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BBall Recruiting Thread 2k16- SJM, Washington, Childress & Mitchell sign NLIs; 2017?

ManhassetDeac said:
My fear is that it plays out something like this:

Manning: Harry, we want and need you. What do you say?
Giles: Coach, I'm leaning your way and have pretty much decided. But I've given my word to the other schools that I'd hear them out so I'm going to take all my officials
Manning: Okay, Harry. But we want to build around you so let us know as soon as possible

[following visits]

Manning: What do you say Harry?
Giles: Listen coach, I love Wake Forest but i'm only going to be around for one year and I think with what Duke has already committed they give me a better chance to win
Manning: Well that's why we were pushing for a commitment from you earlier
Giles: I know coach. Sorry

Putting a bunch of 3* star guys around Giles for one year really hurts our chances. I hope i'm wrong, but it's hard to see him go our way.
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Yeah this is where I come out on it as well. There is no way that Giles isn't looking at this Mitchell signing as wtf.
 
2&2 Slider To Leyritz said:
Yeah this is where I come out on it as well. There is no way that Giles isn't looking at this Mitchell signing as wtf.
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Need to remember that as of now, these are not "signings." They are verbal commitments, and only worth the paper they are printed on. See Haas two years ago.
 
Haas decided not to come because Matt Painter told him that Bz was about to get shit canned. We can't just yank committed offers
 
Fuck Your Couch said:
Haas decided not to come because Matt Painter told him the Bz was about to get shit canned. We can't just yank committed offers
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Nah, it was because of all the bad fans on the OGBoards, starting with that Ruskin fellow.
 
I actually think if Harry came we could be pretty good.
Could play a very big athletic, line up with decent size off the bench.
Crawford, Woods, Crab, Harry, Dinos.
If Manning improves our D that's a solid squad. Once Harry leaves we'll take a step back, but I don't think sliding Moore or Collins into that lineup means we're no longer competitive.
I agree that this year's recruiting is weak, but I like the parts he's put together thus far.
 
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DCDeac said:
That doesn't mean we have to start acting like the 2015 class is poor and Manning's goal is to grab 3 stars and worse and hope they pan out.
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Who is saying this? Everyone is pretty happy with the 2015 class and has said so. And I certainly don't think Manning is trying to grab 3 stars, but we have signed three for 2016.

And if you agree that it is easier to build a successful program by recruiting top 100 talent, then we agree there too. I'm not real caught up on the Giles thing. Don't get me wrong, it would be a huge boost to our program, but I'd be happy with a couple of years of classes like last year's. A couple of top 100 guys that were offered by other major programs that we can develop and build on. Signing Giles would be awesome in itself but doesn't make me feel any better about the class as a whole.
 
7dimes said:
I actually think if Harry came we could be pretty good.
Could play a very big athletic, line up with decent size off the bench.
Crawford, Woods, Crab, Harry, Dinos.
If Manning improves our D that's a solid squad. Once Harry leaves we'll take a step back, but I don't think it's absurd to think that sliding Moore or Collins into that lineup means we're no longer competitive.
I agree that this year's recruiting is weak, but I like the parts he's put together thus far.
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Wouldn't necessarily have to take a step back if more success on the court and showing the willingness to develop a one and done talent will get us to close the deal with some stud(s) for 2017.
 
Turd Ferguson said:
Who is saying this? Everyone is pretty happy with the 2015 class and has said so. And I certainly don't think Manning is trying to grab 3 stars, but we have signed three for 2016.

And if you agree that it is easier to build a successful program by recruiting top 100 talent, then we agree there too. I'm not real caught up on the Giles thing. Don't get me wrong, it would be a huge boost to our program, but I'd be happy with a couple of years of classes like last year's. A couple of top 100 guys that were offered by other major programs that we can develop and build on. Signing Giles would be awesome in itself but doesn't make me feel any better about the class as a whole.
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Earlier comment about how we'd just be surrounding Giles with 3 stars on the court, would just be an average ACC team, that we shouldn't have high expectations based on signing a couple of low 4 stars, etc... Plus "the program is dead for the next decade" and all that nonsense.

