Football Prognostications...

[DeaconSig]

Uh, what do you think "it was a lucky class, it's that simple" means?

So many people talking out of both sides of their mouths here. 5 wins is the floor but you're not arguing for the coach to be fired. Same record last year as we had two years before our ACC championship and greatest run in Wake football history but Grobe is on the "hot seat." It's all just bullshit.

If we don't hit our "floor" of 5 wins next year and we fired Grobe, we'd be the laughing stock of the country for a few days, then fade into obscurity as 5 wins became our new ceiling.

You are doing a hell of a job beating up the strawman. Feel free to continue.

 

[Milhouse]

lol

lots of OUTRAGE!!!!!!1111111 in that post

 

[Tin Cup]

I hope not. But judging from these boards, there would be a lot of angry fans if Grobe is on the hot seat as you suggest.

He's not on the hot seat, but the staff knows they need to perform better.

 

[DeaconSig]

I wish Lectro could quit it with his "schtick" and talk about football like a normal person, because all of his good information gets buried underneath his craziness.

Well put. I actually have zero problem with lectro's football posts, whether they be made with black and gold colored glasses or not. The fly-off-the-handle at folks who have a different opinion bothers me, but that's life.

The folks that antagonize people like him (or RJ, for that matter) seem to want to have something to get offended by at all times.

 

[DCDeac]

You are doing a hell of a job beating up the strawman. Feel free to continue.

How is it a straw man when I'm quoting what people posted? God forbid someone cut through all the rhetoric. Either you think Grobe should be fired, you think he's on the hot seat - ie should be fired if we're not good next year (good meaning 5 win absolute minimum apparently) or you think Grobe is a great coach who has a lot of work to do to get this team where it needs to be.

You would think that it's somehow mutually exclusive to both believe that Jim Grobe has earned a long leash as our head coach and to be extremely disappointed by last year's results.

Great coaches have bad years. In a decade as our coach that's Grobe's first 3 win season. In the decade before he got here we managed it 7 times. But yeah, let's give him a # of wins litmus test or kick him out next year. That's a nice approach.

 

[ChrisL68]

Why is it so hard to understand that Grobe, being the most successful coach in school history, has a very long leash, but that there would come a point that if on the field performance remained poor that he would be on the hot seat?

 

[PhDeac]

How is it a straw man when I'm quoting what people posted? God forbid someone cut through all the rhetoric. Either you think Grobe should be fired, you think he's on the hot seat - ie should be fired if we're not good next year (good meaning 5 win absolute minimum apparently) or you think Grobe is a great coach who has a lot of work to do to get this team where it needs to be.

You would think that it's somehow mutually exclusive to both believe that Jim Grobe has earned a long leash as our head coach and to be extremely disappointed by last year's results.

Great coaches have bad years. In a decade as our coach that's Grobe's first 3 win season. In the decade before he got here we managed it 7 times. But yeah, let's give him a # of wins litmus test or kick him out next year. That's a nice approach.

Who said Grobe should be fired next year?

Good post CL. It's pretty simple.

 

[myDeaconmyhand]

No one has said Grobe should be fired after another bad season. This convo started when someone said they would be fine with allowing Grobe a decade of blowout, losing seasons.

It's like I said earlier, Grobe raised the bar himself. He has to live up to the expectations that he created. No one has said he should be fired now, or after a another losing season. There have been many good posts about why there should be a floor of expectations, but none arguing why there shouldn't, besides a weak correlation between a previous 3 win season and our ACC Championship season, as if we had to have that season in order to win later.

 

[DeaconSig]

How is it a straw man when I'm quoting what people posted? God forbid someone cut through all the rhetoric. Either you think Grobe should be fired, you think he's on the hot seat - ie should be fired if we're not good next year (good meaning 5 win absolute minimum apparently) or you think Grobe is a great coach who has a lot of work to do to get this team where it needs to be.

You would think that it's somehow mutually exclusive to both believe that Jim Grobe has earned a long leash as our head coach and to be extremely disappointed by last year's results.

