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Joseph Kony

You're in Africa so I definitely defer to your opinion on this, I would definitely be interested in hearing more about why it's not working.
 
IamThunderbolt said:
I don't' think it's necessarily a bad things at all - just an incomplete solution. I own products from all of the companies I mentioned. I own multiple pairs of TOMS and am working with them this summer to help some folks who really need shoes. My critique is not completely of the companies, they are doing good. I don't look down on folks that buy these things (b/c as I've said - my closet is full of this stuff). It's a great first step - and much better than not doing anything, but it also isn't really enough - and doesn't really affect a lot of change. There is also a unintended consequence that we should guard against. We (and I include myself in this because I care way more than I should what others think about me) as a culture tend to purchase things based on what image we want to project and if we aren't careful, our "activism" is just a fad. What happens when the fad shifts? Hopefully of the masses that are told about these issues through products/media blitzes, etc. 5% will find a passion for a people they didn't know before. While 95% may move on to the next thing, those 5% can do incredible things - like Invisible Children, Blood:Water Mission, Heart for Africa, Change for Change, etc.
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Great post, totally agree with you here. And like I said, the bottom line is creating solutions that are sustainable in those countries so you aren't just putting in a water source, or giving people shoes, but helping to develop those areas so they will have water long after people from the west leave or they will have the ability to create a better life for their families long after aid goes away.
 
GreenDeac said:
You're in Africa so I definitely defer to your opinion on this, I would definitely be interested in hearing more about why it's not working.
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It really depends on which situation you're talking about.

Sometimes our perception of the need is not the true need.

Sometimes inserting money into the problem just exacerbates the corruption and problems, sometimes it gets diverted to the wrong thing.

Sometimes all our good intentions creates cycles of dependence and situations that aren't' sustainable.

A lot of it comes down to how we view the problems. in the West, we have a very materialistic outlook on life and especially poverty. We think the problem is simply a lack of resources, so we give (a good thing). But for many places - dignity, sustainability, and the way out of poverty don't come just from mere resources. You have to invest in the culture and let them follow a culturally relevant path out of poverty (rather than imposing western standards/structure as the solution). The good organizations are micro finance lenders, organizations like Light Gives heat, where the products are produced by the people who in turn receive skill training from indigenous leaders - where the goal is sustainability.
 
IamThunderbolt said:
It really depends on which situation you're talking about.

Sometimes our perception of the need is not the true need.

Sometimes inserting money into the problem just exacerbates the corruption and problems, sometimes it gets diverted to the wrong thing.

Sometimes all our good intentions creates cycles of dependence and situations that aren't' sustainable.

A lot of it comes down to how we view the problems. in the West, we have a very materialistic outlook on life and especially poverty. We think the problem is simply a lack of resources, so we give (a good thing). But for many places - dignity, sustainability, and the way out of poverty don't come just from mere resources. You have to invest in the culture and let them follow a culturally relevant path out of poverty (rather than imposing western standards/structure as the solution). The good organizations are micro finance lenders, organizations like Light Gives heat, where the products are produced by the people who in turn receive skill training from indigenous leaders - where the goal is sustainability.
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Thanks
 
IamThunderbolt said:
It really depends on which situation you're talking about.

Sometimes our perception of the need is not the true need.

Sometimes inserting money into the problem just exacerbates the corruption and problems, sometimes it gets diverted to the wrong thing.

Sometimes all our good intentions creates cycles of dependence and situations that aren't' sustainable.

A lot of it comes down to how we view the problems. in the West, we have a very materialistic outlook on life and especially poverty. We think the problem is simply a lack of resources, so we give (a good thing). But for many places - dignity, sustainability, and the way out of poverty don't come just from mere resources. You have to invest in the culture and let them follow a culturally relevant path out of poverty (rather than imposing western standards/structure as the solution). The good organizations are micro finance lenders, organizations like Light Gives heat, where the products are produced by the people who in turn receive skill training from indigenous leaders - where the goal is sustainability.
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This is about what I would have posted, and the bolded section is where I find the most trouble in Africa. Yes a pair of shoes helps, but what happens when the pair of shoes falls apart or gets stolen and the child/family come back to the ex-pat asking for more shoes?

Dependency is a huge problem, which is why self sustainability is soo key
 
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I am a naturally skeptical person, but when I was watching that I really got the vibe that it was self serving and heavy handed with a lot of its claims in many instances.

