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Ongoing US GOP Debacle Thread: Seditious Republicans march toward authoritarianism

Criticizing the country of Israel should be more than fair game, one of the lobbying goals of all that money is to make any mention of the atrocities and shit they do get played off as being anti-Semitic. This story pretty much highlights the point she was trying to make. It’s like ripping into the Catholic Church for child abuse and leadership cover up, we aren’t shitting on you because you are Catholic or religious, we are shitting on you because you are covering up child abuse.
 
IamThunderbolt said:
I don't think pointing out the influence of AIPAC is anti-Semitic.

I also don't think the intent of the Benjamins tweet was anti-Semitic.

However, to boil down the exchange, the original tweet was basically:

"Why do American politicians spend so much time defending Israel?"

and her response was simply:

"Money"

Given the historical trope of Jews controlling world governments through their control/hoarding of wealth, I can see how this statement would be harmful to the Jewish community. I think if she had said: "because AIPAC has undue influence in American politics," it would have been less pithy, but also received differently. I don't think she intended to play upon this trope in this exact tweet, but as I stated before Impact > intent. While I don't know motives - this is similar to the President of Lipscomb decorating the table with cotton bolls when having Black students over to talk. It may be because it is trendy in Southern Living Magazine, etc. to decorate this way without malicious intent, but the impact on the students was harmful, making it racist.

eta: Similar in showing difference in intent v. impact, not in scale/order/obliviousness, etc. But also to show that being oblivious (intentionally or otherwise) to harmful history or stereotypes does not absolve one from having racist ideas or actions.
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Sorry, but I don't buy this. As other posters have pointed out, part and parcel of the Israeli/AIPAC agenda is paint all opposition to Israel as anti-Semitic. It's much like how Republicans paint all attempts to regulate the economy or support poor people as "Socialism" - and in both cases, it's been a very effective political device. I understand the historical conspiracy theory/lie/slander of the Jews as secretly bankrolling the world, but that history can't be used as a weapon to take legitimate political discourse off the table.

And again, politicians acting as directed by political donors is an absolutely valid political issue. If it's OK to point out that NRA money influences politicians to oppose gun control measures supported by 75% of Americans, or OK to point out that fossil fuel donations lead politicians to oppose climate science, then it is also OK to point out that AIPAC spending influences politicians to support actions by Israel that they would condemn if committed by other nations.
 
Deacon923 said:
Sorry, but I don't buy this. As other posters have pointed out, part and parcel of the Israeli/AIPAC agenda is paint all opposition to Israel as anti-Semitic. It's much like how Republicans paint all attempts to regulate the economy or support poor people as "Socialism" - and in both cases, it's been a very effective political device. I understand the historical conspiracy theory/lie/slander of the Jews as secretly bankrolling the world, but that history can't be used as a weapon to take legitimate political discourse off the table.

And again, politicians acting as directed by political donors is an absolutely valid political issue. If it's OK to point out that NRA money influences politicians to oppose gun control measures supported by 75% of Americans, or OK to point out that fossil fuel donations lead politicians to oppose climate science, then it is also OK to point out that AIPAC spending influences politicians to support actions by Israel that they would condemn if committed by other nations.
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TITCR. I appreciate IAT’s perspective on this, but it’s just not the case. There is a lot of anti-semitism in Washington. This tweet ain’t it.
 
Junebug said:
I didn’t realize only jews were allowed to have an opinion on anti-semetism. I’ll keep that in mind next time you post on whether something is prejudicial toward black people.
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You might think we would know better.

It’s funny. I don’t remember your allyship during the McCarthy and Trump incidents. Those, by contrast, were actually examples of anti-semitism.
 
Junebug said:
I didn’t realize only jews were allowed to have an opinion on anti-semetism. I’ll keep that in mind next time you post on whether something is prejudicial toward black people.
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:golfclap:
 
Junebug said:
I didn’t realize only jews were allowed to have an opinion on anti-semetism. I’ll keep that in mind next time you post on whether something is prejudicial toward black people.
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Wait, Strick is black?
 
