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Wake @ UNC Game Thread

Dino won a game in the post season, just for the record.

One game, but still. A win.
 
Well, there's one redeeming thing about tonight:

1149367.jpg


We have this now.
 
TBR said:
Should we have won that game? Yes. Was it a 100% guaranteed win with a different coach as certain people have suggested? Certainly not. Upsets happen in the tournament every year. That's why they call it March Madness. The next year a Kansas team with more talent than the '09 Wake team got knocked out in the second round by Northern Iowa. No one doubted Self's credentials as one of the very best coaches in the country because of that one loss. We should have won, and we certainly shouldn't have lost the way we did, but that Cleveland State team was better than people realized (not as good as N. Iowa though). They were on a really nice roll going into the tournament. Two losses in the previous 14. I have said all this to say that I refuse to define a coach's tenure by a single game, just as a refuse to define [Redacted]'s tenure by a single one of the massive blowouts we suffered or by his one notable win.

Dino was not a great coach yet his results were indisputably better than what we have had under [Redacted]. Gaudio's lack of success in the post season (as defined by a 0-5 post season record, not one 84-69 loss to Cleveland State) made it the correct call to fire him, but it also does nothing to change the fact that [Redacted] has been a miserable failure, and I would trade him for Gaudio in a heartbeat.
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Just to be clear, Dino's post season record at Wake was 1-5...
 
Yeah, sure. Those of us that lived through the Bob Staak years thought getting humiliated by KY and Butler was ok since at least we were in the NCAAT.

Now you tell me the loss to Clev. St. was ok based on what is happening now.

Oooooookkkkkaaaay.
 
Deac83 said:
But this makes losing to Clev St in the 1st round after being #1 earlier in the year ok?
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This makes a rhetorical question necessary?

You can stay mad forever, but our program was better off with Gaudio than [Redacted]. Anyone disputing that now is a stubborn fool.
 
Deac83 said:
Yeah, sure. Those of us that lived through the Bob Staak years thought getting humiliated by KY and Butler was ok since at least we were in the NCAAT.

Now you tell me the loss to Clev. St. was ok based on what is happening now.

Oooooookkkkkaaaay.
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No, I said it was okay because that's what happens in the tournament. The consistency of postseason failure was the issue, not that one incidence of failure.

But you keep shilling for [Redacted] based on the notion that Gaudio wasn't a very good coach. Newsflash: every indication is that [Redacted] is a much, much worse coach. He has failed at virtually every facet of his job. He's a bad game coach, a bad practice coach, a mediocre recruiter, and a terrible representative of our university.
 
TBR said:
Should we have won that game? Yes. Was it a 100% guaranteed win with a different coach as certain people have suggested? Certainly not. Upsets happen in the tournament every year. That's why they call it March Madness. The next year a Kansas team with more talent than the '09 Wake team got knocked out in the second round by Northern Iowa. No one doubted Self's credentials as one of the very best coaches in the country because of that one loss. We should have won, and we certainly shouldn't have lost the way we did, but that Cleveland State team was better than people realized (not as good as N. Iowa though). They were on a really nice roll going into the tournament. Two losses in the previous 14. I have said all this to say that I refuse to define a coach's tenure by a single game, just as I refuse to define [Redacted]'s tenure by a single one of the massive blowouts we suffered or by his one notable win.

Dino was not a great coach yet his results were indisputably better than what we have had under [Redacted]. Gaudio's lack of success in the post season (as defined by a 1-5 post season record, not one 84-69 loss to Cleveland State) made it the correct call to fire him, but it also does nothing to change the fact that [Redacted] has been a miserable failure, and I would trade him for Gaudio in a heartbeat.
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The 'funny' part of this, is that our loss to Clev St. was like how Bzz's teams play on the road. It's one thing to be uspset by a 14 seed, it totally another thing to get blown out by the 14 seed. IIRC we were never in the game, to a 14 seed, even if they were better than a 14 seed, we should have shown up.

IMO, getting blown out by a 14 seed is unacceptable and what is going on today with Bzz is unacceptable. Being terrible now does not make wasting talent and opportunities ok.
 
