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Better Call Saul, The Mafia Game. Indies Win! Gooner, GAT and Duff

Confirmed Civ:
Numbers – confirmed cop cleared on a night that couldn’t have had a compromised result

Lean Civ:
Gooner – has done more work this game to puzzle out the outcome than anyone. Key votes on both Dv7 and BYM which more or less eliminates him from both maf. If he’s anything its Maf1 b/c dv7 was just a goon vs BYM’s power role.


Townie – Consistently civ behavior throughout. If maf, he’s maf1. Early vote on dv7 may have gotten stuck there. Key vote on BYM so not maf2.


Duff – Claim seemed civ and the post-claim push about vote switches rings very civ. Lowest on my civ leans because of his D1 and D2 which I still can’t shake. Def not Maf 2 given BYM switch.



Neutral:
JTP – Seemed civ early on with the dv7 interaction but has been floating since


Ph – Seemed really off in the early game. Has been mixed after. Certainly trying hard but his posts. Likely not maf1 because of Dv7 vote. Vote on BYM was not clearing given the counts at the time.


Boston – People seem to think the vig hit seems potentially clearing but I still question it because I had doofus obviously clear there. Voted for bym and dv7 but both votes were early.



Lean Maf:
D14 – Terrible forced feeling overnight. Was here but contributed very little. He’s better and more insightful than that which continues his trend this game. I initially was giving him the benefit of the doubt because he claimed he’d be busy for work but he’s been around enough and he’s super-obvious analytical civ when he’s actually a civ.


Jman – Salamanca only. I’m admittedly stuck on the RB issue. This is potentially angle-shooty but a clear reason for not AA’ing the nilla claim when it was obviously AA-able would be that an AA had already happened on Maf2. BYM has voted for Jman consistently but they have been at relatively inconsequential times and the only time Jman was really up for lynch (D2), BYM was not on him – his vote was middle of nowhere.


Knight – Not much there and my spidey sense always tingles when someone is too complimentary of me.


Toogs – I had a hard civ lean but there’s no way around his end of D6 being pretty bad looking.


Tim – Not a lot here. Do not like that he went to Townie after the duff claim who I have strongly civ when shadier looking BYM was an option.
 
I am catching up and reading the posts last night about who could be which maf and what not and I had to go back and check out the claims because I just dont trust you guys:

Frings Maf:
DV7
Gouda-Banker- odd nights

Salamanca maf:
Nova
Mako
bym- RB/Framer- Odd nights/Even nights
Nova

Claimed actions:
Day 2 claims
D14-Bribe during n1- post 222
Juice investigated numbers n1- post 483
JTP- RB claim n- post 488

Day 3 claims:
Jman- vanilla- post 618
Juice- mako maf- post 670
Juice- claims found mason partner night 1- post 693
Mako- Admits Salamanca Maf, claims maf vig, claims even night hits- post 822

Day 4 claims:
Juice- SD3-civ, bribed n3- post 858
Gooner- Rb claim n3- post 861

Day 5 claims:
Juice- gouda maf- post 1627

Day 6 claims
Jman- rb n5- post 1682

When skimming back I think I understand why Jman was RBd on nigth 5. BYM didnt buy Jman's vanilla claim, he pushed to vote for him but it didnt get any traction on day 5. So night 5, that mafia RBd JMan.
 
Also i left out Tejas too.

Tejas im maf lean on. His voting record is basically: be nowhere near mafia.
 
I may be biased this game because there has been a lot of wrongness from civs. But his initial throw-up list from day 2 is at best like 30% correct at this point.

doesn’t that make me more civ? You should have been more worried if it was 70-100% correct
 
i don't think i'm going to vote for tejas. being exceptionally wrong all game is a fairly civ trait in my book.
 
Duff you forgot to mention I was given a gift. Don’t know how much more I can say
 
doesn’t that make me more civ? You should have been more worried if it was 70-100% correct

Well, 1 out of your 5 mafia leans were mafia and 1 is unconfirmed in gooner, the other 3 are dead civs. That does not make you more civ, no.
 
When skimming back I think I understand why Jman was RBd on nigth 5. BYM didnt buy Jman's vanilla claim, he pushed to vote for him but it didnt get any traction on day 5. So night 5, that mafia RBd JMan.

I mean, maybe. But N5 was the night Juice died, and I'd imagine that Bym's mafia would reasonably not want to RB the other mafia that night because they assumed Juice would be the hit. So that's where the idea of JMan as Bym's teammate comes in.

If I am wrong on which mafia hits which night disregard this, but I think that has been figured out based on mako's last post.
 
Confirmed Civ:
Numbers – confirmed cop cleared on a night that couldn’t have had a compromised result

Lean Civ:
Gooner – has done more work this game to puzzle out the outcome than anyone. Key votes on both Dv7 and BYM which more or less eliminates him from both maf. If he’s anything its Maf1 b/c dv7 was just a goon vs BYM’s power role.


