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US Airstrikes Hit a Doctors Without Borders Hospital

MysteryMen said:
1. Why are we still doing airstrikes in Afghanistan? There is nobody there that is a threat to us

2. Why is the U.S. military putting out there that Afghan forces requested the strike there as if that is a defense? You still have the obligation to do some due diligence on where you're dropping your bombs
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1. Taliban made a major offensive on Kunduz last week. US and NATO offering air support through next year.
 
I doubt this is the first or last hospital the US has bombed. DWB just has a better brand than most.
 
Wrangor said:
You don't turn down the Nobel Peace Prize. Sorry, but that is ridiculous. There is no way he deserved to win it, but that isn't his fault.

It will be interesting to observe what (if any) the political fallout is from this. If it is true that we bombed a hospital, we better have some good intel for it. If it was an accident it is going to turn (or at least it should) turn into a complete mess for the administration. If Rand Paul can't seize the momentum from this then I don't know if he ever will. It is a picture perfect opportunity for him (and for Bernie Sanders) to gain momentum.
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To gain momentum against who? Obama isn't running. Hillary isn't Sec of State.
 
Hillary is more of a war hawk. So is Jeb and trump. Would make sense to me the candidates that were more conservative on using troops gathered a political bump.
 
Wrangor said:
Hillary wants you to believe she is more of a war hawk when being a hawk will get her more power. The minute it won't, she will want you to believe she is more of a dove. If being a left-handed plumber with a Yankee hat and a wifebeater and a lifetime member of the IPTAY club would get Hillary more power, she would be that. She is whatever you want her to be. Just say so.
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FIFY. She might be the next politician we deserve (the last one fit that bill). One day we will remember who solves problem and how they are solved. Until then, MOAR BIG GOVERNMENT PLEESE.
 
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jhmd2000 said:
FIFY. She might be the next politician we deserve (the last one fit that bill). One day we will remember who solves problem and how they are solved. Until then, MOAR BIG GOVERNMENT PLEESE.
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Exactly! We should just go ahead and hand over control of the Chapel Hill Town Board to Raleigh.
 
I'm a big fan of Obama but in no way did he deserve the Nobel Peace prize. At least he recognized that fact and put the money to good use.

"Compared to some of the giants of history who've received this prize -- Schweitzer and King; Marshall and Mandela -- my accomplishments are slight. And then there are the men and women around the world who have been jailed and beaten in the pursuit of justice; those who toil in humanitarian organizations to relieve suffering; the unrecognized millions whose quiet acts of courage and compassion inspire even the most hardened cynics. I cannot argue with those who find these men and women -- some known, some obscure to all but those they help -- to be far more deserving of this honor than I."

I kind of think current Obama might be in need of reading the rest of the speech again... In hindsight it's pretty interesting to give a peace prize to the leader of a country instigating wars on two foreign fronts and for the recipient to spend most of his speech addressing that contradiction.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/remarks-president-acceptance-nobel-peace-prize

(For a fun exercise, righties can read that in Reagan's voice.... Then imagine it being delivered by Trump...)
 
WFFaithful said:
1. Taliban made a major offensive on Kunduz last week. US and NATO offering air support through next year.
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I genuinely don't know the answer, but why do we still care about the Taliban? I was under the impression that Al-Qaeda in Afghanistan was pretty much dead and that the Taliban's sheltering of Al-Qaeda was the reason why we attacked them
 
Wrangor said:
Obama got it because he was the first black president. I don't blame him for accepting it. I wouldn't have turned it down either.
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Obama being African-American was incidental and not integral. If he had beaten Bush the Elder because of Perot and a bad economy, like Clinton did, he's not even in the discussion for a Nobel. But after 8 years of a cowboy neocon foreign policy, the rest of the world was only too happy to give it to Obama as a repudiation of and thumbing their nose at Bush Light. You forget too easily how much W was despised outside of sub-Saharan Africa.
 
Sorry Cville...I disagree. Obama had literally done NOTHING to be deserving of the nobel peace prize. It was given to him because of the tidal wave of his election and being the first black president. Not saying this out of spite or as a negative, just the reality of the situation. It wasn't his fault for getting the award while not deserving it, and I think he handled it about as well as you could possibly expect.
 
Also

'Drones without Borders'

Tagger, please out yourself for posrep.
 
