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Republican Voter Suppression Efforts

WakeForestRanger said:
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Yeah, I'm not at all sure that waging an "all-out war" with the largest and most powerful corporations and employers and professional and college sports organizations in what has become a purple state will work out all that well for Kemp in the long run. HB2 certainly didn't work out all that well for McCrory. Maybe in South Dakota or Missouri it would work, in a purple state like NC or GA it's likely to inspire a fierce backlash in the very areas of the state that are growing in political clout and influence. My guess is that if Kemp has half a brain he'll talk tough for his rube rural base and privately negotiate to keep things from getting too out of hand.
 
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BeachBumDeac said:
Do you really not understand why people have a problem with “massa”?
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I absolutely understand.

But it's the way he has made feel for many years. Am I not allowed to feel any way you don't approved of? I'm not allowed to express how I am made to feel?

It's 100% OK for you and he and others to go out of your ways to make me feel like shit even when I haven't addressed the person who starts it. There is nothing off the menu when attacking me.

Hell, he can't admit (nor can you) that he intentionally provoked this and lied about the reality that there are literally thousands and thousands of my posts which are 100% "opinion".

All I have EVER wanted here is to have some fun, but some you aren't willing to try. I know it's all my fault.
 
Highland Deac said:
Yeah, I'm not at all sure that waging an "all-out war" with the largest and most powerful corporations and employers and professional and college sports organizations in what has become a purple state will work out all that well for Kemp in the long run. HB2 certainly didn't work out all that well for McCrory. Maybe in South Dakota or Missouri it would work, in a purple state like NC or GA it's likely to inspire a fierce backlash in the very areas of the state that are growing in political clout and influence. My guess is that if Kemp has half a brain he'll talk tough for his rube rural base and privately negotiate to keep things from getting too out of hand.
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He's painting himself into a big corner. Many, many states will be lining up to get some of these companies to move production or HQs to their land.

I wonder how the GOP will do if it costs state-after-Red state hundreds of thousands of good jobs they had that relocate to other places.
 
RJKarl said:
Hell, he can't admit (nor can you) that he intentionally provoked this and lied about the reality that there are literally thousands and thousands of my posts which are 100% "opinion".
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Dude, let me explain it for you in a way that I hope is clear:

*All* your posts (and my posts and everyone else's posts) are "100% opinion".

My point is that the tone of your posts is always authoritative, even if someone else knows more about something than you do. Have you ever opened a post with "my opinion" or "I think"? Try it, it will really change the way people respond to you.

Your rhetorical formulas, too, which I suppose are supposed to strengthen your arguments, are just so silly and repetitive that people often don't take what you write seriously, even if you're absolutely correct.



.....

Like, here's an example that has nothing to do with you: on another thread people were debating inheritance law and at least one person was saying something that simply wasn't true about the boring foundational stuff. Now DeaconCav, the main thing I associate with his real-life is that he married an undergrad while doing an LLM in tax law.

In this thread he didn't point out this fact but rather corrected on a couple of minor points other's misunderstandings.

Then, once everybody was on the same page, people could object to their disagreements about the philosophy of inheritance and the semantics of "being taxed twice".

There are a lot of ways this conversation could have gotten derailed, but it didn't because people came to an agreement about the facts so that they could have the debate people really wanted to have.

With you, we can't even debate the issues because the rest of your rhetoric is so distracting and inflammatory. People pick fights with angus and thereff and DG3, for example, because they are trolls who swing by threads just to piss people off. Junebug, for all his hypocritical beliefs, at least tries sometimes to engage on issues that are important to him.

You respond to every perceived slight as if it's the end of the world. And people, myself included, think it's funny to see you overreact and misunderstand stuff when you're angry.

It doesn't make you a bad person or anything like that. Just a good reminder to not take everything so seriously.
 
I said I wouldn't respond, but I will this one last time.

"My point is that the tone of your posts is always authoritative, even if someone else knows more about something than you do. Have you ever opened a post with "my opinion" or "I think"? Try it, it will really change the way people respond to you."

You are using the exact terminology towards me that you allege I use.

I have no interest in dealing with you as you have neglected LITERALLY 1000s of my post that don't fit this above preconceived concept.
 
