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Law School is a sham

I mean even the shittiest DO school is way better than a Charlotte School of Law
 
Hospitals may be non profit but these schools are for profit. They enter into contracts to train their students at random hospitals in their area which are usually not top notch places. For example, students come to the hospital I work at and do part of their general surgery rotation. This is a 100 bed hospital that sees simple bread and butter stuff. Anything more exotic travels. There is no way to get good training at a tiny hospital. Experience provides wisdom and lack of pt encounters of adequate complexity causes bad training.
I'm not familiar with income contingent plan. Can you elaborate?
 
I wasn't necessarily comparing the Charlotte school of Law to the DO schools. Just answering Ph's inquiry and also showing that examples of this sort of exploitation of student loans is happening in other fields as well. IMHO it produces an inferior product and saddle the student with HUGE debt that is a big burden to repay. These schools overcome the high cost of training medical students (hospitals, equipment, etc) but paying local hospitals to train the students. Do you think a private practice general surgeon will teach a student as well as an academic general surgeon at a large hospital? Generally not. The PP guy is generally busier and not as into teaching, which is why he isn't at an academic hospital
 
I appreciate it, BacktoBack. Thanks.
 
Forgot the exact calculation but its 20% of disposable? income. Factors in family size and state etc. After 10 years of payments in a public service job (gov or nonprof) or 20 years of payments period the loans are forgiven. If you are single and make 60k your payment is about $800 a month
 
BacktoBack said:
I wasn't necessarily comparing the Charlotte school of Law to the DO schools. Just answering Ph's inquiry and also showing that examples of this sort of exploitation of student loans is happening in other fields as well. IMHO it produces an inferior product and saddle the student with HUGE debt that is a big burden to repay. These schools overcome the high cost of training medical students (hospitals, equipment, etc) but paying local hospitals to train the students. Do you think a private practice general surgeon will teach a student as well as an academic general surgeon at a large hospital? Generally not. The PP guy is generally busier and not as into teaching, which is why he isn't at an academic hospital
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Pretty much agree with everything BacktoBack has posted on this thread. A lot of the newer DO schools are shady/suspect, but there are a couple that are fairly well thought of. Though it's much harder these days, there are some big names in most fields with a DO.

One thing to keep in mind is the DO grads will definitely be able to get a job (unlike the Charlottle law kids). Most of them will end up in residencies in lower paying specialties in less desirable areas, true, but they will have a job.

The model of employing local private practice guys to help out with med student training is becoming more and more common as new schools open and established schools open satellite campuses. From what I've seen, it's incredibly hit or miss. I actually did my third year surgery rotation at a community hospital and was paired with a young harvard trained vascular surgeon, which was freaking awesome. There were no residents or fellows so I was first assist on every procedure and learned way more than the guys that were scutting around at the teaching hospital. Other people weren't so lucky though.
 
BullDeacLaw said:
Aren't most hospitals nonprofit? 10 years paying 10% of income under the income contingent plan and poof that 300k is gone? The bigger issue is when forgiveness starts happening in a few years and a poor teacher gets hit with a 80k tax bill
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Loan forgiveness is not taxed, so no worries
 
Interesting that it doesn't qualify as discharge of indebtedness income.
 
god forbid one thing in this world isn't taxed
 
tiltdeac said:
Pretty much agree with everything BacktoBack has posted on this thread. A lot of the newer DO schools are shady/suspect, but there are a couple that are fairly well thought of. Though it's much harder these days, there are some big names in most fields with a DO.

One thing to keep in mind is the DO grads will definitely be able to get a job (unlike the Charlottle law kids). Most of them will end up in residencies in lower paying specialties in less desirable areas, true, but they will have a job.

The model of employing local private practice guys to help out with med student training is becoming more and more common as new schools open and established schools open satellite campuses. From what I've seen, it's incredibly hit or miss. I actually did my third year surgery rotation at a community hospital and was paired with a young harvard trained vascular surgeon, which was freaking awesome. There were no residents or fellows so I was first assist on every procedure and learned way more than the guys that were scutting around at the teaching hospital. Other people weren't so lucky though.
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Well said and I should be careful not to make a blanket statement about DO schools. There are some that are quite good. But many of the newer ones are clearly modeling after the law school training model.

I agree with you that training in a community hospital can have its upside. However, as you mention, the training is hit or miss. When I was in med school the surgeons that trained us cared how we did and how we represented them when we came out. If we were lazy or dumb it reflected poorly on them. They made sure we were prepared as much as possible. I wonder what the level of interest and involvement is in some of these small community hospitals?
 
This.

If you cannot get a job, WE will hire you to work here (in Admissions or whatever) for a year or so at the same law school where you just got your J.D. Then we can count you as "employed."

ibleedgoldandblack said:
Law schools desperate to get their hands on tuition/student loans fucked up the model. There are too many damn law schools lying about their employment numbers.
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So what can be done about sham colleges?
 
Sham colleges are what we've been talking about.
 
PhDeac said:
Sham colleges are what we've been talking about.
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T
Ok I thought you meant undergrad.

The only thing that can really be done and have an effect is reforming the way federal loans are handed out
 
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