The 2019 College Football Thread ! LSU NATIONAL CHAMPIONS ! CLEMSON SUCKS !!!!!!!!!!!

[JuiceCrewAllStar]

pretty classic ph argument where he shoots from the hip then pivots the argument mid-discussion once the facts show he's wrong

 

[Shooshmoo]

Need to hear more about the last time perennial power Wisconsin seriously competed for a national championship.

Also, most of Wisconsin's best players are from out of state, which is true of a lot of those programs. They're first and second string QB are from NY and KS. Jonathan Taylor is from NJ. Their best WR is a 3-star accused rapist from from Macon, GA with offers from Miami and Vanderbilt. Their two best OL are from Wisconsin. Their best LB is from WI who might be a mid-round pick (might not). Basically everyone on their very good defense is from out of state.

Dude, you have a hard on for Wisconsin hate. They have the 12th winningest program in college football since 2000 (and that includes Boise St and App. St.). Better than Texas, FL, Miami, Auburn, ND, Mich. Mich St., and Penn St. They are a perennial power, but they don't get the level of recruits that Bama, Oh St., Clemson, LSU get. Georgia does, but they still can't compete for a national championship.

 

[DeacsATS]

Just when I thought it wasn't possible for me to hate FSU and Urban Meyer any more... Now we have rumors they may be joining forces.

Doubt it happens... But geez.

 

[PhDeac]

pretty classic ph argument where he shoots from the hip then pivots the argument mid-discussion once the facts show he's wrong

Classic Ph argument were someone misunderstood my point and makes my point. The chart made my point. There’s an expectation that all three can be top programs at the same time. That hasn’t been the case in awhile and it’s not going to happen anymore. I didn’t say it was because of UCF in the last few years. Not at all. These are trends that have been happening for awhile. The idea that all three P5 FL programs could have great coaches and all contend for a national championship is foolish. One would get squeezed out. It’s just too hard to compete.

Not sure how people can underestimate the impact of being the program in the state. It’s not just recruits. It’s resources, fans, it’s being the biggest thing in the state on Saturdays.

 

[PhDeac]

It's because most of their bandwagon fans have no idea where the campus is.

This is part of it too. And Coral Gables doesn’t want the townies coming over there anyway.

 

[JuiceCrewAllStar]

Classic Ph argument were someone misunderstood my point and makes my point. The chart made my point. There’s an expectation that all three can be top programs at the same time. That hasn’t been the case in awhile and it’s not going to happen anymore. I didn’t say it was because of UCF in the last few years. Not at all. These are trends that have been happening for awhile. The idea that all three P5 FL programs could have great coaches and all contend for a national championship is foolish. One would get squeezed out. It’s just too hard to compete.

Not sure how people can underestimate the impact of being the program in the state. It’s not just recruits. It’s resources, fans, it’s being the biggest thing in the state on Saturdays.

if your point was that all three can't be dominant at the same time, you may want to word it differently than "I think the days of UF, FSU, and Miami being dominant programs is over."

 

[tigerswood]

Just when I thought it wasn't possible for me to hate FSU and Urban Meyer any more... Now we have rumors they may be joining forces.

Doubt it happens... But geez.

It's always been hilarious to me that UF fans hate Urban Meyer. Yeah, the dude completely lost control of the ship (and his own health/sanity) in Gainsville, but he won two of your team's 3 National Championships.

 

[BarcaDeac]

It's always been hilarious to me that UF fans hate Urban Meyer. Yeah, the dude completely lost control of the ship (and his own health/sanity) in Gainsville, but he won two of your team's 3 National Championships.

and brought our lord and savior to Gainesville

 

[PhDeac]

if your point was that all three can't be dominant at the same time, you may want to word it differently than "I think the days of UF, FSU, and Miami being dominant programs is over."

I also said “I think the most we’ll see is two FL teams staying ranked over the course of a season.”

College football programs compete at the same time. What else did you think I meant?

 

[DeacsATS]

Classic Ph argument were someone misunderstood my point and makes my point. The chart made my point. There’s an expectation that all three can be top programs at the same time. That hasn’t been the case in awhile and it’s not going to happen anymore. I didn’t say it was because of UCF in the last few years. Not at all. These are trends that have been happening for awhile. The idea that all three P5 FL programs could have great coaches and all contend for a national championship is foolish. One would get squeezed out. It’s just too hard to compete.

Not sure how people can underestimate the impact of being the program in the state. It’s not just recruits. It’s resources, fans, it’s being the biggest thing in the state on Saturdays.

Feels like it was your expectation that all 3 can be top programs at the same time. Hasn't been the case in 20+ years. And even back then, there were issues with them taking recruits from each other (and power shifts).

When I look back at it, the timing of Miami's decline was when they left the Big East and joined the ACC in 2004. I wonder if there is any validity to an argument that their struggles can be traced back to actually having to compete w/ FSU as a part of the same conference?

As far as all 3 FL programs being great again... If Miami and FSU would hire elite coaches, I think that would work out just fine. You'd probably see some other schools get pushed down... Auburn, UGA, maybe even Clemson. But I think it is more that Miami is just fooked. Could certainly make an argument that UCF is in a better place than Miami right now... And that it might not change.

I still think the "State" argument is foolish.

But it is OK that we disagree on this stuff... I don't think there is any way to prove these things. I guess I could say "GOTCHA" when Texas and USC are playing in the National Championship in a few years (w/ UF and FSU also in the playoff), but we won't remember (or care).

 

[DeacsATS]

It's always been hilarious to me that UF fans hate Urban Meyer. Yeah, the dude completely lost control of the ship (and his own health/sanity) in Gainsville, but he won two of your team's 3 National Championships.

