TownieDeac
words are futile devices
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there's a snake in my boot
Presumably OFFICIAL 2016/17 Premier League
- Thread starter wakephan09
- Start date
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deacvision7
Mod Emeritus
Le sigh
[h=2]Premier League Player Statistics[/h]
View:OverallHomeAway
Filter:Minimum appsAll players
| R | Player | Apps | Mins | Goals | Assists | Yel | Red | SpG | PS% | AerialsWon | MotM | Rating | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 1 | | Eden Hazard Chelsea, 26, M(CLR),FW | 26 | 2170 | 11 | 4 | 2 | - | 2.1 | 84 | 0.5 | 10 | 7.89 |
| 2 | | Alexis Sánchez Arsenal, 28, M(LR),FW | 24(2) | 2191 | 17 | 9 | 5 | - | 3.5 | 73.5 | 0.4 | 7 | 7.85 |
| 3 | | Paul Pogba Manchester United, 24, M(C) | 25 | 2250 | 4 | 3 | 7 | - | 3.4 | 85.2 | 3 | 4 | 7.74 |
| 4 | | Diego Costa Chelsea, 28, FW | 25 | 2218 | 17 | 5 | 5 | - | 3 | 74.7 | 1.3 | 4 | 7.60 |
deacvision7
Mod Emeritus
Meh. United will just buy two more next year.
Straight cash, homey
TownieDeac
words are futile devices
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i guess it's not worth arguing if "value" doesn't exist for your club
deacvision7
Mod Emeritus
Paul Pogba has been the best central midfielder in the Prem this year. And I would even agree that he isn't playing to his full potential.
That's value considering what he is now and what he will become. vad is just being silly.
TownieDeac
words are futile devices
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comparing pogba to gana at everton (per 90)
they complete the same % of passes (85%)
gana has 3.65 tackles won to 1.4 for pogba
gana has a 75% successful take on % to pogba's 65.3%
gana has a 53% total duels % to pogba's 52.8%
gana has 2.46 interceptions per game to 1.6 for pogba
and gana cost 7m
granted, gana doesn't do as much going forward as pogba, but my point is THAT'S value
you can buy another player going forward that gives you what pogba does without the defensive lackings for the difference between their transfer fees and still have enough to buy ten more ganas
they complete the same % of passes (85%)
gana has 3.65 tackles won to 1.4 for pogba
gana has a 75% successful take on % to pogba's 65.3%
gana has a 53% total duels % to pogba's 52.8%
gana has 2.46 interceptions per game to 1.6 for pogba
and gana cost 7m
granted, gana doesn't do as much going forward as pogba, but my point is THAT'S value
you can buy another player going forward that gives you what pogba does without the defensive lackings for the difference between their transfer fees and still have enough to buy ten more ganas
deacvision7
Mod Emeritus
Pogba cost more than he is truly worth (as any player would be at that price)
Gana cost less than he is truly worth
Congratulations on showing that a defensive midfielder is better than a 8/10 hybrid at the defensive side of the game. Good work.
whoscored avg rating: Pogba 7.74; Gana 7.32
aerials won per game: Pogba 3; Gana 1.2
goals: 4/1
assists: 3/1
key passes pg: 2/0.6
passes pg: 75.1/57.5
successful take ons pg: 2.4/0.9
If you want to argue that a 7 million dollar buy for Everton provides them more "value" than a 90 million dollar buy does Man United, then have at it. But then, don't we have to take into account shirt sales and how much money was brought back to the club by that alone? Wouldn't that also be "value" in terms of pure monetary standards?
Did you buy a Gana shirt? I bought a Pogba shirt. And it's glorious.
Gana cost less than he is truly worth
Congratulations on showing that a defensive midfielder is better than a 8/10 hybrid at the defensive side of the game. Good work.
whoscored avg rating: Pogba 7.74; Gana 7.32
aerials won per game: Pogba 3; Gana 1.2
goals: 4/1
assists: 3/1
key passes pg: 2/0.6
passes pg: 75.1/57.5
successful take ons pg: 2.4/0.9
If you want to argue that a 7 million dollar buy for Everton provides them more "value" than a 90 million dollar buy does Man United, then have at it. But then, don't we have to take into account shirt sales and how much money was brought back to the club by that alone? Wouldn't that also be "value" in terms of pure monetary standards?
Did you buy a Gana shirt? I bought a Pogba shirt. And it's glorious.
timdunkandthefunk
Rusty Larue
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Can someone post Pogba's positioning heat map? I feel like he spends a lot of time in defensive areas to have those defensive stats.
vadimivich
Well-known member
Lol, you're beyond even my level of homerism if you think that. It's Kante and then it's an ocean before you get to whoever is #2. And #2 sure as fuck isn't the guy who isn't even the best CM in the 6th best team in the league.
TownieDeac
words are futile devices
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There are no less than five CMs in the prem I would rather have than Pogba, price notwithstanding.
deacvision7
Mod Emeritus
I'll bite. Name them.
TownieDeac
words are futile devices
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Kante
Hazard
KdB
Dele
Mane
I think any of those players, playing instead of at United, make United a better team. Some of them play very different roles, but there you go. I don't really like Pogba's game. He's got all the technical skill in the world, but doesn't really use it all that effectively imo. Still young and has a chance to be really incredible though.
