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First Charges Filed in Mueller Investigation

RChildress107 said:
Both of those are already public knowledge. The only question is: how rock solid is the proof Mueller and other investigators have collected?

Dems should wait at least until Mueller produces his report to impeach, but would be fools not to after that, both from a political and national security perspective.

I am somewhat hopeful that presenting all of the information neatly outlined in one document , and not having a bunch of people lying to defend the president, might be enough to change some senators minds.
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LOL
 
RChildress107 said:
Both of those are already public knowledge. The only question is: how rock solid is the proof Mueller and other investigators have collected?

Dems should wait at least until Mueller produces his report to impeach, but would be fools not to after that, both from a political and national security perspective.

I am somewhat hopeful that presenting all of the information neatly outlined in one document , and not having a bunch of people lying to defend the president, might be enough to change some senators minds.
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The only senators who's minds you could change are the ones retiring and not running for Office in 2018. The Senate will be more partisan this fall because the most "reasonable" republicans have been run out of the party.
 
birdman said:
The only senators who's minds you could change are the ones retiring and not running for Office in 2018. The Senate will be more partisan this fall because the most "reasonable" republicans have been run out of the party.
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Good point. It’s more the case for the House since all of them will be elected post Trump.
 
DeaconSig said:
LOL
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Exactly. What may change some Pub senators' minds is a blue wave this Fall, a bad 2020 forecast, a bunch of Mueller convictions, lower approval ratings and an economic downturn. Little short of that.

Numbers, we're talking districts that are mostly lily white exurbs that mostly vote red, weren't overly happy with the ACA and who hate Nancy Pelosi. The only time in the last 20 years that VA-2 went blue was for 2 years in the 2008 blue wave. VA-7 hasn't gone blue since Nixon, and VA-10 hasn't gone blue since Carter. Some of the toss-up districts in other states are really more swing districts, but some of this year's toss-ups are like these 3 in VA that are truly light red disctricts that we're trying to win over. You don't win them over and hold them with left wing candidates and talk of impeachment. You win and hold them by not engaging in the culture wars on either side and stabilizing the ACA and lowering premiums.
 
PhDeac said:
Good point. It’s more the case for the House since all of them will be elected post Trump.
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One thing Trump won't tell you (probably because he doesn't understand it) is that his skyrocketing approval rating among Republicans is due in part to people no longer identifying as Republican-lower the denominator, increase the approval percentage. This seems like a problem that a mainstream Republican should be concerned about. (Of course, part of the rise is also the taX bill, which was a fairly mainstream Republican piece of policy).
 
cville deac said:
Exactly. What may change some Pub senators' minds is a blue wave this Fall, a bad 2020 forecast, a bunch of Mueller convictions, lower approval ratings and an economic downturn. Little short of that.

Numbers, we're talking districts that are mostly lily white exurbs that mostly vote red, weren't overly happy with the ACA and who hate Nancy Pelosi. The only time in the last 20 years that VA-2 went blue was for 2 years in the 2008 blue wave. VA-7 hasn't gone blue since Nixon, and VA-10 hasn't gone blue since Carter. Some of the toss-up districts in other states are really more swing districts, but some of this year's toss-ups are like these 3 in VA that are truly light red disctricts that we're trying to win over. You don't win them over and hold them with left wing candidates and talk of impeachment. You win and hold them by not engaging in the culture wars on either side and stabilizing the ACA and lowering premiums.
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Sounds to me like the Republicans have comfortably held those districts while engaging in culture wars and it hasn't made any difference.
 
deactherunner said:
One thing Trump won't tell you (probably because he doesn't understand it) is that his skyrocketing approval rating among Republicans is due in part to people no longer identifying as Republican-lower the denominator, increase the approval percentage. This seems like a problem that a mainstream Republican should be concerned about. (Of course, part of the rise is also the taX bill, which was a fairly mainstream Republican piece of policy).
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That's part of the story. Anti-Trump Republicans are leaving the party. Also most of them are being replaced by pro-Trump independents. That leaves fewer people for Trump outside the GOP.

Last week's polling split was 87/34/8/40 R/I/D/Total. W had 87% approval among Republicans in Summer 2001, before 9/11. That split was 87/45/27/52. Obama had 87% approval among Democrats in Summer 2009. That split was 20/47/87/54.

Point being in the past, a President with such high approval within his party was probably above water with Independents and had some support in the other party. That's far from the case with Trump.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/203198/presidential-approval-ratings-donald-trump.aspx
 
Wakeforest22890 said:
Sounds to me like the Republicans have comfortably held those districts while engaging in culture wars and it hasn't made any difference.
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Yes, for the most part. But then Trump won the electoral college, Nazis and Klansmen marched in Cville, the ACA wasn't repealed and replaced, and Trump is sabotaging the ACA, sending health coverage costs in VA skyrocketing. These lily white, college educated folks in these 3 districts aren't happy with these developments. And in VA 7&10, the Dems are running a retired CIA worker and a lawyer who had spent some time as a prosecutor. VA-10 is already in the Dem lean category, whereas VA-2&7 are in the toss-up category.

The other thing that happened a couple of years ago in VA is that VA-3 was ruled too gerrymandered by the courts - it wasn't even contiguous in parts and was very black and very Dem. I'm not sure if VA-2 exchanged areas with VA-3. It was mostly VA-4 that exchanged areas, which made VA-4 more bluish purple and changed that district from red to blue. Before that, VA had 8 Pub districts and 3 Dem districts, which was awfully 1 sided for such a purple state. Now it's 7-4 Pub and will probably end up 6-5 one way or the other, which will better reflect the purplish nature of the state, er commonwealth. It's also worth noting that Trump barely won the Pub primary over Rubio in 2016, so outside the Shenandoah Valley, SW VA and the rural southside, this is not a good state for Trump - he isn't overly popular in the well educated white suburbs and exurbs.
 
If/when Manafort is convicted, Trump actually would have an easy out, "Manafort did it. I didn't know anything about any of his actions with the Russians."
 
So team Meuller is interviewing the Manhattan Madam?
 
sailordeac said:
the old leftist privilege: the left is exempt from the rules:

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2018...mp-from-russian-officials-wheres-outrage.html

the Trump-Russia collusion story is a cover-up for and distraction from Clinton illegality and sleaze and Obama's corruption of the FBI, DoJ, DoS, and CIA
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Good grief, anyone writes some BS conspiracy opinion piece with no facts and you just slurp it up. Wake the fuck up and stop posting until there is more than some republican wet dream.
 
deactherunner said:
One thing Trump won't tell you (probably because he doesn't understand it) is that his skyrocketing approval rating among Republicans is due in part to people no longer identifying as Republican-lower the denominator, increase the approval percentage. This seems like a problem that a mainstream Republican should be concerned about. (Of course, part of the rise is also the taX bill, which was a fairly mainstream Republican piece of policy).
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Nice point, hadn't thought of this
 
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