Great coaches have bad years. In a decade as our coach that's Grobe's first 3 win season. In the decade before he got here we managed it 7 times. But yeah, let's give him a # of wins litmus test or kick him out next year. That's a nice approach.

Read posts. It would help clarify what people are arguing. I said pretty clearly that if Wake is not competitive this year, they would have to be next year or else Coach Grobe should leave. Three seasons of failing to compete against the majority of your schedule is not acceptable after being at a school a decade. But that is significantly different than saying that if he doesn't win X games, he should be fired.

But let's look at it a different way. If every team out there, including Gardner-Webb, beats us by 30+, should that have no impact on Coach Grobe's job security?

I think with the way Wake's schedule is currently constructed, expecting 5-6 wins per season is reasonable. That is an average, so of course there will be better years and worse years to reach that average. Along with that, it needs to be a rare year that Wake gets run (completely outclassed on the field) more than twice in a year. As Ph said before, the minimum I expect from a Coach Grobe team is to come out and play hard, smart, competitive football. If the ball bounces the wrong way once or twice and we get run 45-14, ok. But that can't be the norm. And last year, it basically was.

If we win 4-5 games this year and are competitive in 6 of the 7 or 8 losses, I think Coach Grobe has us on the right track. If he doesn't, 2012 will be a critical year.

 

[deacdiggler]

another lectro pissing match. awesome.

 

[Lectro]

Well put. I actually have zero problem with lectro's football posts, whether they be made with black and gold colored glasses or not. The fly-off-the-handle at folks who have a different opinion bothers me, but that's life.

The folks that antagonize people like him (or RJ, for that matter) seem to want to have something to get offended by at all times.

Hey look for the umpteenth thousandth -- I don't give a Shit.

Please don't do anything rash like befriending me.

I don't fly off the handle at others who don't agree... I post my opinions, they are attacked, and, as always since the motherfucker has been out here on the web, Ol' Lec reaches back for his GD canon and let's lesser mortals have it. Peace maker style.

 

[Lectro]

Why is it so hard to understand that Grobe, being the most successful coach in school history, has a very long leash, but that there would come a point that if on the field performance remained poor that he would be on the hot seat?

Because it is entirely unneccessary?

 

[myDeaconmyhand]

Because it is entirely unneccessary?

He asked you "What's so hard to understand....?", and you answered "because it's unnecessary". What is unnecessary? If you're going to be such a damned contrarian, at least answer questions correctly, so we can know what the hell you're disagreeing with.

 

[1976Deac]

Lectro, I am interested in your opinion of what we can reasonably expect this season from our offensive line. I think if they can improve meaningfully this year, much of what you say is possible. If not, I am afraid your optimism may not be justified.

 

[Milhouse]

fuggin fuggin fuggin

 

[Lectro]

Lectro, I am interested in your opinion of what we can reasonably expect this season from our offensive line. I think if they can improve meaningfully this year, much of what you say is possible. If not, I am afraid your optimism may not be justified.

I think it starts with Joe Looney. We can probably agree that an OL in college does his best work as a rising Jr and most often that guy is a redshirt Jr. Agreed?
Ok, Looney is a true Sr and a real leader on the team. He has NFL bloodlines and was Off MVP of a prestigious H.S. All Star Game. So, he has a pedigree. Big deal. Now then the guy gets to WF and because of the dearth of size and talent on the OL he is thrust into action. He quickly establishes himself as a solid college offensive linemen and generates his share of talk among scouts who monitor young NFL type talent. Now, three years and 28 starting assignments later Looney heads into his true senior season (essentially where a large number of peers are Rs Jrs). He had a strong spring and his habits have been ramped up as he prepares for his Sr year and possible Draft day. He has added 15 lbs of mass and is one of the staunchest S&C guys onthe squad. Finally, Joe has the ideal mentality of an OL. He is cerebral yet still very aggressive on the field. At 6'3 and 325 I believe Joe is set to compete for one of the top G spots in the ACC.

So, I'd start with Looney.

