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SHELTON MITCHELL DECOMMITS?

Milhouse said:
you can take mdmh out of pitt county, but you can't take the pitt county out of mdmh
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I'm not from Pitt County, but I am proud of the hard work it took for me to get a degree from Wake Forest.
 
Strickland33 said:
You do realize that ESPN doesn't really prioritize its high school basketball recruiting coverage anymore, right? Likewise, 247 is on the way up, but it's far from reliable, IMO. Their post-Wake signing Rondale bump to 3-stars is proof of that, IMO. The only thing that they have going for them is their composite and it's still no RSCI. 247 is a great example of quantity over quality, IMO.

And you should give a fuck about Dave Telep because he probably knew more about actual basketball talent than any of the recruiting analysts in the game. He trained the ones who aren't half bad (Evan Daniels, for instance), as well.He also saw the most of Shelton of any of these guys and the earliest.

Scout and Rivals with RSCI as a composite are still the way to go in terms of HS basketball recruiting.
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EVAN DANIELS is really the guys name. I thought that was a made up name based on EVAN WILLIAMS/JACK DANIELS. :rofl:
 
myDeaconmyhand said:
Judging from this thread, you all were much more excited about Shelton Mitchell than I was. I trust the scouting services more than Bzz-Battle. IMO this is good news, it gives Manning a better opportunity to find his own PG.
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Amen. If we don't get Wilbekin, this is still probably good news, the way he played a couple of weeks ago.
 
IAppreciateIt said:
i'm a fan of cmm's point guard skills and don't know why some people think he needs to play offball. BUT, he could easily have success doing so.

not sure where this idea* that a player absolutely must be a great 3-point shooter to play the wing (the distinction between a '2' and 3' is almost entirely unnecessary, esp. in college ball for purposes like these).

being a good three point shooter is a good thing at any position. you'll find more wings who are good shooters because they need to be good shooters to make up for the skills other positions have (big guys obviously provide size, and point guards are crucial as far as controlling the game). but guys who might technically be the 2 can still often be lead guard, which i think actually is a meaningful label.

*i'm actually pretty sure some of is because the word shooting is in shooting guard, which i find to be a dumb reason.

basically, cmm's shitty outside shot hurts regardless of what position he's playing.
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He doesn't shoot well, so unless he grows a foot he's not really useful on the court other than as a PG. If you're going to have a 2 who can't shoot the 3 ball, then you better damn well have a 3 and 4 who can step out and hit them. That's why it hurts. There's no question that losing a top 100 recruit hurts the program, but we weren't that bad at the point to begin with. IMO Moto leaving hurts us more in the short term. Hopefully Manning can recruit some serious ballers and this won't be an issue 2 years from now.
 
DCDeac said:
Also have to consider that manning has nothing to work with this year as far as Shelton goes. He sat the entire year with the knee and when he finally got in he was pulled after short minutes and left limping. Codi spent last year looking like a solid scoring point guard who has no business at the 2.

I really doubt Mitchell is ready to be a starting ACC point guard for a decent team. But he could be a great 4 year guy and elite at some point so it sucks to lose him.

But if manning is really looking to build a team his way, I get not promising a starting spot to Shelton or looking at other ways to make us actually good in 2 years.
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Yep.
 
TUA01576 said:
It appears to me that Top Hat is implying this or that Manning is doing a bad job because he lost this commitment.
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I'm no defender of the DM hire, this is one of those looks worse than really is things. But I agree with Top that this is not really a good time to look bad. With where we've been and the unknowns about Manning as a head coach/ recruiter, it is discouraging to say the least.
 
TUA01576 said:
It appears to me that Top Hat is implying this or that Manning is doing a bad job because he lost this commitment.
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I am implying that a coach we brought in with an expectation to be a dominant recruiter, and land top recruits, should be able to retain a 4* PG who has been sold on Wake for years. I can't *imagine it would have been difficult to retain SM, at least that is the vibe he gave off. Oh well, attrition occurs, but if you weren't high on the hire before this certainly isn't encouraging.
 
First Wilbekin sounds like a solid get if he comes to Wake. I worried about Shelton's knee. You never know how a kid is going to respond to something like that. Look no further than to Daniel Green. But I'm sorry to hear Shelton isn't giving it a shot at Wake.

Second, we know we are in a shambles after the last regime. Manning kept Childress but brought in his own guys who know how to recruit the players Manning likes. Things will get better. And I also know one simple thing. The guys on the court next season will be the guys who play tough defense and have the focus to execute for 40 minutes. Our offense may not be much but I believe Manning will insist on effort on defense and the boards and executing the offense (even if we can't shoot very well). This will happen.

So, let the chips fall where they may. We got rid of the nightmare, so I'm not losing it over Shelton, that's for damn sure.
 
TopHat said:
I am implying that a coach we brought in with an expectation to be a dominant recruiter, and land top recruits, should be able to retain a 4* PG who has been sold on Wake for years. I can't image it would have been difficult to retain SM, atleast that is the vibe he gave off. Oh well, attrition occurs, but if you weren't high on the hire before this certainly isn't encouraging.
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Yeah, but DM started recruiting Wilbekin almost immediately after he took the job. Shelton said he was committed to Wake not a coach and then met with Manning and got a release. This is worse if he's wrong, but it really looks like Manning told Shelton he was bringing in another PG to compete with Shelton and didn't like that.