Hazard
KdB
Dele
Mane
I think any of those players, playing instead of at United, make United a better team. Some of them play very different roles, but there you go. I don't really like Pogba's game. He's got all the technical skill in the world, but doesn't really use it all that effectively imo. Still young and has a chance to be really incredible though.
deacvision7
Mod Emeritus
Hazard? Mane? LOL
Want to pick out actual CMs instead? Those guys are wingers/attackers. KDB is a stretch, but Pogba plays some 10 as does KDB, so I'll allow it.
Want to pick out actual CMs instead? Those guys are wingers/attackers. KDB is a stretch, but Pogba plays some 10 as does KDB, so I'll allow it.
TownieDeac
words are futile devices
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Full name Eden Michael Hazard[1]
Date of birth 7 January 1991 (age 26)[2]
Place of birth La Louvière, Belgium
Height 1.73 m (5 ft 8 in)[2]
Playing position
Attacking midfielder / Winger
Club information
Current team
Chelsea
Number 10
Date of birth 7 January 1991 (age 26)[2]
Place of birth La Louvière, Belgium
Height 1.73 m (5 ft 8 in)[2]
Playing position
Attacking midfielder / Winger
Club information
Current team
Chelsea
Number 10
deacvision7
Mod Emeritus
deacvision7
Mod Emeritus
I'm well aware of his biographical information considering I was in love with him long before he got on the world stage when he was tearing Ligue 1 up with Lille. And he crushed me when he chose Chelsea over United after they luckboxed into winning the CL.
He's still a winger. Giggs played in the 10 spot a time or two as well, but he was a winger.
TownieDeac
words are futile devices
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A lot of what I like about Dele vs Pogba is the potential a 20 year old with a better conversion rate than Zlatan gives you. Dele is still kind of an idiot tackler and a bit profligate with possession for me, but Pogba's long balls don't really do it for me either. Pogba's goals and assists haven't been there in the league either.
Idk just me. He's a very good player, I just think he's underperforming a bit, and I don't think he's the best central midfielder in the league.
Idk just me. He's a very good player, I just think he's underperforming a bit, and I don't think he's the best central midfielder in the league.
vadimivich
Well-known member
The problem is that Pogba is a shit CM. That's not a crime, lots of guys are very good players but not good playing as a CM (many of the guys Townie listed fit that description, for example - KDB or Alli or Hazard would be disasters if asked to sit centrally and deep). To play in the middle of the park you have to be disciplined, you have to be defensively sound and you have to do a lot of thankless running (even the most static of CM's still run a lot, Pirlo late in his career still ran more than most forwards do, for example). Pogba doesn't do any of that. He's a very good long passer - especially through balls - but it's not enough to offset the choas he creates in his own team by being so undisciplined and defensively unsound and frankly, lazy.
That brings the second problem. Pogba isn't good enough at the front to be a star there either - he's not tricky or creative enough, and he's a poor finisher without the nose for goal that someone like Hazard has. In fact, a huge reason why United is so far down the goals scored tally this season is because they are trying to play Pogba further forward and he's simply not very good there.
He's a CM. He's got all the talent in the world to be an amazing CM - brilliant long passing, big frame, good close control, etc. Everything you'd want in a Toni Kroos type player. In fact, he's probably (talentwise) the closest thing to Kroos that exists outside of Madrid. The problem? He's fucking lazy and such a shit defender and so undisciplined that he can't be trusted to play in his best position. He has the attitude of a #10 without the skillset, and the skillset of a #8 without the attitude. Right now he's a fucking titanic waste of talent and it angers me to watch him, since he should be fucking amazing.
Herrera and Carrick are both better CM's on his own team right now. That's embarrassing. He would do well to learn a lot from the two of them.
That brings the second problem. Pogba isn't good enough at the front to be a star there either - he's not tricky or creative enough, and he's a poor finisher without the nose for goal that someone like Hazard has. In fact, a huge reason why United is so far down the goals scored tally this season is because they are trying to play Pogba further forward and he's simply not very good there.
He's a CM. He's got all the talent in the world to be an amazing CM - brilliant long passing, big frame, good close control, etc. Everything you'd want in a Toni Kroos type player. In fact, he's probably (talentwise) the closest thing to Kroos that exists outside of Madrid. The problem? He's fucking lazy and such a shit defender and so undisciplined that he can't be trusted to play in his best position. He has the attitude of a #10 without the skillset, and the skillset of a #8 without the attitude. Right now he's a fucking titanic waste of talent and it angers me to watch him, since he should be fucking amazing.
Herrera and Carrick are both better CM's on his own team right now. That's embarrassing. He would do well to learn a lot from the two of them.
ipitytheblue
...
Sells the most shirts, though.
vadimivich
Well-known member
Dele is what he is. He's a 2nd striker. I've cooled (a bit) on his long term superstar potential just because I think he's a very specialized player - if he has a good striker to play off of, and a strong midfield pairing behind him to allow him to roam and basically play as a deep lying forward, he's deadly. He's an absurd natural finisher and his movement and runs are exceptional, especially for someone as young as he is. I've seen nothing to show he can play as a true central midfielder, and he can't play out wide. The team has to be setup in a specific way for him to shine - he has to have a free role and a physical striker to play off of that allows him the freedom to poke and prod and find gaps without a ton of defensive responsibility. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if he ended up playing as something close to a traditional #9 later in his career as his frame fills out. He's already a forward in all but name.
All that being said, he's just 20 years old and has already scored 23 goals in 59 PL apps. If this is his ceiling and he never improves at all, he's still an extremely good player.