He cited health concerns as why he couldn't coach and then he went to Ohio State and continued to be an awesome coach.

He's also probably a dick.

But sure, I love that he did so well at UF. Of course I do. I'm just jealous that he thought we weren't good enough for him anymore. It's depressing feeling that way... Especially as I sit here in these jorts. Thankfully, Dan Mullen is here now to keep me warm at night.

 

[DeacsATS]

I also said “I think the most we’ll see is two FL teams staying ranked over the course of a season.”

3 FL teams finishing the season in the Top 25 literally happened both 3 seasons ago and 2 seasons ago.

Has there been a seismic shift since then? All I see is that FSU sucks all of the sudden, UCF isn't as good w/ Frost gone, and Miami has crawled back into their hole after a head fake.

 

[DeacsATS]

And shame on you for bringing this up during a day/week where I have no travel and work is slow.

 

[Buttermaker]

May be a dumb question but why doesn't Miami try to build a smaller stadium closer to/on campus? Is it because their best-case model includes having massive home games with easier access for non-alumni that happen to live in Miami?

I doubt there are many viable locations near campus given how built up and expensive Miami has become.

 

[Pilchard]

Wisconsin generally gets its skill guys from out of state, although they do usually pull a stud safety, in the Jim Leonhard mode from in state, but Wisconsin gets a ton of great OL/DL from in-state (Joe Thomas, the Watt brothers, Travis Frederick, Ryan Ramczyk), and that is what has built the program. Think Wisconsin has produced more OL in the NFL than any other program, and most those beasts are in-state.

Think there is some validity to Ph's point. The decline of the Big 3 in Florida has coincided with the development of the UCF and USF programs. No doubt that bad coaching has played a role in the decline of FSU, UF and Miami, but there has also been a talent drain too. FSU, Miami and UF could top-off their classes with late-bloomers from in-state, now a lot of those recruits are already committed. That said, if Urban Meyer took the FSU job, they would be Natty contenders in less than 3 years. So, both sides have a point.

 

[deaconnor]

Article on ESPN about top paid coaches. Jeff Brohm at Purdue is making 6.6m a year. Sounds excessive. He must have gotten a massive extension when Tenn and Louisville were going after him.

 

[Biff Tannen]

Dude, you have a hard on for Wisconsin hate. They have the 12th winningest program in college football since 2000 (and that includes Boise St and App. St.). Better than Texas, FL, Miami, Auburn, ND, Mich. Mich St., and Penn St. They are a perennial power, but they don't get the level of recruits that Bama, Oh St., Clemson, LSU get. Georgia does, but they still can't compete for a national championship.

Just when I thought I went to the national championship game and Georgia was in it you destroy my memories. Congrats on racking up wins in the B1G West or legends owr whatever its called.

 

[PhDeac]

Feels like it was your expectation that all 3 can be top programs at the same time. Hasn't been the case in 20+ years. And even back then, there were issues with them taking recruits from each other (and power shifts).

When I look back at it, the timing of Miami's decline was when they left the Big East and joined the ACC in 2004. I wonder if there is any validity to an argument that their struggles can be traced back to actually having to compete w/ FSU as a part of the same conference?

As far as all 3 FL programs being great again... If Miami and FSU would hire elite coaches, I think that would work out just fine. You'd probably see some other schools get pushed down... Auburn, UGA, maybe even Clemson. But I think it is more that Miami is just fooked. Could certainly make an argument that UCF is in a better place than Miami right now... And that it might not change.

I still think the "State" argument is foolish.

But it is OK that we disagree on this stuff... I don't think there is any way to prove these things. I guess I could say "GOTCHA" when Texas and USC are playing in the National Championship in a few years (w/ UF and FSU also in the playoff), but we won't remember (or care).

It's not my expectation. I'm the one arguing it's not realistic. It's the expectation of the college football landscape that gets really excited at any glimpse of promise by any of those teams.

 

[tigerswood]

He cited health concerns as why he couldn't coach and then he went to Ohio State and continued to be an awesome coach.

He's also probably a dick.

But sure, I love that he did so well at UF. Of course I do. I'm just jealous that he thought we weren't good enough for him anymore. It's depressing feeling that way... Especially as I sit here in these jorts. Thankfully, Dan Mullen is here now to keep me warm at night.

Well he took a full season off, due to a cyst on his brain and having a bunch of panic attacks/health scares because of the stress at UF - partly self-induced for sure. Certainly, no one knew that tattoo-gate was goign to happen at OSU and Tressell was going to get fired. The dude was already a legend.

I hated Meyer at Florida and can certainly see why most hate him - he's ridiculously intense, comes across as sleazy at times, and also rarely loses. I was surprised how clean a program he seemed to run at OSU (very few arrests, NCAA issues, etc), but actually underwhelmed at his game prep/in-game coaching quite a bit.

If Ryan Day can keep up Meyer's recruiting level (probably doubtful), I think he could be an even better coach long-term. I also think if he crashes and burns, Meyer could come back to OSU as the savior one day.

 

[DeacsATS]

It's not my expectation. I'm the one arguing it's not realistic. It's the expectation of the college football landscape that gets really excited at any glimpse of promise by any of those teams.

I think a lot of the "college football landscape" is guys like us (and older) in the media that get nostalgic for The U or Notre Dame (or even a program like Nebraska) and want to see them get back to their glory days. ESPN eats that shit up. We're starting to see it w/ SMU's strong start... I imagine we'll hear a lot more about "The Pony Express" over the next few weeks.

The whole "college football is better when XXX is good" argument.

Applies to most sports, I think.

"The NFL is better when XXX is competing for Super Bowls" - Insert Cowboys, Steelers, Packers, etc