carry a team until recently with CJ. That's a fairly big difference on the positive side....when you include the bench players......being able to put a Swinton or Weaver into the game. We could field a team of non-freshmen in 2006. We could not do that this year could we? That means less confidence and more mistakes...period. So IMO there was more O and a fewer errors in 2006 compared to this year. It may not seem like much but who was the 3rd player that contributed as a non-freshman? We needed that soph to step up and there was no one. That killed us, especially early.

In the end that team performed much like this one. 5-11 in the ACC vs 6-12 for this team....and 15-16 overall vs 13-17. That's not a big difference and that team had some distinct numbers advantages. Looks about the same to me....as one might expect, except we got blown out by a team coached by....

GOOD GOD, MAN.

Kevin Swinton?? That's your go to? KEVIN FUCKING SWINTON?!!?

:rofl:

 

[bmoneydeac]

i think it was dcdeac that coined swinton "the binary code" because his box scores were always filled with 1's and 0's. that's a great nickname. retroactive posrep.

 

[Wrangor]

He was the MAAC PoY this year, and Iona is playing for the MAAC title tonight.

Have you forgotten that we were down by 30 in the first half against Iona? What possible argument could be made against that...At one point the score was 30-3. Let me make that a little clearer....

30-3

With 5 minutes to go in the first the score was 48-11. Against Iona. At a neutral site. Good grief. He should have been fired immediately following that game. My 2 year old son could have at least got us to 4 points before Iona hit 30.

 

[Strickland33]

So, factoring those I know to be BuzzOut, the current count is 296-7 in favor of BuzzOut. That's 97.6%.

BuzzOut 'til he's gone.

 

[RChildress107]

I don't have the minutes played but.....the returning players in 2006 were Hale (So. 8.5 pts), Drum (Sr, 8.5 pts), and Visser (Sr, 17 pts)...34 points a game spread over 3 players. This year it was CJ and McKie with ~29 points and 2 players who have been running hot and cold in each game and hardly go to guys to carry a team until recently with CJ. That's a fairly big difference on the positive side....when you include the bench players......being able to put a Swinton or Weaver into the game. We could field a team of non-freshmen in 2006. We could not do that this year could we? That means less confidence and more mistakes...period. So IMO there was more O and a fewer errors in 2006 compared to this year. It may not seem like much but who was the 3rd player that contributed as a non-freshman? We needed that soph to step up and there was no one. That killed us, especially early.

In the end that team performed much like this one. 5-11 in the ACC vs 6-12 for this team....and 15-16 overall vs 13-17. That's not a big difference and that team had some distinct numbers advantages. Looks about the same to me....as one might expect, except we got blown out by a team coached by....

This years team returned more offense than that team. Those three guys you mentioned combined for 15 points the previous season. That team finished 40 spots higher in kenpom and played a much more difficult schedule.

But if that example doesn't suit you how about the 98-99 team whose top 7 were four freshman and three sophomores. That team went 17-14 and finished fourth in the ACC.

The broader point is that you don't get to create a situation in which you have seven freshman on your roster (which never happens) and then use those freshman as a reason why you had a horrible season and then point out that no one else has done better with 6 out of their 9 top players being freshman while ignoring the fact that no one ever puts their program in a situation where 6 of their top 9 players are freshman.

 

[dartsndeacs]

I love the joke of having to qualify end of "regular" season as if that != the end of the season. A+

 

[PhDeac]

Have you forgotten that we were down by 30 in the first half against Iona? What possible argument could be made against that...At one point the score was 30-3. Let me make that a little clearer....

30-3

With 5 minutes to go in the first the score was 48-11. Against Iona. At a neutral site. Good grief. He should have been fired immediately following that game. My 2 year old son could have at least got us to 4 points before Iona hit 30.

Those of us at the ND game can't comprehend the full horror of the Iona game.

 

[TBDeac]

Momo Jones is MAAC PoY. He's a good MAAC basketball player. He also did a pretty solid Tony Chennault impression while at Arizona.

I know this is totally irrelevant but why are you hating on Jones? He was the second leading scorer on an Elite 8 team.

 

[RacerDeac]

Those of us at the ND game can't comprehend the full horror of the Iona game.

No one can blame you. You had you're own horrors and you spent a lot of $$ to get them. So glad I couldn't make that trip this year.

 

[VOTSdeac]

What is interesting (and somewhat scary) to me about this poll is the sample size. Only 300 people. I just sort of assumed that any logical Wake fan would have to be BzzOut, but 300 is a pretty low number, especially considering that there are at least around 8,000 Wake fans that fill the Joel for every game.

I was talking to a friend of mine the other day who is a big Wake fan (and WF grad), and he is BzzIn. This guy is very intelligent, as well. He said, "I was talking to a UNC fan who's really impressed by the job [Redacted] has done." I think somehow that Wake fans are easily swayed by other fans' opinions, because I just don't see how anyone can objectively say that Bz has done a great job turning the team around. We were an NCAA team the year before he got here and have been putrid since then. I know we lost players and all, but you would have to find some objective improvement to say he's done a very impressive job, and it's just not there.

My friend also pointed to our "incredible home record" this year, which by the way is 11-5. I would say that an "incredible" home record is 16-0, like we had in 2004-05. I would say that 11-5 is decent. I don't know if he was just swayed by the Miami and NCSt games, but it's hard to forget the terrible losses to Seton Hall, Nebraska, GT, and Maryland.

Anyway, the point of all this is that I'm afraid that there's a decent chance that the majority of the fanbase can buy in to Wellman's rah-rah attitude. He puts out a few good talking points, and maybe the average Wake fan will eat them up. Sure, there are 300 of us on this site that realize the absurdity of it all, but I am just now more aware that maybe we're actually in the minority. Pretty scary to think about.

