Official 2018 NBA Offseason Thread: the preseason cometh

[JManslow]

LeBron is GOAT if he can win with this year's Cavs over the Rockets or the Warriors. No chip this year, no GOAT status. Metrics aside both Jordan and Kobe had a season where they "willed" a lesser team to the promise land. LeBron has always won with a talented big 3, but if he can beat a star team from the West with the guys he has now he deserves it. That being said, I doubt he wins it this year.

No they didn’t. A championship requires more than one good player.

 

[RedSoxFaithful]

Who said that? The arguments against Jordan are based on his era not skills and wins. See above. It's definitely not clear that the Lebron crowd has Jordan as a clear #2, especially because it's not clear what criteria you all are using besides feels.

again: yeah, this guy is definitely interested in having a good faith argument

 

[netflixnchildres]

Jordan's 91 Bulls were him and Scotty, no big 3 just a big 2. Kobe's 2010 Lakers were not as good as the Celtics big 3 team. Obviously both had better supporting casts then this year's Cavs. But LeBron has also lost a lot of NBA finals. Winning this year with only Kevin Love absolves him of losing those other NBA championships and elevates him above Jordan (who I currently put ahead because he was 6-0 in the finals).

 

[JManslow]

Jordan's 91 Bulls were him and Scotty, no big 3 just a big 2. Kobe's 2010 Lakers were not as good as the Celtics big 3 team. Obviously both had better supporting casts then this year's Cavs. But LeBron has also lost a lot of NBA finals. Winning this year with only Kevin Love absolves him of losing those other NBA championships and elevates him above Jordan (who I currently put ahead because he was 6-0 in the finals).

LeBron only has one bad finals loss. His first run that ended in a sweep is arguably his biggest achievement

 

[PhDeac]

again: yeah, this guy is definitely interested in having a good faith argument

I am. You're just poking holes in my argument without making one yourself. Instead, you could just establish your criteria instead of posting drivel like this:

I mean, I hate the guy, but he's pretty clearly the best basketball player in the history of the game.

 

[Deacfreak07]

Jordan's 91 Bulls were him and Scotty, no big 3 just a big 2. Kobe's 2010 Lakers were not as good as the Celtics big 3 team. Obviously both had better supporting casts then this year's Cavs. But LeBron has also lost a lot of NBA finals. Winning this year with only Kevin Love absolves him of losing those other NBA championships and elevates him above Jordan (who I currently put ahead because he was 6-0 in the finals).

Is Kevin Love a HOF player? Is anyone else on this Cavs squad?

Also, Phil Jackson.

 

[RJKarl]

Jordan's 91 Bulls were him and Scotty, no big 3 just a big 2. Kobe's 2010 Lakers were not as good as the Celtics big 3 team. Obviously both had better supporting casts then this year's Cavs. But LeBron has also lost a lot of NBA finals. Winning this year with only Kevin Love absolves him of losing those other NBA championships and elevates him above Jordan (who I currently put ahead because he was 6-0 in the finals).

The only time he didn't lose to a better team was versus Dirk.

RE: Lakers 2010 - Two Hall of Famers -a multiple time All- NBA Defender, another 7' player who averaged 15/8.3/1.4 blocks and Odom who who averaged 10.8/9.8/3.3. That's an excellent team. It was a toss-up series.

Using rings I guess Robert Horry must be better than Barkley.

 

[RChildress107]

Jordan's 91 Bulls were him and Scotty, no big 3 just a big 2. Kobe's 2010 Lakers were not as good as the Celtics big 3 team. Obviously both had better supporting casts then this year's Cavs. But LeBron has also lost a lot of NBA finals. Winning this year with only Kevin Love absolves him of losing those other NBA championships and elevates him above Jordan (who I currently put ahead because he was 6-0 in the finals).

Kobe wasn’t even the best player on his own team in 2010.

And Pippen’s Bulls were still a 55 win team.

 

[JuiceCrewAllStar]

LeBron is GOAT if he can win with this year's Cavs over the Rockets or the Warriors. No chip this year, no GOAT status. Metrics aside both Jordan and Kobe had a season where they "willed" a lesser team to the promise land. LeBron has always won with a talented big 3, but if he can beat a star team from the West with the guys he has now he deserves it. That being said, I doubt he wins it this year.

pet peeve: "chip" instead of "ship"

 

[PhDeac]

Is Kevin Love a HOF player? Is anyone else on this Cavs squad?

Also, Phil Jackson.

Phil's legacy has taken a hit from his stint with the Knicks. Contrast that to Riley who continues to verify his genius status.

 

[Deacfreak07]

Kobe wasn’t even the best player on his own team in 2010.

And Pippen’s Bulls were still a 55 win team.

Also, Phil Jackson.

 

[Deacfreak07]

Phil's legacy has taken a hit from his stint with the Knicks. Contrast that to Riley who continues to verify his genius status.

Is it fair to evaluate Jordan’s years without Phil in DC?

 

[RJKarl]

MJ's Bulls never beat a team as good as the Spurs, Lakers or Celtics.

Don't say the Pistons. They were over the hill when they lost and had beaten MJ the previous two years. Why didn't Jordan beat them? He had Pippen.

 

[PhDeac]

Is it fair to evaluate Jordan’s years without Phil in DC?

Only if you think age impacts ability to manage a franchise like it impacts ability to play basketball.

Either way, Jordan was still a 20 point guy for the Wiz. Phil is a bust for the Knicks.

 

[Deacfreak07]

Only if you think age impacts ability to manage a franchise like it impacts ability to play basketball.

Either way, Jordan was still a 20 point guy for the Wiz. Phil is a bust for the Knicks.

Are you trying to suggest that Phil Jackson isn’t a top 5 all-time coach?

Because Lebron may have had some bottom 100 all-time coaches.

 

[netflixnchildres]

The only time he didn't lose to a better team was versus Dirk.

RE: Lakers 2010 - Two Hall of Famers -a multiple time All- NBA Defender, another 7' player who averaged 15/8.3/1.4 blocks and Odom who who averaged 10.8/9.8/3.3. That's an excellent team. It was a toss-up series.

Using rings I guess Robert Horry must be better than Barkley.

I don't use rings, unless you are the star player on your team responsible for getting them. Pau=Kevin Love, neither are HOF in my book, both good but not HOF material. Metta, Bynum and Odom may have had good years by their standards, but does anyone look back on their careers and consider them great players?

 

[Deacfreak07]

I don't use rings, unless you are the star player on your team responsible for getting them. Pau=Kevin Love, neither are HOF in my book, both good but not HOF material. Metta, Bynum and Odom may have had good years by their standards, but does anyone look back on their careers and consider them great players?

Pau Gasol will be in the HOF.

 

[RChildress107]

I don't use rings, unless you are the star player on your team responsible for getting them. Pau=Kevin Love, neither are HOF in my book, both good but not HOF material. Metta, Bynum and Odom may have had good years by their standards, but does anyone look back on their careers and consider them great players?

Bruh.

 

[netflixnchildres]

Pau most years is good for 18 & 10 as a secondary star. Love most years is good for 18 & 10 as a secondary star. Both are stretch bigs who rebound and pass well, and can shoot an open 3. The only difference between Love and Pau is that Pau can stay healthy and have a longer career.

 

[tiltdeac]

Where did the Kobe talk come from, he's not on the same planet as Lebron/Jordan