Highland Deac said:
Good for you. Unfortunately, a great many of your fellow conservatives are dead set against having such papers due to conspiracy theories about the government tracking people and fascism and other Qanon-level crap (and that they refuse to get vaccinated), and some GOP state governors are claiming that they will stop any attempt to require such certificates/IDs in their states. And yet many of these same GOP state governors are eagerly signing the new voter restriction laws that require voters to have new forms of IDs, even though whenever they discuss vaccine IDs they claim it's federal government overreach and tyranny. Strange how that works.
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The issue of people not getting vaccinated will disappear due to a combination of people changing their minds when they see that there is very little danger in being inoculated and herd immunity. The problem of accurate voter identification will not and will destroy democracy. Every other democracy worthy of the name insists on accurate proper voter identification, why shouldn't states of the US? The fact that anyone questions the need for proper and accurate voter identification, which - I repeat - is not questioned anywhere else in the world, is absurd.
 
On a further note, if you are worried about inconsistencies in general, go to work on the woke pc crowd. They are nothing but a bundle of illogic and inconsistencies, "walking incoherence" as some around here might say.
 
So dumb.

Voter fraud is, quite literally, not an issue. Its not destroying democracy because almost exclusively the people voting are the people allowed to vote. Most people are already identified when they show up. Do you show a driver's license to prove your address and name?

Voter ID is another example of the GQP scaring people to get votes. Its certainly not a policy argument - trumpublicans don't have policies about anything anymore.
 
deaconson said:
So dumb.

Voter fraud is, quite literally, not an issue. Its not destroying democracy because almost exclusively the people voting are the people allowed to vote. Most people are already identified when they show up. Do you show a driver's license to prove your address and name?

Voter ID is another example of the GQP scaring people to get votes. Its certainly not a policy argument - trumpublicans don't have policies about anything anymore.
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I don't have any doubt the motives of Pubs/conservatives here. The Party is dying on the vine and this is just another rallying call to stir up their supporters. Their efforts continue to be misdirected by many of us former Pubs.
Whatever. The fact of the matter is this IS an issue to millions. So often we address a critical issue here, Board Dems/liberals simply say "it is not an issue". (See Transgender Athletes thread)

Why not put it to bed and say a Voter ID (to be issued with no charge if not available) are required to vote. Standardize everything else about election days, times, ballots, etc. and be done with it.
Stick it to Pubs/conservatives and wait for the next obstacle they think of, as all politicians (on both sides) will eventually do.
 
Why should the Democrats appease the millions of people who are dumb enough to believe the lies Republicans have been yelling about for years? Why is it up to the left to cave in just to make them happy?
 
BeachBumDeac said:
Why should the Democrats appease the millions of people who are dumb enough to believe the lies Republicans have been yelling about for years? Why is it up to the left to cave in just to make them happy?
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There it is. "Why cave in to a concern that almost half of the population has? Politics, in the 2020's. Thank you for the shining example.
Keep on fighting the good fight....lol.
 
The reason they have that concern is not because there is actually a problem, but because Republicans have yelled the lie louder than researchers have yelled the truth.

So yes, they are dumb enough to believe Republicans rather than actual voting experts.
 
DeacsPop said:
There it is. "Why cave in to a concern that almost half of the population has? Politics, in the 2020's. Thank you for the shining example.
Keep on fighting the good fight....lol.
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It's a legitimate point. If the "concern" that so many Republicans have is based on lies and false claims, why is it up to Democrats to cater to them by allowing Republican legislatures to pass laws making it harder to vote, which target the poor, minority groups, and urban voters that are likely to vote Democratic, and make it easier to overturn legitimate elections in the future? If the concern isn't based in reality, why should it be catered to? Restricting voting and making it more difficult to vote seems like a terrible price to pay just so some Republicans can have their fantasies of stolen elections confirmed. And, of course, for many Republicans this reason is pure BS anyway -they're simply doing it to make it harder for Democrats to win elections in the future, and for groups aligned with Democrats, like African-Americans to be able to vote. You admitted as much in your earlier post.
 