 

[RacerDeac]

I was talking to a friend of mine the other day who is a big Wake fan (and WF grad), and he is BzzIn. This guy is very intelligent, as well.

You misspelled willfully ignorant.

 

[RacerDeac]

Anyway, the point of all this is that I'm afraid that there's a decent chance that the majority of the fanbase can buy in to Wellman's rah-rah attitude. He puts out a few good talking points, and maybe the average Wake fan will eat them up. Sure, there are 300 of us on this site that realize the absurdity of it all, but I am just now more aware that maybe we're actually in the minority. Pretty scary to think about.

We're not. Not even close. Most are just apathetic and don't care enough to say what they are, but almost none are happy with where we are and/or buying into Wellman's BS.

300 people took the time to respond to the poll, but there are hundreds more posters who post or just lurk that simply haven't responded. There are 722 people logged on right now.

 

[DCDeac]

i think it was dcdeac that coined swinton "the binary code" because his box scores were always filled with 1's and 0's. that's a great nickname. retroactive posrep.

Pretty impressed you remember that was me. The "grid" of Kevin Swinton's binary games in 2006/2007 (seriously, this will never be duplicated):

0-0 .000 0-0 .000 0-0 .000 0 0 0 0 1 0 0
0-1 .000 0-0 .000 0-0 .000 1 0 0 0 0 0 0
0-1 .000 0-0 .000 0-0 .000 1 0 0 1 1 0 0
0-0 .000 0-0 .000 0-0 .000 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
0-1 .000 0-0 .000 0-0 .000 0 0 0 0 0 1 0
0-1 .000 0-0 .000 0-0 .000 1 0 0 0 1 1 0
0-0 .000 0-0 .000 0-0 .000 1 0 0 0 1 1 0
0-1 .000 0-0 .000 0-0 .000 0 0 0 0 1 1 0
0-0 .000 0-0 .000 0-0 .000 1 0 0 0 0 0 0
0-0 .000 0-0 .000 0-0 .000 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
0-1 .000 0-0 .000 0-1 .000 0 0 0 0 0 1 0

What's really scary is how many almost binary games he had I couldn't include where he either made 1 bucket for 2 points or he got 2 rebounds - with every other stat being a 1 or 0.

 

[pourdeac]

P.S. The ACC in 2007 had 7 NCAA Tournament teams and 3 NIT teams. This year, a solid half of the conference may miss out on the postseason.

Are you actually touting a team ranked 87 in KemPom as AWESOME? My point is just that the two teams are roughly the same. 87 vs 124 isn't much different in reality. I'm not the one inflating the success of a BAD team.

 

[deacvision7]

No, you are just trying to forgive the unforgivable of a 3rd straight losing season.

 

[myDeaconmyhand]

Are you actually touting a team ranked 87 in KemPom as AWESOME? My point is just that the two teams are roughly the same. 87 vs 124 isn't much different in reality. I'm not the one inflating the success of a BAD team.

No one said that team was awesome, but it was a hell of a lot better than this one. Finishing 4th in a good ACC, vs 10th is a huge difference.

 

[pourdeac]

GOOD GOD, MAN.

Kevin Swinton?? That's your go to? KEVIN FUCKING SWINTON?!!?

So you're take from all of that is my go to is Kevin Swinton???? Pathetic argument and reading comprehension....really f'ing pathetic.

There is more to "team" than what happens on the floor, and i'm not talking about culture, I'm talking about adjustment from high school and dealing with the ACC. That's why having more experience WILL help. I heard Coach K talk on the radio last week and Roy last night. BOTH of them said the hardest thing about a team is dealing with adversity, not learning to score points. Dealing with adversity is something that comes from having experienced players (their comments) and we have VERY few of them. Adversity is what happens in every game. That's not even arguable. Not dealing well with adversity is what is showing up on the road. If you want to pretend having a team with just 2 upperclassmen and 1 soph is great and should be tourny bound just because it's Bz year 3, knock yourself out. It ain't happening most of the time and deep down you know it.

 

[pourdeac]

No, you are just trying to forgive the unforgivable of a 3rd straight losing season.

Forgive the unforgivable? LOL......wow, so now the reason that one would expect from a school like Wake is tossed out and religious zealotry is in control? Does this go something like....

First shalt thou hire a coach. Then, shalt thou count to three years, no more, no less. Three years shalt be the number thou shalt count, and the number of the counting shall be three. Four years shalt thou not count unless NCAA bound earlier, nor either count thou two years, excepting that thou then proceed to three years. Five years is right out unless NCAA bound twice. Once the number three, being the third year, be reached, then sack the coach if not NCAA bound. Thus sayeth the Lord.

I'm not religiously stuck to some sort of schedule like you are.....and I don't have visions of a Wake ideal "promised land" without Bz like you do. Same guy is in charge.

I've stated many times Dino should have gotten another year with players that he recruited, and not be evaluated coaching players as the big brother while they were missing their father-like Skip. I've stated many times and in this very thread that it was a complete mistake to hire Bz because he didn't fit the players or recruits. BOTH are what should be unforgivable...and neither is Bz. I think Bz should get another year with HIS players regardless of what happened in years 1 and 2 (and sanctioned by Wake). I think you and the 98%ers have most of your anger misplaced.

Replacing Bz isn't going to fix our problem.

 

[BobStackFan4Life]

If Bz is back next year would it be wrong of me to hate the fans who continue to get season tickets? Of course Wellman is the person most responsible but I can't help but think they're also culpable in this fiasco continuing.

 

[Bronson Pinchot]

If Bz is back next year would it be wrong of me to hate the fans who continue to get season tickets? Of course Wellman is the person most responsible but I can't help but think they're also culpable in this fiasco continuing.

Blaming the fans, like blaming the players, is asinine.