Then move to the career-turnaround story of local Sanford Samaritan Dennis Godfrey (featured in Sporting News College Football) -- now aside from growing past some adolescent miscues and lauding the staff for standing by him we have seen a slow and painful growth for Dennis the football player...it is as if the catharsis off the field was a mirror for the hard growth road on the gridiron. He has played through some bumps and bruises and questions about his resiliency have faded from view and instead the staff has spoken of his strides as a player and refer to him as a stalwart. Dennis, along with Joe L, is looking for a shot on Sunday. He is not without his own pedigree as a former 3 Star N.C. Shrine standout TE -- a player with strong offers from nearly every regional player (Clem NCSU unc VT etc.,). Although only 6'3 and 270 as a TE Dennis was once hailed by Dean Hood as "the finest jumbo athlete I've seen." He is currently on many an NFL watch list and checks in at a svelte 6'3 and 345. Jk

I have to continue later and will fill in 'my side' of the OL story.

iPhone typing is tiresome.

 

[myDeaconmyhand]

Now we're rolling. Good shit Lectro.

 

[Lectro]

Continuing OL discussion...

After Looney and Godfrey I'd add Doug Weaver a Redshirt Sr with 14 starts under his belt. Doug's pedigree was N.C Top 20 and # 2 ranked OL -- was offered by most regional players and came down to unc,NCSU and WF.Again,big deal. As it turned out Weaver became a serviceable T as a rs Frosh and was derailed a bit by injuries as a soph. He bounced back to start all 12 games. He was solid but still lacked that extra bit of strength. It seems that he has gotten past a plateau weight wise and has been able to add 25 pounds from last season. He heads into his 5th season with his own aspirations and somewhere on draft day or after there may be a place for a 6'8-330 pound T who has solid feet and improving upper body strength to jab DL.

That said, I feel this season should be Doug's best yet as a Deac.

Will continue analysis later...

 

[Lectro]

I should interject before continuing on about the OL by saying it is more "fun" for these guys to block when the backs really hit the hole. These guys will have more triumphs at the point of attack knowing they have someone following the play and running full-out to where the hole is drawn. There is a greater trust between Harris, Campanaro,Pendergrass,Knott and Bohanon than I have seen in the last several years... .(that is a "Spring" analysis of the run game so it is cautiously optimistic, eh?). Nevertheless...there appears to be more cohesion developing between this stable of horses and the Hogs out in front.

 

[Lectro]

Moving along with the OL argument --

The initial phase of Grobe's program would have the Rs Sr with a history of starts as opposed to putting in a young upstart. The program has evolved to the point where young guys can insert themselves ahead of the more veteran player. That point may have come for Michael Hoag. Hoag has been a decent player thus far but has somehow eluded questions of squandered time. He is a talented guy but he is in the Louis Frazier mold (and there is nothing wrong with that!) -- But, for gridiron purposes, the 6'4-335 pound mauler Colin Summers appears ready to sieze the moment. Colin is a very physical and energetic player who can,sometimes, play too long after the whistle. You can rest assured that throughout his career Deacons will become accustomed to "skirmishes" while on the field. A Big happy guy off the field it should be noted. I look forward to seeing Colin take the starting nod and in my uneducated opinion would see Mike Hoag accept a utility position (much like Blake Lingruen did for 3/4 of his career). He could handle 3 positions as a key veteran backup.

Continuing on with the Rookie (RS Frosh) Class of OL and my rank speculations...let me say that I'd also shift Garrick Williams to a utility role and would contine grooming Whit Barnes (6'4-293 / Rs Soph) as a...backup.

Who would be the Center!?

I'd make that kid from Pahokee a Center. Antonio Ford has a tremendous power base... Big skull-crackin noggin --- I love those kids where they have to order a special helmet This guy may not have Center skills and may never have had training but coming off the bus he sure looks like an All-Pro Center.

Back to reality... he's progressing very well and,like all our young guys, has taken to college S&C with gusto...he is up to 6'3 and 325.

More OL talk to come...