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Official 2018 NBA Offseason Thread: the preseason cometh

Fuck Your Couch said:
so what are you arguing? the warriors bench went from an elite unit to a vulnerability in one offseason and the warriors aren't historically great because of their 15 opponents?

this is like when you vehemently argued klay wasn't top 30 and at then very end after pages of self-masturbatory posts were like he's probably like 32nd.
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The Warriors have vulnerabilities in the same sense that the Death Star had vulnerabilities. The potential for Iggy and West to fall off due to age is one of them. It's small and shouldn't matter, but it is there.

Of course the Warriors are historically great. Stop being dense. But they aren't the GOAT in part because of their easy playoff schedules.

The Klay argument, if I recall, was me responding to someone who had Klay in the top 10 by saying I didn't even have him in the top 30 (think I settled on 35-40). That person called me crazy so I defended my argument and also called that person crazy for having Klay in the top 10. The thread then pulled an RJ when I said I wouldn't consider someone with Klay ranked ~25 crazy even though I personally had him outside the top 30.

It is possibility to make a claim, defend that claim with facts, and recognize that when it comes to rating basketball teams and players there is a range of reasonable disagreement.
 
Fuck Your Couch said:
if steph curry turns into seth curry and kevin durant turns into rudy gay i feel like the warriors are vulnerable

my take is that the warriors are invincible healthy, and would still be the best team in the NBA by a decent margin without KD which is insane. not sure what losing steph or draymond would do but i think they'd still be favorites. and if this jinxes them and they lose even better. don't think there's anything left to say on the topic.
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Fair enough. I think that take is hot, and frankly ill-supported, but I get it. I'm not sure it conflicts with anything I've said on this thread though regarding the Warriors bench or their status (or lack thereof) as the GOAT though.
 
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RChildress107 said:
Why are you reading this thread at 2:30 on a Friday (no games going on or breaking news that I'm aware of) if not for pointless arguments. Who gives a fuck about any argument ever had on this message board?
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Dude. Come on. The NBA is stale. I suppose you want this in your obituary? That you love the NBA? No way. Steph Curry or Dell Curry or Tayshaun Prince will die the same death we all due. Painful or not. We can't be here for everybody. Nor can Kobe or Shaq. The only thing I ask is that you love your brother or a stranger as much as you love NBA talk. Why not?
 
Fuck Your Couch said:
they haven't even played well this year, but it's been 5 games and it's the same bench as last season that was 2nd in net rating last year only behind the Spurs.
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It is not the same bench as last year. They lost Ian Clark and McAdoo. They added chucker Young and Caspi as well as the rookie Bell. Clark got the 2nd most minutes off the bench last year. Again, last year at this time, the Warriors also had one of the worst benches in the league. West was doing his best Spurs impression and providing nothing. Clark hadn't emerged. McCaw was a surprise and Mcgee could not be trusted. This is all with the realization that Zaza Pachulia is a stiff who can give you 16-20 minutes a game tops. So, the whole Warriors have a great bench thing is out of the ether. Warriors use their bench as well as anybody save the Spurs because they have great coaches. Talent wise, they are lacking and in a big way. They essentially have no big other than McGee. Zaza is a big body, but he's not tall. They have nobody that can match up with Boogie and Davis. And my nobody I mean McGee for 20 minutes if lucky.

So, to review. Who would rather have on your bench: Sean Livington, Iggy, Young, Caspi, Bell, McGee and West?

Or John Collins, Marco Bellineli, Delaney, Muscala, Plumlee, Luke Babitt, Bembry.

I am going to go with Atlanta. Collins trumps all of GS bigs including Zaza, Bellineli trumps Young, Livington trumps Delaney and Iggy trumps Babitt and Bembry, but I really like Muscala as a bench player and he is probably better than West and Bell as far as production. So no, GS is not going to run through the league due to their superior depth, bonehead. They are going to do it on the backs of their top 4 players and superior coaching. Kerr learned how to use his bench from the master.
 
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jaybone said:
So, to review. Who would rather have on your bench: Sean Livington, Iggy, Young, Caspi, Bell, McGee and West?

Or John Collins, Marco Bellineli, Delaney, Muscala, Plumlee, Luke Babitt, Bembry.

I am going to go with Atlanta. Collins trumps all of GS bigs including Zaza, Bellineli trumps Young, Livington trumps Delaney and Iggy trumps Babitt and Bembry, but I really like Muscala as a bench player and he is probably better than West and Bell as far as production. So no, GS is not going to run through the league due to their superior depth, bonehead. They are going to do it on the backs of their top 4 players and superior coaching. Kerr learned how to use his bench from the master.
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So basically what you're saying is, 40% is not 40%
 
c'mon man, we're not comparing the hawks bench and lamenting them letting mcadoo and clark walk? feel like i'm taking crazy pills when it comes to this warriors discussion.
 
deac29 said:
So basically what you're saying is, 40% is not 40%
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Oy. I steer clear of that one. No, I am saying Golden State has great coaching right now. I am of the firm belief that NBA coaching is just as important as NFL coaching and then there is a steep drop in sports in which coaching is THAT important. If you look at all NBA rosters, you simply cannot find any patterns to justify winning and losing records other than coaching and coaching/mgmt. simpatico. If a team has poor coaching or mgmt./coaching friction, they underachieve. Like Cleveland, for example. You can say what you want about how awesome GS is and they are awesome, but if you look at the Cleveland roster once they got Love, they should have been a 72 win team. A healthy Lebron, Kyrie, and Love with solid depth and great role players in Thompson and Shumpert, etc... They underachieved because their organization sucks.

And at some point, GS is going to lose their core and if they don't fuck it up and retain their current coaching/mgmt. structure, they will be fine.

That's all I am saying. I just draw the line if someone states GS has an awesome bench or something like that when it just simply is not true. They WILL have a good to adequate to sometimes awesome bench come March though.
 
ProudDeacon1948 said:
Dude. Come on. The NBA is stale. I suppose you want this in your obituary? That you love the NBA? No way. Steph Curry or Dell Curry or Tayshaun Prince will die the same death we all due. Painful or not. We can't be here for everybody. Nor can Kobe or Shaq. The only thing I ask is that you love your brother or a stranger as much as you love NBA talk. Why not?
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what
 
So are the soon to be 4-1 Magic actually good? Destroying the Spurs by 29 early in the 4th. Beat the Cavs handily on Saturday.
 
Well this should be a nice test of prevailing Warriors theories. Wizards up 14 with 19.5 sec left in the half. Draymond got in a fight with Beal and both were ejected. Bell isn't active. Klay and Wall hit back to back threes to close the half.

Let's see if the Warriors can come back without Draymond.
 
John Wall is good at passing

 
RJKarl said:
The fact that you don't understand the difference between a theoretical outcome and a proven one is extremely telling.
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You watch a player A take 1000 corner threes and make 380.

You then watch team A play 1000 games against team B and win 400.

Are you betting your life on team A in their next game against team B, or on Player A's next corner 3?
 
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