Deac83 said:
The 'funny' part of this, is that our loss to Clev St. was like how Bzz's teams play on the road. It's one thing to be uspset by a 14 seed, it totally another thing to get blown out by the 14 seed. IIRC we were never in the game, to a 14 seed, even if they were better than a 14 seed, we should have shown up.

IMO, getting blown out by a 14 seed is unacceptable and what is going on today with Bzz is unacceptable. Being terrible now does not make wasting talent and opportunities ok.
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It happens: http://scores.espn.go.com/ncb/recap?gameId=300770046
 
TBR said:
It happens: http://scores.espn.go.com/ncb/recap?gameId=300770046
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First off, I know Dino was not fired for one NCAAT loss, it was that loss and a few 1st round ACCT blow outs as well.

Dino was better than Bzz but at the same tie Dino was not good enough. Getting rid of Dino was the correct decision, hiring Bzz was the incorrect decision. The second did not have to follow the first.

Sure there are big upsets, the difference from the Wake Forest perspective is our NCAAT ceiling has been a lot lower, so after we make some final 4's or even final 8's losing to a 14 seed, while terrible, will not have pissed away one of our best opportunities to advance deep into the tourney.
 
Deac83 said:
First off, I know Dino was not fired for one NCAAT loss, it was that loss and a few 1st round ACCT blow outs as well.

Dino was better than Bzz but at the same tie Dino was not good enough. Getting rid of Dino was the correct decision, hiring Bzz was the incorrect decision. The second did not have to follow the first.

Sure there are big upsets, the difference from the Wake Forest perspective is our NCAAT ceiling has been a lot lower, so after we make some final 4's or even final 8's losing to a 14 seed, while terrible, will not have pissed away one of our best opportunities to advance deep into the tourney.
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You're the one obsessing over one loss. I am looking at cumulative records and concluding that Gaudio wasn't a good coach and that [Redacted] is an absolutely awful one.

At the time, I wanted Gaudio to be fired. I also think that Gaudio was a much better coach and program leader than [Redacted] and that, forced with the choice between the two, Gaudio was the obvious choice (and, based on the unrealistic nature of all but two of the candidates rumored to be on Wellman's short list, that's effectively the choice Wellman faced). These are not contradictory thoughts.
 
Deac83 said:
The 'funny' part of this, is that our loss to Clev St. was like how Bzz's teams play on the road. It's one thing to be uspset by a 14 seed, it totally another thing to get blown out by the 14 seed. IIRC we were never in the game, to a 14 seed, even if they were better than a 14 seed, we should have shown up.

IMO, getting blown out by a 14 seed is unacceptable and what is going on today with Bzz is unacceptable. Being terrible now does not make wasting talent and opportunities ok.
Click to expand...

Wake/CSU was a 4/13 game.
 
not only that, but CSU finished the season #60 in kp and we finished #25. just a hunch, but i'd guess a match-up between #25 and #60 on a neutral court would predict #25 to win probably somewhere between 65% and 75% of the time. it's not like it was a 16-1 match-up where you'd expect the #1 to win 98+% of the time. in fact #26 georgetown is predicted to win @ #61 villanova exactly 50% of the time this season.

obligatory, this is not to defend gaudio as i think he was an average to below average coach. just that focusing on one game is stupid beyond belief. not exactly surprising from ocho-tres.
 
“I believe the score was 32-26 at one time,” said Wake coach Jeff [Redacted], referring to the score just before UNC began that run, “and we had the ball on a break. And I believe we turned it over. We can’t just give teams that many more possessions and that many easy points on turnovers.”

You got to love when your coach views being down 6 points in the first half as a point where things were going good.
 
daaberry said:
“I believe the score was 32-26 at one time,” said Wake coach Jeff [Redacted], referring to the score just before UNC began that run, “and we had the ball on a break. And I believe we turned it over. We can’t just give teams that many more possessions and that many easy points on turnovers.”

You got to love when your coach views being down 6 points in the first half as a point where things were going good.
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Yeah, but if we hadn't turned it over, we could have been down four, maybe three.
 
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