The world is full of awful people and awful problems, but its really hard to get hyped up about a badguy who MIGHT still be in Uganda or the Congo or some unnamed jungle in between, when we still have starving people and 11% unemployment in places like Detroit.
 
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IamThunderbolt said:
I don't' think it's necessarily a bad things at all - just an incomplete solution.
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They can be bad things when:

-They provide things that aren't needed and become a burden

-They fail to expose the reality of the problems they claim to help

-They tie economic development to increased consumerism by the world's wealthy


People like you are in the minority with regard to looking to beyond the marketing campaign to understand the root problems. Products like TOMS seem to reinforce bad understanding of the problems and promote the idea that buying more things is how to fix the issue.
 
seventwofour said:
They can be bad things when:

-They provide things that aren't needed and become a burden

-They fail to expose the reality of the problems they claim to help

-They tie economic development to increased consumerism by the world's wealthy


People like you are in the minority with regard to looking to beyond the marketing campaign to understand the root problems. Products like TOMS seem to reinforce bad understanding of the problems and promote the idea that buying more things is how to fix the issue.
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Yeah, we've talked about this before on here and privately, and we agree for the most part, especially that materialism/consumerism is not the answer to poverty.
 
i actually worked for a summer with this girl's roommate:

http://www.christianitytoday.com/iyf/truelifestories/ithappenedtome/7.38.html?start=1

the stories she told were just so far outside of my realm of understanding. i just don't understand how somebody can do the kinds of things this man has done.

i understand why people may have a problem with invisible children as an organization. but if you ignore your issues with them, is there a reason why raising awareness about the terrible things happening is wrong?

eta: i just realized that my first line was unclear. this girl was in college around the same time i was (i first met her roommate in the summer of 2006). it was her roommate here in the US.
 
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DeacHoops said:
i actually worked for a summer with this girl's roommate:

http://www.christianitytoday.com/iyf/truelifestories/ithappenedtome/7.38.html?start=1

the stories she told were just so far outside of my realm of understanding. i just don't understand how somebody can do the kinds of things this man has done.

i understand why people may have a problem with invisible children as an organization. but if you ignore your issues with them, is there a reason why raising awareness about the terrible things happening is wrong?

eta: i just realized that my first line was unclear. this girl was in college around the same time i was (i first met her roommate in the summer of 2006). it was her roommate here in the US.
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There's nothing wrong with raising awareness. The problem is when organizations like IC only spend 31 cents of each dollar given on charitable activities. Theres a limited amount of money out there, and it should go to groups that aren't spending millions of dollars on personal travel.
 
DistrictDeacon said:
There's nothing wrong with raising awareness. The problem is when organizations like IC only spend 31 cents of each dollar given on charitable activities. Theres a limited amount of money out there, and it should go to groups that aren't spending millions of dollars on personal travel.
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i'm not advocating support invisible children (the organization, not the children themselves). i guess my post was mostly in response to TAB whose response seemed to indicate that we just shouldn't care at all what is happening because we have problems here (i'm not diminishing our problems here, but if you can't see why it's advantageous to raise awareness about a guy like Kony, then i don't know what to tell you).
 
DistrictDeacon said:
There's nothing wrong with raising awareness. The problem is when organizations like IC only spend 31 cents of each dollar given on charitable activities. Theres a limited amount of money out there, and it should go to groups that aren't spending millions of dollars on personal travel.
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DeacHoops said:
i'm not advocating support invisible children (the organization, not the children themselves). i guess my post was mostly in response to TAB whose response seemed to indicate that we just shouldn't care at all what is happening because we have problems here (i'm not diminishing our problems here, but if you can't see why it's advantageous to raise awareness about a guy like Kony, then i don't know what to tell you).
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Although my point was akin to DD's. The world has a million problems, and we can't solve all of them. Not saying we should ignore the kids in Africa, but as there is only so much money and time, and much of the aid we give never makes it to the intended recipeints over there. Lots of people in need here on the homefront who's lives can be more directly and immediately effected by volunteering or donations.

The solution to ICs problem is even more ambiguous since they are essentially asking for military force to hunt this guy down.

They might as well just ask Ruckerberg for $1MM to sic Blackwater on this dude.
 
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I wonder how much of that $700,000 was spent on that youtube video.
 
TWDeac said:
I wonder how much of that $700,000 was spent on that youtube video.
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It's a brilliant system. Convince people to donate money to get rid of a child-enslaver. Then take most of that money and spend it on producing videos and traveling the country to convince more people to donate more money. All while collecting a nice salary - also paid for by donated money.
 
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