I think we mostly agree - I'm just more optimistic about what we already have. I see us as a dangerous team next year even without Giles. Not top tier ACC but a potential NCAA bid, 2nd tier ACC team. And we'll lose almost nobody the year after that. But who knows. I'm cautiously optimistic based on what I've seen - I totally understand cautiously pessimistic.
 
deaclite said:
Tulsa won 23 games last year under Frank Haith and is expected to have another good season. So, it appears Manning left them in good shape. Not sure why we are so eager to fill our open slots so quickly this fall. We should have a competitive squad so let's overachieve and get some street cred. Plenty of grads out there we can attract and then swing for the fences in 2017.
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This is where I come down. The players we have signed appear to have potential but don't appear to be immediate flight risks, and we could increase our reputation with a good start to the season and hopefully (??) signing Giles.
 
PhDeac said:
I'm not sure how old you are, but I assume you've been watching Wake and ACC basketball at least 20-30 years. How many players can you name who started out like Crab and Wilbekin who became All-ACC level performers? "Diamonds" show their potential early. Dinos has diamond potential. The others don't.
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Muggsy Bogues
Trelonnie Owens
Tony Rutland
Craig Dawson
Jamaal Levy
Taron Downey
Vytas Danelius
Kyle Visser
 
devi8 said:
Muggsy Bogues
Trelonnie Owens
Tony Rutland
Craig Dawson
Jamaal Levy
Taron Downey
Vytas Danelius
Kyle Visser
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All showed more promise as freshmen than Crab and Wilbekin. Feel free to throw around Player A and Player B type comparisons, but those players definitely showed potential early on, especially the post-Duncan ones that I remember more clearly.
 
loyal2afault said:
Similar to Clawson's comments about football recruiting, Wake Forest basketball will also always be about player development..
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That's just not even close to being true. It's like people have forgotten how consistently good we were Odom-Dino. I'm tired of dragging up the stats to remind Wake fans that we were one of the top 25 programs in the nation for an extended period of time.

loyal2afault said:
Pragmatically, it is not a reasonable goal to go head-to-head with the Ratface's, Self's, and Used-Car-Salesman Calipari's of the worlds on a consistent basis and succeed in acquiring 3-4 top 50 talents year after year.
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Congrats on setting up a straw man and then beating the hell out of it. But I haven't seen anyone argue we need 3-4 top 50 recruits every year.

We recruited just fine Odom-Dino. We recruited talent that could play. Will we land the top 10, or even top 50 guys with the consistency of the premier programs? Of course not. But that's not a requirement to be an excellent team. There's simply no truth to the idea that Wake Forest needs to find hidden talent and develop it to compete in the ACC. History Pre-[name redacted] is proof of as much.
 
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Turd Ferguson said:
The only thing that addresses recruiting ability is recruiting Crawford and Moore which you say we shouldn't expect regularly. So is it an example of Manning's recruiting ability if it is not sustainable? I do agree with you that the 2015 class was a positive, I just think it is a reasonable expectation to repeat that success. None of the other things you mentioned are meaningful examples of recruiting success.

He did well at Tulsa, so that's fairly positive, but limited in what it says about success in the ACC. Playing in the NBA and knowing Self are not examples of good college coaching.
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I said we shouldn't expect it immediately. Again you are conflating reasonable expectations for our program with your expectations for Manning.

You are also equating demonstrated success with demonstrated potential. Playing in the NBA and working under a top recruiter is not a meaningful example of recruiting success. It is, however, relevant in evaluating Manning's potential as a recruiter. As are all of the other things I mentioned.
 
We will land Giles, win 20 games this year. Thats how i see this thing playing out.
 
CharlotteDeac1 said:
People watched John Collins' film and said he was only good because he was playing against smaller opponents and now they're saying he could be the steal of the recruiting class. Just saying, don't judge the kid until he gets on campus and shows us what he can do.
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It's nowhere near the same thing. John Collins played against smaller opponents and he's good. Plenty of folks were saying he would be a steal before the recent post, too. I believe - and OGB can fact check - that most of the criticism surrounding the fact that all he did was dunk.
 
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