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16+ stars vs. Culture

PhDeac said:
Bz already had 5 players he re-recruited. He could have stripped offers to JTT and Tabb and he didn't. He recruited 3 players for his first full class. They've totaled one start. Gottfried brought in 3 McD's in his first full class. That's on Bz.
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Ding ding ding.
 
Adam42R said:
This reads like some bizarro combination of actual proven events, random opinions on this (and other) forums, optimistic presentation of information and some zero-source crap and then all put through the chronological-mix-master. Give me a break.
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:tard: Like I said, nothing is proven take it how you want.
 
On a side note... rumor is that after a disastrous 6-20 start this season Kevin O'Neill is gonna be out at USC. Guess JTT and Ari will have to wait and see which coach they will actually be playing for next year.
 
TBR said:
Well obviously Dino should have caught all these red flags: Melvin Tabb had a bit of reputation of being lazy and therefore out of shape (perhaps he just didn't have time due to his involvement with his church's youth group). JTT Terrell played with attitude (although this was lauded by Wake Forest fans). Tony Woods looked kind of mean. Ari Stewart went to a high school that produced a player with an attitude problem.
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He looked mean? Really? That is one of the more asinine things posted about that situation. If you'll recall, Eric Williams was a very aggressive looking man who is far more intimidating than Woods ever was, yet Eric was one of the nicest and softest spoken people I knew at Wake. Looking mean is not a reason for pulling a scholarship.
 
Joke's on me then. Losing in so many new and abysmal ways can quickly ruin one's sarcasm detector.
 
PhDeac said:
Bz already had 5 players he re-recruited. He could have stripped offers to JTT and Tabb and he didn't. He recruited 3 players for his first full class. They've totaled one start. Gottfried brought in 3 McD's in his first full class. That's on Bz.
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Ahh yes, because if Bz had come in and stripped JT and Tabb of their offers, everyone on here would have praised him for putting character first.

It was a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation
 
MysteryMen said:
Ahh yes, because if Bz had come in and stripped JT and Tabb of their offers, everyone on here would have praised him for putting character first.

It was a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation
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They had already signed LOIs so it wasn't going to be quite that easy. In any event, personnel matters are always up to the coach, which I think was Ph's point.
 
Uh yeah. People here love character. People here aren't clamouring to bring JTT and Woods back after their incidents.
 
Well, considering that Bzz had never met the guys, and Battle and LaRue thought they were worthwhile kids, and they had signed LOI's, combined with the fact that if he hadn't signed them he would have had 11 scholarship players, I don't really blame Bzz for bringing these guys in.

Actually, would it have been 10 scholarship players once Woods left? Or would it have been 8 or 9 once Chennault got hurt and Tabb caught "mono?"
 
Ball State Deac said:
They had already signed LOIs so it wasn't going to be quite that easy. In any event, personnel matters are always up to the coach, which I think was Ph's point.
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I get that point, but you shouldn't be saying that Bz doesn't get a pass for leaving the players he inherited on the team when you know you would have had an aneurysm if he had come in and started pulling offers
 
PhDeac said:
Uh yeah. People here love character. People here aren't clamouring to bring JTT and Woods back after their incidents.
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Well at that point, nobody on here knew about their character. So if Bz had pulled their offers after meeting with them because he saw something in their character, people would have flipped because he was running off what they considered good recruits. In fact, maybe if they went somewhere else, the incidents wouldn't have come to light or might not have happened, and everybody would still be complaining about it.

It's the problem that we always have as fans. We don't know 90% of what goes on behind the scenes, so our assumptions are often flawed
 
Seems to be a Bz pattern. Didn't he dump or lose 7 or 8 guys his first couple of years at Colorado? Seriously, the dude has a high turnover rate.
 
TheIshThatSaved WakeForest said:
The entire post was sarcastic.
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Indeed. Hindsight is 20/20.

I recall being pretty excited about the commits chemistry with one another and love of Wake Forest. They seemed like high character guys to me. The only concern I had about the 2010 class was Tabb's work ethic, but [Redacted] was recruiting someone very hard for quite sometime about whom I had similar concerns from the get go.

I am still convinced Ari gets a bum rap for simply not getting along with [Redacted] (mind you he didn't handle the situation perfectly, but how many 19-20 year olds would have).
 
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TBR said:
Ari Stewart went to a high school that produced a player with an attitude problem.
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Ari graduated from Mt. Tabor...which is where CJ graduated. Same class actually. I think CJ's attitude is outstanding considering his coach sucks.
 
MysteryMen said:
Well at that point, nobody on here knew about their character. So if Bz had pulled their offers after meeting with them because he saw something in their character, people would have flipped because he was running off what they considered good recruits. In fact, maybe if they went somewhere else, the incidents wouldn't have come to light or might not have happened, and everybody would still be complaining about it.

It's the problem that we always have as fans. We don't know 90% of what goes on behind the scenes, so our assumptions are often flawed
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People might have been upset, but JTT had multiple offers. No one would have been shocked to lose a couple players from that class. No one could have forced Bzz to take those kids besides Wellman, and he is the one promulgating this culture change shit. JTT looked like the poster child recruit for Skip & Dino's "culture", with his score first mentality and attitude, so his whole ordeal here at Wake is further proof that Wellman and Co. are full of shit. If those players problems were so evident from the start, then Bzz and his staff were wrong for re-recruiting them.
 
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