We could have pulled the [name redacted] and kissed Moto and all the recruits asses and made them promises.
 
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I have not seen Shelton play, but he has moved down the ratings the last two years. He can't shoot very well. That would have given us three guards that can't shoot. He loved Wake, but I don't think Manning loved his game for his system or current roster.

As for Manning's recruiting ability, his make or brake is the 2016 class. Our schollies are out of balance and that is not his fault. He's trying to stop the bleeding for next year until he can turn over the roster to a team that fits his system.
 
Fuck Your Couch said:
Yeah, but DM started recruiting Wilbekin almost immediately after he took the job. Shelton said he was committed to Wake not a coach and then met with Manning and got a release. This is worse if he's wrong, but it really looks like Manning told Shelton he was bringing in another PG to compete with Shelton and didn't like that.
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Fair and pretty likely perspective. If this is the case, then it just comes down to how well that decision turns out. Obviously, it is too late to look back now and DM could look like a genius in the near future.
 
IAppreciateIt said:
i'm a fan of cmm's point guard skills and don't know why some people think he needs to play offball. BUT, he could easily have success doing so.

not sure where this idea* that a player absolutely must be a great 3-point shooter to play the wing (the distinction between a '2' and 3' is almost entirely unnecessary, esp. in college ball for purposes like these).

being a good three point shooter is a good thing at any position. you'll find more wings who are good shooters because they need to be good shooters to make up for the skills other positions have (big guys obviously provide size, and point guards are crucial as far as controlling the game). but guys who might technically be the 2 can still often be lead guard, which i think actually is a meaningful label.

*i'm actually pretty sure some of is because the word shooting is in shooting guard, which i find to be a dumb reason.

basically, cmm's shitty outside shot hurts regardless of what position he's playing.
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So much this. I'd prefer him to play off ball because of the value I think he adds on slashes and cuts. His mid range game is proficient enough for him to play the 2. Dude doesn't have to be jacking up threes just because he's a shooting guard.
 
Fuck Your Couch said:
Yeah, but DM started recruiting Wilbekin almost immediately after he took the job. Shelton said he was committed to Wake not a coach and then met with Manning and got a release. This is worse if he's wrong, but it really looks like Manning told Shelton he was bringing in another PG to compete with Shelton and didn't like that.

We could have pulled the [name redacted] and kissed Moto and all the recruits asses and made them promises.
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Could be something to this. I'm all for DM recruiting who he wants, but seems like we had a decent one with experience in CMM and a highly rated one already committed, so I guess it'll work out how it does. PG was not a position I expected us to be going hard after right away. And face it, most folks around here were very hopeful that Mitchell was going to be a stud, so if it is as you say, I hope DM's gamble pays off.

ETA from the previous posted, if we're opening up space for someone who can actually shoot I'm all for it.
 
RedSoxFaithful said:
So much this. I'd prefer him to play off ball because of the value I think he adds on slashes and cuts. His mid range game is proficient enough for him to play the 2. Dude doesn't have to be jacking up threes just because he's a shooting guard.
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I get that on a Duke shooting team, but this is our go to from beyond the arc.

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Admittedly today's events don't change that one way or another but to keep saying having a 2 who can't shoot deep doesn't matter is pretty dumb on a team with no deep threats.
 
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RedSoxFaithful said:
Dude doesn't have to be jacking up threes just because he's a shooting guard.
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You can't fill the entire starting 5 with guys who can't shoot. We should be minimizing the weaknesses of our roster, not exacerbating them. Codi's nearly the only player on the roster who can create his own shot, though I think McClinton will be able to create for himself.
 
myDeaconmyhand said:
So I must not be paying attention because I think less highly than you do of a top 75, at best, 3rd point guard? That's not nuance, that's you stating an opinion as if it were a fact. You failing to realize that 247 has two ranking systems, and that only the index has Shelton in the top 100, is an example of your own ignorance, not mine. I guess you need to worry enough for the both of us.
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lolwut

A top 75 recruit would be the second highest ranked player on our roster coming out of high school, behind CMM. That has 3rd point guard (at best!) written all over it.

You're taking the opinion of 247 (which even flaunts its composite ranking over its own ranking service) a little too seriously. They prioritize football over basketball, and their basketball scouting is pretty well behind the other services by most accounts. I called you ignorant because you're choosing to dismiss the literally five other more highly respected scouting services that I am 300% certain you didn't consult before you posted in this thread. I said you're not paying attention because you seem to be doubling down on some batshit crazy assertion that Madison Jones is better than Shelton Mitchell. As far as Mitchell is concerned, I think you're talking out of your ass.

But please, by all means, tell me again how getting Wilbekin or Cornish instead of Mitchell is a net gain for the program, or something.
 
myDeaconmyhand said:
You can't fill the entire starting 5 with guys who can't shoot. We should be minimizing the weaknesses of our roster, not exacerbating them. Codi's nearly the only player on the roster who can create his own shot, though I think McClinton will be able to create for himself.
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Moving Codi to the 2 because you're getting an elite distributor/facilitator doesn't exacerbate shit. If anything, it means that Codi will get more open looks and cuts.

I don't understand this line of thought.
 
Everyone should just sit back, take a deep breath and let DM coach this team. Maybe we'll all be surprised with the guys we have now when they've had some good coaching for a change and maybe DM has his own ideas on whom he wants to play for him. Besides Mitchell didn't say he was ruling Wake out. :noidea:
 
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