Wrangor said:
Sorry Cville...I disagree. Obama had literally done NOTHING to be deserving of the nobel peace prize. It was given to him because of the tidal wave of his election and being the first black president. Not saying this out of spite or as a negative, just the reality of the situation. It wasn't his fault for getting the award while not deserving it, and I think he handled it about as well as you could possibly expect.
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Nobody here is arguing he did anything to merit the award. I am positing that the reason he won it was the rest of the 1st world was ecstatic at the change to Obama from W. And what is this tidal wave? Obama had like 320-330 EVs. Clinton, Bush the Elder, Reagan, Nixon, Johnson and Eisenhower all won by much larger margins. Do you honestly believe Obama would have won a nobel for nothing had he succeeded Eisenhower, Ford, Reagan or Bush the Elder with that many EVs just because he's black? Talk to anyone from South America, Europe and most of Asia excluding the Saudi royal family, and W was reviled. At most, Obama being African-American to boot was the icing on the cake, but W already baked that cake.
 
Agree to disagree :). He won the election because he wasn't Bush (of course this was before his foreign policy actually looked a lot like Bush). He won the peace prize because he was the first African American President of the USA.
 
So I went ahead and went to the Nobel Prize website and here's what they had to say on the matter.

The Norwegian Nobel Committee has decided that the Nobel Peace Prize for 2009 is to be awarded to President Barack Obama for his extraordinary efforts to strengthen international diplomacy and cooperation between peoples. The Committee has attached special importance to Obama's vision of and work for a world without nuclear weapons.

Obama has as President created a new climate in international politics. Multilateral diplomacy has regained a central position, with emphasis on the role that the United Nations and other international institutions can play. Dialogue and negotiations are preferred as instruments for resolving even the most difficult international conflicts. The vision of a world free from nuclear arms has powerfully stimulated disarmament and arms control negotiations. Thanks to Obama's initiative, the USA is now playing a more constructive role in meeting the great climatic challenges the world is confronting. Democracy and human rights are to be strengthened.

Only very rarely has a person to the same extent as Obama captured the world's attention and given its people hope for a better future. His diplomacy is founded in the concept that those who are to lead the world must do so on the basis of values and attitudes that are shared by the majority of the world's population.

For 108 years, the Norwegian Nobel Committee has sought to stimulate precisely that international policy and those attitudes for which Obama is now the world's leading spokesman. The Committee endorses Obama's appeal that "Now is the time for all of us to take our share of responsibility for a global response to global challenges."
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I don't see anything in there about him being black, but maybe I'm not squinting hard enough.
 
Deacon923 said:
So I went ahead and went to the Nobel Prize website and here's what they had to say on the matter.



I don't see anything in there about him being black, but maybe I'm not squinting hard enough.
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Of course. I am shocked they didn't say. "Obama won the Nobel Peace Prize because he is the first black president". #density

Lets evaluate the Nobel Peace Prizes statement and look for ACTUAL evidence of their claims.

1. Extraordinary efforts to strengthen international diplomacy and cooperation between peoples.
2. Special importance is attached to Obama's vision of and work for a world without nuclear weapons
3. Obama has created a new climate in international politics
4. Multinational diplomacy has regained a central poisition with emphasis on the role that the UN and other international institutions can play.
5. Thanks for Obama's initiative, the USA is no playing a more constructive role in meeting the great climatic challenges the world is confronting
6. Democracy and human rights are to be strengthened.
7. Captured the world's attention and given its people hope for a better future.

Now please realize that Obama was nominated for the Nobel Peace Prize a mere 12 days after taking his oath of office. Let me repeat that.

Obama had been president for 12 days.

12 days.

Now how in the world did President Obama accomplish the above 7 items in his 12 days of office? Answer? He didn't. He was nominated for being a transcendent political figure. What is the MOST important thing Obama will be remembered for in this history of this nation and the world? He was our first black president. I don't say that as a criticism. It will be the same when our first woman is president. It is one of those critical points in the history of our country. It was an incredible time. But he was not nominated and did not win the Peace Prize because of the listed reasons above. He was nominated and won the prize because he was our first black president. Not recognizing that is just willful ignorance.
 
was this thing about the nobel all the rage in some far-right wing circles that Wrangor was reading in 2008? Cause I think I remember that time pretty clearly and I don't think I ever heard that angle before two days ago. Like, ever, from anyone. The award was rightly and roundly panned because it was for potential (mostly unfulfilled) not accomplishments. That potential was supposedly to stop the US from being a unilateral invader, torturer, and imprisoner and start being a force for peace. It's the Nobel Peace Prize, not the Nobel First American To Do Something Prize. WTF.

Out of curiosity, I googled "did Obama win the nobel peace prize because he is black?" All the hits on the first page were from the comments section of MSM sites (you can guess how that went) and some ... questionable websites.
 
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