Junebug said:
So you agree with me that invoking Allah wasn’t anti-Semitic but you posted to point out that I didn’t have the right to post that, despite the fact dozens of other posters posted that the comments weren’t anti-Semitic.

WTF is wrong with you? It would do you, and a lot of other posters, good to try to pay less attention who posts what and more attention to what is actually posted. Trying to attack almost every post I make because I’m a conservative leads you to post some really stupid shit.
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You certainly have the right. That doesn’t make it right. That goes for a lot of folks on here.

I also don’t attack almost every post you make. You must have me confused with someone else.
 
Dems falling into the right wing fake outrage PC machine (or just doing AIPAC's bidding). Not a good look.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/sorry-democrats-your-nra-is-spelled-aipac_us_59d62c62e4b0666ad0c3cb12

The latest evidence of that slavishness {to AIPAC] comes in the form of growing support among Democrats in both Houses for legislation sponsored by Sen. Benjamin Cardin (D-MD) and co-sponsored by Senate Democratic leader Chuck Schumer that would make it a felony for Americans to support the international boycott against Israel, commonly known as BDS. Anyone guilty of violating the prohibitions will face a minimum civil penalty of $250,000 and a maximum criminal penalty of $1 million and 20 years in prison.

According to the ACLU, the Cardin legislation would “bar U.S. persons from supporting boycotts against Israel, including its settlements in the Palestinian Occupied Territories (emphasis mine) conducted by international governmental organizations, such as the United Nations and the European Union. It would also... include penalties for simply requesting information about such boycotts. Violations would be subject to a minimum civil penalty of $250,000 and a maximum criminal penalty of $1 million and 20 years in prison....This bill would impose civil and criminal punishment on individuals solely because of their political beliefs about Israel and its policies.”

That is pretty amazing. The Cardin bill would essentially blow a giant hole in the First Amendment. Americans would continue to be allowed to hold any belief they want, about pretty much anything, with the exception of Israel. Although I, myself, do not support the boycott Israel movement (BDS), I also know that it was the Montgomery Bus Boycott that launched the civil rights movement. It was international boycotts of South Africa that brought down apartheid. Americans even used boycotts to kill North Carolina’s hateful “bathroom” law designed to punish transgender people. (Apparently, Cardin would permit Americans to boycott a U.S, state, just not the State of Israel.)

The Cardin bill is frightening and, if applied in any other context but the Israeli one, would be inconceivable. But all rules are suspended when it comes to the country about which former Vice President Joe Biden said “there must be no daylight, no daylight” between its policies and those of the United States. Yes, he actually said “no daylight” twice and, no, it is inconceivable that any American leader would say that about any other country, including Canada!
 
Shooshmoo said:
Dems falling into the right wing fake outrage PC machine (or just doing AIPAC's bidding). Not a good look.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/sorry-democrats-your-nra-is-spelled-aipac_us_59d62c62e4b0666ad0c3cb12

The latest evidence of that slavishness {to AIPAC] comes in the form of growing support among Democrats in both Houses for legislation sponsored by Sen. Benjamin Cardin (D-MD) and co-sponsored by Senate Democratic leader Chuck Schumer that would make it a felony for Americans to support the international boycott against Israel, commonly known as BDS. Anyone guilty of violating the prohibitions will face a minimum civil penalty of $250,000 and a maximum criminal penalty of $1 million and 20 years in prison.

According to the ACLU, the Cardin legislation would “bar U.S. persons from supporting boycotts against Israel, including its settlements in the Palestinian Occupied Territories (emphasis mine) conducted by international governmental organizations, such as the United Nations and the European Union. It would also... include penalties for simply requesting information about such boycotts. Violations would be subject to a minimum civil penalty of $250,000 and a maximum criminal penalty of $1 million and 20 years in prison....This bill would impose civil and criminal punishment on individuals solely because of their political beliefs about Israel and its policies.”

