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Mississippi Teen pleads not guilty in hate crime

OliveGardenDeac said:
Well I don't have any faith in our justice system. They let guilty people off the hook and execute innocent people all the time. Whether or not the court says he is guilty is 100% irrelevant, just like Casey Anthony or OJ Simpson. Except this time, there is a 100% chance that he is guilty, not even a sliver of doubt is reasonable. It is the opposite of presumptuous to say what one thinks about this kid. In fact, I'd argue that it is our civil duty to condemn his actions and character.
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I don't think it's a civil duty to condemn anyone's character.

If he's found guilty, I'm all for condemning actions he was proven to have taken, and indeed him as well.

I'm sorry you've lost faith in the justice system, and I cannot agree that the decision of a court is irrelevant. I doubt the defendants would either. Our justice system isn't perfect, but it's pretty good, better than most I would say, without knowing the details of every justice system in the world. I think it's harmful to our system and our society when we find people guilty in the court of public opinion before they've had their day in a court of law.
 
KanhojiAngre said:
I don't think it's a civil duty to condemn anyone's character.

If he's found guilty, I'm all for condemning actions he was proven to have taken, and indeed him as well.

I'm sorry you've lost faith in the justice system, and I cannot agree that the decision of a court is irrelevant. I doubt the defendants would either. Our justice system isn't perfect, but it's pretty good, better than most I would say, without knowing the details of every justice system in the world. I think it's harmful to our system and our society when we find people guilty in the court of public opinion before they've had their day in a court of law.
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So do you think Casey Anthony and OJ Simpson are innocent? Your blind faith in the system is impressively ignorant.

I'm not saying that he shouldn't be granted a fair trial; I'm saying that he is a guilty shitbag with 0% doubt and that my condemnation of his actions and character is completely justified and the right thing to do. Defend him all you want though KA. I am quite disturbed by your reaction to this thread and think it is borderline sociopathic.
 
deac04 said:
What disturbs me is the other kids in the cars not getting charged for anything:

"In addition to Dedmon and Rice, the five other teens who took part in the incident that evening, according to the suit, are: Sarah Graves, of Crystal Springs; Shelbie Richards, of Pearl; and William Kirk Montgomery, John Blaylock and Dylan Butler, all of Brandon. None of the five has been arrested or charged."

I understand that they may be cooperating to get this guy the max sentence, but in my opinion, they beat a guy for the color of his skin. Shouldn't they get more than just having to testify in a trial? They did everything this guy did except run him over in a truck. They beat the guy until he couldn't get out of the way of a truck coming at him. They deserve a real punishment as well.
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I agree. They should all be charged with being accomplices and conspirators. They should all go to jail.

Anyone who goes in a car with someone (or more than one person) whose stated goal is to attack a person based on color deserves to pay.

As to comparing this to Casey Anthony, that's just nuts. There are witnesses and taped evidence on this one. There was none on Anthony.

These guys derseve to be in a prison pod that's at least 70% black.
 
OliveGardenDeac said:
So do you think Casey Anthony and OJ Simpson are innocent? Your blind faith in the system is impressively ignorant.

I'm not saying that he shouldn't be granted a fair trial; I'm saying that he is a guilty shitbag with 0% doubt and that my condemnation of his actions and character is completely justified and the right thing to do. Defend him all you want though KA. I am quite disturbed by your reaction to this thread and think it is borderline sociopathic.
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Define innocent.

I do know from what I watched of the Anthony trial, I predicted she would be found not guilty.

I didn't pay much attention to the OJ trial.

The way things are supposed to work in this country, you have to be proven guilty. We presume you're not until given no choice but to abandon that presumption.

I find this wholly preferable to making someone prove their innocence against a powerful state that presumes their guilt.
 
deac04 said:
What disturbs me is the other kids in the cars not getting charged for anything:

"In addition to Dedmon and Rice, the five other teens who took part in the incident that evening, according to the suit, are: Sarah Graves, of Crystal Springs; Shelbie Richards, of Pearl; and William Kirk Montgomery, John Blaylock and Dylan Butler, all of Brandon. None of the five has been arrested or charged."

