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Steve Forbes credibility watch

Oh, and 2and2, I was being very generous to you regarding Sallis and Reid's talent levels.

When Forbes got Sallis and Reid, it looked more like this on transfer rankings:
Sallis: 4 star, #130
Reid: 4 star, #145

Why do they look like 5 star players again? Coaching
 
I wish 2&2 could get life coached by forbes. May take him from 0 star to a 1 star. Would be the best coaching job yet.
 
MichDeac25 said:
First, we aren't on the bubble anymore barring a total collapse.

Second, the only reason we were on the bubble before the Duke game is because the team we have now is not the same team we had for all of out-of-conference with Efton not being approved.
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So Efton wasn't on the team when we lost @FSU, @NCSU, @UNC, @Pitt, @Duke, or @ UVA? He was there for all of those losses, and the inability to win any of those games is why we are on the ubble.
 
So are you upset about being 3rd or 4th in the ACC at the moment? Serious question.
 
2&2 reminds me of when I was a kid and my dad would say…
Dad: “You always have to get the last word, don’t you?”
Me: “No I don’t”
Dad looking at me with a shiteating grin and me annoyed that I fell for that

Dude just stop
 
deacfan123 said:
So are you upset about being 3rd or 4th in the ACC at the moment? Serious question.
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I care about making the (64 team) tournament. That's it. I don't think conference standings have jack shit to do with making the tournament, other than being a reflection of the underlying record that dictates admittance. If being 3rd or 4th in the ACC gets us in, then I'm happy with it. If, this year, being 3rd or 4th in the ACC is not enough to get us in, then I would not be pleased, but it would just be another in 14 years of not being pleased. And no, 2017 does not count.
 
2&2 Slider To Leyritz said:
I care about making the (64 team) tournament. That's it. I don't think conference standings have jack shit to do with making the tournament, other than being a reflection of the underlying record that dictates admittance. If being 3rd or 4th in the ACC gets us in, then I'm happy with it. If, this year, being 3rd or 4th in the ACC is not enough to get us in, then I would not be pleased, but it would just be another in 14 years of not being pleased. And no, 2017 does not count.
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Saying conference standings dont have jack shit to do with it is the same as saying winning doesnt matter. It is a reflection of our season to this point. And to this point we are a tournament team. We can't predict the future but right now we are looking pretty damn good to accomplish all that you say you care about.

So quit bitching
 
deacfan123 said:
Saying conference standings dont have jack shit to do with it is the same as saying winning doesnt matter. It is a reflection of our season to this point. And to this point we are a tournament team. We can't predict the future but right now we are looking pretty damn good to accomplish all that you say you care about.

So quit bitching
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I literally said that it is a reflection of the underlying record. And yes, if we get in I will be much more appreciative of Forbes. But we're not there yet, and decades of being a Wake fan are not going to let me think we are there yet.
 
2&2 Slider To Leyritz said:
I understand that style, but that only consistently works if you have much, much better talent than your opposition. Otherwise you get exactly what we have seen: a wildly inconsistent team that can look fantastic at times but often struggles in high pressure situations. Because you have to hope that your players bring their own individual A-games instead of knowing that they have an A-system to rely on even when they aren't playing their best. It is why we have a Center who commits some of the dumbest fouls you'll ever see (in addition to taking some of the worst shots you'll ever see), and you don't know if he'll pick up his 3rd foul 5 minutes into the game 20 feet from the basket. It is why we have a guard with an injured wrist who still hoists shots and thinks he should take the gamewinner away from his better teammates. It is why we have a PG who can either look great or as if he is still on the AAU circuit. It is why, despite virtually everyone saying we have top-25 or top-30 talent, we are still squarely on the bubble even after knocking off a top-10 team.

His style is what it is, but there is only so far that style can take you, as the variation from game to game is too great. We've seen it for 4 years. It rarely translates on the road. Hopefully we catch the lightning at the right time this year. We'll see.
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Not a good luck.
I think you have it backwards. How ‘bout the fact, as we’ve seen many times on many levels, in many sports, where kids want to come play for someone who lets them play? Sure, the talent improves with success, but it has to start somewhere, and Forbes recognizes that.
 
Literally read the article on Sallis today. One of the selling points was a game where Tyree had a bunch of turnovers and coach didn't yank him. So Sallis was like that's the guy that can help me become the player I need to be. Forbes style directly led to us getting Sallis, the best player we've had wear our jersey in a pretty long time. Who is going to take us back to the tourney where we want to go.

Another example of the troll being so wrong, but he will say something along the lines of he should have taken tyree out to win blah blah blah. He's an idiot.
 
I think it is fair to question if he is the right coach for Wake if we don't make the 64 team tournament this season. I don't think it's a controversial take. So IMO the jury is still out
 
Not to completely beat a dead horse (you would think) about why Forbes doesn't yank players out of the game when they make mistakes, but his philosophy is the exact opposite of that. This section from an article on Sallis' recruiting is telling.

Wake Forest was the first program to come out and meet with Sallis in person. Forbes’ fabulous history with transfers was well documented. Alondes Williams, Jake Laravia and Tyree Appleby had all come to Wake Forest and erupted, but Forbes wanted to show something different.

He dialed up the film from Wake Forest’s 96-87 loss to Miami last February. In that game, Appleby turned it over a lot. Twelve times, to be exact.

“The camera kept panning to Coach Forbes and he left him in the game,” Livingston said. “He did not snatch him even though he wasn’t taking care of the ball. Being allowed to play through mistakes was another thing that we felt Hunter needed.”
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247sports.com

Inside how Wake Forest helped Hunter Sallis rediscover his love for basketball

How the once-ballyhooed Gonzaga guard found both Wake Forest and his love for basketball again.
247sports.com 247sports.com
 
WFU03 said:
Not to completely beat a dead horse (you would think) about why Forbes doesn't yank players out of the game when they make mistakes, but his philosophy is the exact opposite of that. This section from an article on Sallis' recruiting is telling.


247sports.com

Inside how Wake Forest helped Hunter Sallis rediscover his love for basketball

How the once-ballyhooed Gonzaga guard found both Wake Forest and his love for basketball again.
247sports.com 247sports.com
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I fail to see how that helps' Forbes credibility. It is cool that Forbes identified the talent in Alondes and Laravia and Appleby, and Forbes turned them into borderline NBA players by letting them play. I'm happy for them. But we didn't make the tournament with any of them. So we had 3 borderline NBA guys over 2 years and his style could not utilize them well enough to make the tournament.

Now we have Sallis, who is also looking like a borderline NBA guy, which is great for him. And we are still on the bubble. If we want to be a G-league team and develop players for the G-league by playing them similar to how the Ignite plays, then that is a cool professional development program to have. But as a college basketball team with our dearth of team success over the last 15 years, that is not the primary goal. He needs to translate the talent into the tournament.
 
WFU03 said:
According to you. Here are the recruiting rankings of our guys that play:

Sallis: 5 star, #19
Reid: 4 star, #28
Hildreth: 4 star, #107
Damari: 3 star, #87
PFred: 3 star, #130
Boopie: 0 star, NR
Marsh: 0 star, NR
Carr: 0 star, NR

That's not a dominant team on paper. Why are we as good as we are? Coaching
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Assuming these are correct, it is pretty awesome that Carr just dominated a Duke team full of 5 stars for the entire second half.
 
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