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Buzz blamed players back to 2004

Bz was done in Denver when management backed the multi-million dollar player over the head coach. It's that simple. And he was quite shocked and hurt by that situation. One could argue that he should have seen it coming, but apparently he didnt.
 
Anybody who has done so much as watched an NBA game knows that management will back a multi-million dollar player over all but a few elite head coaches. If he was shocked and hurt by that, he's an idiot.
 
PhDeac said:
Anybody who has done so much as watched an NBA game knows that management will back a multi-million dollar player over all but a few elite head coaches. If he was shocked and hurt by that, he's an idiot.
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I guess you just used a bazooka to kill a fly, but that was the point I was making ... plus it's just a little bit sad if you have any compassion for someone just might be that naive.
 
If RJ's explanation of why Buzz was fired in Denver is correct, and I have no reason to disagree, nor have I seen anyone persuasively contradicting RJ's version, then Buzz was fired not for his coaching on the court, in which he seems to have been old-fashioned enough to emphasize teamwork and togetherness, but due to questionable management decisions with which he disagreed because they were incompatible with what he was trying to achieve on the court.

Thanks for every one's contributions to this thread. It has been most enlightening.
 
Bzzouters don't need hyperbole. They can point to our 200+ ranking in kenpom, the fact that we are behind BC in the standings, 3 top 100 wins in 2 seasons, 5 straight double digit losses, etc., etc., etc.

They don't need to make statements like "Not even John Wooden could win 15 games with this lineup!!!1111111111!!!!"
 
Guess what? Last year a live John Wooden couldn't have won fifteen games with that squad.
 
sailordeac said:
If RJ's explanation of why Buzz was fired in Denver is correct, and I have no reason to disagree, nor have I seen anyone persuasively contradicting RJ's version, then Buzz was fired not for his coaching on the court, in which he seems to have been old-fashioned enough to emphasize teamwork and togetherness, but due to questionable management decisions with which he disagreed because they were incompatible with what he was trying to achieve on the court.

Thanks for every one's contributions to this thread. It has been most enlightening.
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The Nuggets had a chance to upgrade and they did. There's a reason why George Karl is an NBA mainstay and Bz hasn't been back to the NBA since.

The Google machine has a good bit of commentary about Bz' time with the Nugs. Google "kiki" and "[Redacted]" to see what folks were saying at the time. Basically if you read the lines, it matches what RJ and Bone said. If you read between the lines, it matches what I'm saying.
 
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Seriously, if you were the Nuggets GM, and you had a chance at George Karl with an exciting new team with a budding superstar, or Bzzzz (who sounds like a boring accountant who says Uhhhhh way too much when he is interviewed), who would you want to be the face of your organization with the best chance to get FAs and such.

And I am not bashing Bzzzz because I sound like a boring accountant who is a bad public speaker, but I am also not an NBA or ACC head coach making 7 figures either.
 
RJKarl said:
This year's team does play much harder than last year's team. If you don't see that it's because you don't to see it.

If you understand the NBA, the part that spoke about not getting an extrension is a red flag. You'd understand the as soon as that happens players tune out the coach and his days are immediately numbered.

In essence, Kiki fired [Redacted] that day. He should have just doen it thne and not wasted the first 40% of the season.

As to his players not being in shape or gving enough effort, Phil Jackson used to say that after wins sometimes. Every coach in the NBA says that. It's a cliche.
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At times they played harder. At other times they don't.

We have improved marginally since last season.
 
We are scoring as much as we did last year while making 20% fewer TOs and are allowing fewer points.

With some depth and a banger, we woudl have probably won several more games this year.
 
We have skyrocketed from 251 in kenpom to 203 (and falling, let's see where we end up).
 
BabyDeac75 said:
Bz was done in Denver when management backed the multi-million dollar player over the head coach. It's that simple. And he was quite shocked and hurt by that situation. One could argue that he should have seen it coming, but apparently he didnt.
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Maybe Buzz was able to exercise those demons by showing those big ego Wake players who was boss; and all under the pretext of "restoring" discipline and building a "culture"...
 
So, if we read the analysis of Bz's firing by Denver, then the conclusion is that Buzz was let go because the GM and the owner wanted a sexier coach. Hmm, where have I seen something like this? Did it work for Denver? Not particularly.
 
RJKarl said:
... With some depth and a banger, we woudl have probably won several more games this year.
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The only thing that would have been necessary to win "several more games" this year and last is better leadership.
 
sailordeac said:
So, if we read the analysis of Bz's firing by Denver, then the conclusion is that Buzz was let go because the GM and the owner wanted a sexier coach. Hmm, where have I seen something like this? Did it work for Denver? Not particularly.
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How do you figure?


And simply calling George Karl "sexier" is not telling the full story. Karl was more experienced and more accomplished than [Redacted]. Not to mention, Karl is still the coach of the Nuggets and they've made the playoffs every year since. The Mavs and Spurs are the only other teams to make the playoffs every year of that stretch. Karl took over for [Redacted] who had lost 14 of their last 20 games and were under .500. Karl went 32-8 with the same Nuggets team [Redacted] coached to a 13-15 record.
 
Made the West finals one year. Denver's main problem has been the stacked west. 50-32 gets you a 1st round date with the Lakers or Spurs.
 
Yep. I'd really like to see sailordeac explain how the coaching change didn't work. The Nuggets were a complete laughing stock in the 90s and until Melo except for upsetting the Sonics as an 8 seed. They executed a great plan.

1. Tank for the loaded 2003 draft by putting together a crap roster and hiring a crap coach.
2. Draft the best player available (thanks Joe D).
3. Fire the crap coach and hire the best coach available.
4. Playoffs ever since.
 
PhDeac said:
How do you figure?


And simply calling George Karl "sexier" is not telling the full story. Karl was more experienced and more accomplished than [Redacted]. Not to mention, Karl is still the coach of the Nuggets and they've made the playoffs every year since. The Mavs and Spurs are the only other teams to make the playoffs every year of that stretch. Karl took over for [Redacted] who had lost 14 of their last 20 games and were under .500. Karl went 32-8 with the same Nuggets team [Redacted] coached to a 13-15 record.
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Under Karl, Denver has just stagnated as an above average team, the level to which Bz brought them from nothing. At least Buzz rebuilt the team. Karl has not particularly improved them. Buzz gets credit for improving them, while Karl gets credit for not ruining them. Take your pick.

I thought those stories you referred to made it clear that Buzz was deliberately undercut by management, and that's why Denver played so inconsistently when he was let go. Do you want to blame Buzz for being undercut by management?
 
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