I understand that they may be cooperating to get this guy the max sentence, but in my opinion, they beat a guy for the color of his skin. Shouldn't they get more than just having to testify in a trial? They did everything this guy did except run him over in a truck. They beat the guy until he couldn't get out of the way of a truck coming at him. They deserve a real punishment as well.
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I assume they got deals from the DA in exchange for testimony. I hate when guilty parties get off in these types of deals. :mad:
 
RJKarl said:
I agree. They should all be charged with being accomplices and conspirators. They should all go to jail.

Anyone who goes in a car with someone (or more than one person) whose stated goal is to attack a person based on color deserves to pay.

As to comparing this to Casey Anthony, that's just nuts. There are witnesses and taped evidence on this one. There was none on Anthony.

These guys derseve to be in a prison pod that's at least 70% black.
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Those three words are not needed. However I do agree with the rest of your post.

This guy deserves the absolute worst.
 
KanhojiAngre said:
I don't think it's a civil duty to condemn anyone's character.

If he's found guilty, I'm all for condemning actions he was proven to have taken, and indeed him as well.

I'm sorry you've lost faith in the justice system, and I cannot agree that the decision of a court is irrelevant. I doubt the defendants would either. Our justice system isn't perfect, but it's pretty good, better than most I would say, without knowing the details of every justice system in the world. I think it's harmful to our system and our society when we find people guilty in the court of public opinion before they've had their day in a court of law.
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KanhojiAngre said:
Define innocent.

I do know from what I watched of the Anthony trial, I predicted she would be found not guilty.

I didn't pay much attention to the OJ trial.

The way things are supposed to work in this country, you have to be proven guilty. We presume you're not until given no choice but to abandon that presumption.

I find this wholly preferable to making someone prove their innocence against a powerful state that presumes their guilt.
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Kanhoji is right in all the bolded portions. When the press jumps all over a defendant while the investigation is still ongoing, it becomes nearly impossible to provide a fair trial. I know in this case some might see that as a good thing, but 90% of the time it works to the detriment of defendants who aren't getting a fair shake to begin with.

Our justice system is already way too punitive and finds people guilty much too often with too little evidence. The price we pay for trying to keep some modicum of constitutional protection for defendants is that high powered lawyers are sometimes able to get guilty people off the hook. It's worth it, because the other option is so much worse. And people like OJ tend to end up where they belong anyway.
 
KanhojiAngre said:
Define innocent.

I do know from what I watched of the Anthony trial, I predicted she would be found not guilty.

I didn't pay much attention to the OJ trial.

The way things are supposed to work in this country, you have to be proven guilty. We presume you're not until given no choice but to abandon that presumption.

I find this wholly preferable to making someone prove their innocence against a powerful state that presumes their guilt.
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I agree with the innocent until proven guilty concept employed by the courts, and I hope he does receive a fair trial and is fairly convicted of his despicable actions. However, it has also been proven again and again that the courts are flawed and frequently fail to provide justice. This kid is guilty beyond any reasonable shade of doubt. I would like for you to provide a scenario in which he is not guilty. The appropriate response to this story is disgust in his actions, empathy for the unfortunate man and his family, and anger that such racism still exists in the modern world. Your response implies that you are indifferent to blatant racism/senseless violence and lack empathy for the man and his family by defending this kid stating that we should hold all judgment and consider ourselves agnostic to whether there was any wrong-doing in this scenario. Rather appalling IMO
 
RJKarl said:
I agree. They should all be charged with being accomplices and conspirators. They should all go to jail.

Anyone who goes in a car with someone (or more than one person) whose stated goal is to attack a person based on color deserves to pay.

As to comparing this to Casey Anthony, that's just nuts. There are witnesses and taped evidence on this one. There was none on Anthony.

These guys derseve to be in a prison pod that's at least 70% black.
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Sounds like they were all engaged in a felony and a guy died. In most states that's enough to stick someone with a murder rap (appropriately named "felony murder") but I don't know much criminal law so take my analysis with a grain of salt.
 
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