That is pretty amazing. The Cardin bill would essentially blow a giant hole in the First Amendment. Americans would continue to be allowed to hold any belief they want, about pretty much anything, with the exception of Israel. Although I, myself, do not support the boycott Israel movement (BDS), I also know that it was the Montgomery Bus Boycott that launched the civil rights movement. It was international boycotts of South Africa that brought down apartheid. Americans even used boycotts to kill North Carolina’s hateful “bathroom” law designed to punish transgender people. (Apparently, Cardin would permit Americans to boycott a U.S, state, just not the State of Israel.)

The Cardin bill is frightening and, if applied in any other context but the Israeli one, would be inconceivable. But all rules are suspended when it comes to the country about which former Vice President Joe Biden said “there must be no daylight, no daylight” between its policies and those of the United States. Yes, he actually said “no daylight” twice and, no, it is inconceivable that any American leader would say that about any other country, including Canada!
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Yeah, this is the worst kind of bipartisan concern trolling, especially because the same types are silent when there incidents of actual anti-semitism.
 
Strickland33 said:
TITCR. I appreciate IAT’s perspective on this, but it’s just not the case. There is a lot of anti-semitism in Washington. This tweet ain’t it.
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Agreed.

People can (and probably should) apologize for negative, unintended consequences, but they should be judged on their intent.
 
The basic idea that Americans and American businesses are required to hold certain political views about a foreign country is such an affront to the First Amendment that it's hard to imagine we're here.

Florida just barred state employees from getting reimbursed for using Airbnb for business travel because of their stance on listing properties in the West Bank. Ridiculous. https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article224556770.html
 
Shooshmoo said:
Dems falling into the right wing fake outrage PC machine (or just doing AIPAC's bidding). Not a good look.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/sorry-democrats-your-nra-is-spelled-aipac_us_59d62c62e4b0666ad0c3cb12

The latest evidence of that slavishness {to AIPAC] comes in the form of growing support among Democrats in both Houses for legislation sponsored by Sen. Benjamin Cardin (D-MD) and co-sponsored by Senate Democratic leader Chuck Schumer that would make it a felony for Americans to support the international boycott against Israel, commonly known as BDS. Anyone guilty of violating the prohibitions will face a minimum civil penalty of $250,000 and a maximum criminal penalty of $1 million and 20 years in prison.

According to the ACLU, the Cardin legislation would “bar U.S. persons from supporting boycotts against Israel, including its settlements in the Palestinian Occupied Territories (emphasis mine) conducted by international governmental organizations, such as the United Nations and the European Union. It would also... include penalties for simply requesting information about such boycotts. Violations would be subject to a minimum civil penalty of $250,000 and a maximum criminal penalty of $1 million and 20 years in prison....This bill would impose civil and criminal punishment on individuals solely because of their political beliefs about Israel and its policies.”

That is pretty amazing. The Cardin bill would essentially blow a giant hole in the First Amendment. Americans would continue to be allowed to hold any belief they want, about pretty much anything, with the exception of Israel. Although I, myself, do not support the boycott Israel movement (BDS), I also know that it was the Montgomery Bus Boycott that launched the civil rights movement. It was international boycotts of South Africa that brought down apartheid. Americans even used boycotts to kill North Carolina’s hateful “bathroom” law designed to punish transgender people. (Apparently, Cardin would permit Americans to boycott a U.S, state, just not the State of Israel.)

The Cardin bill is frightening and, if applied in any other context but the Israeli one, would be inconceivable. But all rules are suspended when it comes to the country about which former Vice President Joe Biden said “there must be no daylight, no daylight” between its policies and those of the United States. Yes, he actually said “no daylight” twice and, no, it is inconceivable that any American leader would say that about any other country, including Canada!
Click to expand...

This is outrageous and un-American.
 
Wakeforest22890 said:
Idiotic. Our collective political obsession with Israel is creepy and dumb.
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Israel represents the only truly democratic state in the ME. They are a Rock and their people are among the strongest, bravest,and most humane ever seen on this earth. That is “why” we stand with the Israeli and we always will. After all,deplorables like myself,were the ones who liberated the Nazi death camps. All those people you spit on and call racists with every breath are PRECISELY the people who would do it all over again and without any hesitation.

So let’s say you have a choice..what country in the ME would you choose to live instead of Israel?
 
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