sailordeac said:
The issue of people not getting vaccinated will disappear due to a combination of people changing their minds when they see that there is very little danger in being inoculated and herd immunity. The problem of accurate voter identification will not and will destroy democracy. Every other democracy worthy of the name insists on accurate proper voter identification, why shouldn't states of the US? The fact that anyone questions the need for proper and accurate voter identification, which - I repeat - is not questioned anywhere else in the world, is absurd.
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I think you're grossly overestimating the willingness of many Trumpites to admit that they were wrong and and get the vaccine. You also failed to acknowledge the clear contradiction in the GOP's claims on those two issues. Voters in GA and other states couldn't just walk up and vote anyway, their names are checked by election judges before they vote. Nor have you or any other conservative provided a reasonable argument for why Georgia is making major changes in its voting procedures when there isn't a shred of evidence that vote fraud is affecting the elections there. The law covers far more than Voter IDs, but conservatives have also ignored that. What is truly absurd is that the same GA Republican party which put the laws in place for the last election, and whose state officials repeatedly confirmed featured almost no vote fraud or abuse, decided after repeated losses to scrap their own law and pass one that is going to make it harder for people in specific groups and areas of the state (urban areas, to be precise) to vote. That's what's absurd, and so is arguing that an election system that has been proven to work suddenly requires Voter IDs, which studies have shown that certain voting groups are less likely to get, or find it more difficult to obtain. Why do GA Republicans want to make it harder to vote, especially when there's no evidence of vote fraud or abuse?
 
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Highland Deac said:
It's a legitimate point. If the "concern" that so many Republicans have is based on lies and false claims, why is it up to Democrats to cater to them by allowing Republican legislatures to pass laws making it harder to vote, which target the poor, minority groups, and urban voters that are likely to vote Democratic, and make it easier to overturn legitimate elections in the future? If the concern isn't based in reality, why should it be catered to? Restricting voting and making it more difficult to vote seems like a terrible price to pay just so some Republicans can have their fantasies of stolen elections confirmed. And, of course, for many Republicans this reason is pure BS anyway -they're simply doing it to make it harder for Democrats to win elections in the future, and for groups aligned with Democrats, like African-Americans to be able to vote. You admitted as much in your earlier post.
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If you believe that requiring ID (and only ID) is an obstacle to vote, then I agree with you. But I have not heard a solid argument that is the case except let's stick it to the Pubs because this issue is bullshit and we know what's up their sleeves. How that is the case when 95% (at least) of the population already has such identification and we break our ass to make it inexpensive and easy as hell for the last 5% (?) to do so?
 
DeacsPop said:
If you believe that requiring ID (and only ID) is an obstacle to vote, then I agree with you. But I have not heard a solid argument that is the case except let's stick it to the Pubs because this issue is bullshit and we know what's up their sleeves. How that is the case when 95% (at least) of the population already has such identification and we break our ass to make it inexpensive and easy as hell for the last 5% (?) to do so?
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Why should the last 5% (or 95%) have to get a Voter ID when there is no evidence that the current system is rife with abuse? That's the point - the GOP is adding voting requirements to solve a problem that simply doesn't exist. What you're asking Democrats to do is (again) cave to Republicans to ease their unjustified suspicions and paranoia. And of course if Democrats went along with Voter ID then Fox and other right-wing media would loudly trumpet that they had been right all along, and that there was serious vote fraud and that last year's election was stolen, because even Democrats are going along with Voter IDs! That's how they work, and that's how they think. IMO, it's long past time for non-Trump supporters (not just Democrats, but independents too) to stop catering to this shit and instead stand up to it. If the GOP base wants to live in a fantasy world where every big city is rife with vote fraud and every Democratic election victory is a stolen victory, that's their business. But the Democrats shouldn't play along on allowing unnecessary Voter IDs just so the GOP can feel better about themselves whenever they lose an election.
 
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DeacsPop said:
If you believe that requiring ID (and only ID) is an obstacle to vote, then I agree with you. But I have not heard a solid argument that is the case except let's stick it to the Pubs because this issue is bullshit and we know what's up their sleeves. How that is the case when 95% (at least) of the population already has such identification and we break our ass to make it inexpensive and easy as hell for the last 5% (?) to do so?
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It's a poll tax. If you have to pay a penny to get the ID, it's a poll tax. That's illegal as well as being totally unnecessary.

On top of that, if you look at the states that are "leading" in this lie, they are closing DMVs and polling places in minority areas. This makes it tougher to get IDs and creates costs that needn't exist. Again, if you cause someone to spend one penny to get an ID or not be able to vote, it is a poll tax.

W studied over 1,000,000,000 votes and didn't find this as a problem. What's a problem to Republicans is that Americans who are black, brown, people of Asian and Native ancestry are voting, more and they vote Dem. That's the reason for these laws. you understand this has nothing to do with the "security" of the vote.
 
DeacPop, do you think Democrats could get 10 votes Republican votes in the Senate for their voting rights bill if they added a National ID program that updates residency, a process to get everyone an ID by 2028, and a voter ID requirement standard in every state by the 2028 election?
 
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