Townie – Consistently civ behavior throughout. If maf, he’s maf1. Early vote on dv7 may have gotten stuck there. Key vote on BYM so not maf2.


Duff – Claim seemed civ and the post-claim push about vote switches rings very civ. Lowest on my civ leans because of his D1 and D2 which I still can’t shake. Def not Maf 2 given BYM switch.



Neutral:
JTP – Seemed civ early on with the dv7 interaction but has been floating since


Ph – Seemed really off in the early game. Has been mixed after. Certainly trying hard but his posts. Likely not maf1 because of Dv7 vote. Vote on BYM was not clearing given the counts at the time.


Boston – People seem to think the vig hit seems potentially clearing but I still question it because I had doofus obviously clear there. Voted for bym and dv7 but both votes were early.



Lean Maf:
D14 – Terrible forced feeling overnight. Was here but contributed very little. He’s better and more insightful than that which continues his trend this game. I initially was giving him the benefit of the doubt because he claimed he’d be busy for work but he’s been around enough and he’s super-obvious analytical civ when he’s actually a civ.


Jman – Salamanca only. I’m admittedly stuck on the RB issue. This is potentially angle-shooty but a clear reason for not AA’ing the nilla claim when it was obviously AA-able would be that an AA had already happened on Maf2. BYM has voted for Jman consistently but they have been at relatively inconsequential times and the only time Jman was really up for lynch (D2), BYM was not on him – his vote was middle of nowhere.


Knight – Not much there and my spidey sense always tingles when someone is too complimentary of me.


Toogs – I had a hard civ lean but there’s no way around his end of D6 being pretty bad looking.


Tim – Not a lot here. Do not like that he went to Townie after the duff claim who I have strongly civ when shadier looking BYM was an option.

I'm caught up with the game, your list is just like last time - you've got logic for your reads, but some of them are wrong conclusions.

First off, I agree with you on Numbers (clear), D14(mafia), Townie (civ) and Jman(mafia). For exactly the same reasons that you state. I also agree that JTP is floating, which isn't alignment determinant. However, Tim should be in this category as well, instead of a mafia lean.

However, your civ leans are wrong:
Gooner's logic is wrong because you use effort as the metric to distinguish him as a civ - Gooner puts 100% into every game he plays, regardless of alignment. It's his best quality. I agree that his voting record is strong, but he's a busser and I could absolutely see him bussing either one of bym and DV7. My read of Gooner is always tone, because that's where his game struggles, and I have him as off. I'm still a bit fency about when he should be run though.

Duff's logic is wrong because the way he claimed was soft as shit. He should be a mafia lean.

Tejas should be a civ lean. Dude started out weak, but has really poured on lately. The gift receipt is just not a mafia play.

DaDeacs is fucking unreadable, but I lean civ on him right now. He's present and putting in effort.
 
And I think some have said that Boston is civ for the vig. Im doutbting that after my skim through.

I admit I have seen Boston in a negative light for most of the game and backed off after his admission to the vig.

But Mako does say his maf has a vig (could be BS, i know).
The round where redwing and doofus are at the top redwing claimed full character, doofus didnt. Boston specifically asked who doofus was. I think the vig could have been special hunting by salamanca maf but no downside to what doofus was, could be special, frings maf or vanilla.

I do not give credit for Boston moving to bym last round. His move was after rommy AAd but before I claimed. Noone was on bym and there was no reason to believe he would be run up at that time. Being first to bym there isnt bold enough to push bym out but a great separator for down teh line. If Boston was 2nd or 3rd I'd buy that more.

Guess this is all to say I still believe boston is dirty.

***boston***
 
Well, 1 out of your 5 mafia leans were mafia and 1 is unconfirmed in gooner, the other 3 are dead civs. That does not make you more civ, no.

cool well next time I’m actually mafia I’ll make a list for you that is 100% correct
 
how da hell you have that man as a strong civ lean? What has he done?

His votes have been equally as bad as yours so that's not great.

But the mistakes he made about the nights of RBs and framing seemed like honest mistakes to me. When i pushed him on them he reacted well. I'm also going on tone here. He more or less activated the civ da tell last night.
 
I wanna kill Jman, Duff, and Gooner.

***Duff***

I will vote for Jman, Duff, D14, or Ph this round. After reading more, I'm not ready to lynch Gooner.

I'm on Duff because I do not like his claim and I don't like how the day he claimed played out.
 
I will vote for Jman, Duff, D14, or Ph this round. After reading more, I'm not ready to lynch Gooner.

I'm on Duff because I do not like his claim and I don't like how the day he claimed played out.

I dont know what more I can say about my claim, but as someone mentioned, I probably cant be alive by the end game so Im fine dying whenever. I dont think it should be now, but do what you think is best.
 
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